35 Comments on “Minahasa Nationalism”

1. O. Bule Says:
   October 19th, 2006 at 10:13 pm

   What a shame. Indonesia is coming apart at the seams.

   O. Bule

2. Tomaculum Says:
   October 20th, 2006 at 2:23 am

   Next year the Dayaks will claim their independency from Indonesia, then the Bataks, further the Balinese and so on, and so on.
   If I visit my relatives and friends, then I have to request for visa for Republik Jawa Timur Merdeka, Negara Jayakarta Berjaya, Kesultanan Yogyakarta, Negara Bahari Semarang, Negara Padjadjaran Beriman etc., etc. What a nice vision. And all over those countries UNO troops will be positioned, from Australia, Japan, Malaysia etc.
   Maybe it will be peace finally out there and the “normal” people can live without fear and with enough to eat. Then why not?

3. Fanglong Says:
   October 20th, 2006 at 11:22 pm

   I wonder why a State the motto of which is University in Diversity cannot (could not) insure
   “1. Freedom from discrimination (against minorities).
   2. Freedom from economic inequality and exploitation.
   3. Freedom from restrictions on religious worship.”
   to its people…
   It can, provided that real democracy succeeds against the military-industrial lobby. If might-be ministers & presidents knew how boring, corrupTING and restricted power is, they’d try not to create new states or nations…

   Wassalam !

   And thank you Patung for all these subjects of reflection.

4. Bradlymail Says:
   October 22nd, 2006 at 8:03 am

   Indonesia could be like Russia, more provinces seek independence, because of infairness, discrimination towards them.

5. Tomaculum Says:
   October 23rd, 2006 at 2:22 am

   Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan etc., etc: the succesion totalitarian regimes without law or social justice.
   Better situation?
   What a sad world.

6. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
   October 23rd, 2006 at 1:28 pm

   I hope Minahasa will be awarded like Nobel Peace prize, if they secede from Indonesia. Minahasa may achieve their safetiness against imperialist Islamic groups in Indonesia like Jemaah Islamiya, FPI, NUI, NU, etc.

7. Quazi Says:
   October 23rd, 2006 at 1:31 pm

   Indonesia’s future has always hinged on what its foundation as a national entity is. Islamist movements in southern Sulawesi, Java, Madura, Aceh, and other regions of Sumatra seem to be unaware of that fact while Muslims constitute 87% of the population, they only form significant majorities in about 2/3 of Indonesia’s territory. The notable regions that don’t fall under this Islamist unbrella are Bali, North Sulawesi, Maluku, East Nusa Tenggara, West Irian Jaya, and Papua. Leaders from both Bali and North SulawesI have already stated that if there is not religious justice on a national scale then they have no interest in remaining within the Indonesian Republic. Western Indonesians may think they could easily crush these independence movements, but its important to remember that they were unable to pacify East Timor, and it took nearly two decades to reach a peace agreement in Aceh. A flare-up of separatist violence in multiple eastern provinces would be a disaster and lead to the eventual fragmentation of the Indonesian nation-state.

   Thankfully, this doesn’t have to happen. Most non-Muslims living in the country do indeed want to remain part of Indonesia. The ball is, as they say, in the government’s court. They can begin to universally enforce the law among all religions; Muslim terrorists and murderers can be brought to justice just the same as their Christian counterparts. Shariah-based regency laws can be outlawed by the House of Representatives. Christians in Muslim-majority regions can be granted the same freedoms that Muslims in Christian-majority regions currently enjoy (the freedom to practice their religion, prosyletize, and build new houses of worship). There can be a bright future for the unitary republic of Indonesia. On the other hand, attempts at Islamization will lead to its eventual fragmentation.

8. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
   October 26th, 2006 at 2:07 pm

   All of these comment are the most excellent in the whole universe forever. These comments really wins. This is the reality, the reality is many Indonesians regoins and provinces will seek independence from suck Indonesian Republic because of the Islamic-Arab imperialist which replace white colonizers to Southeast Asia during 1700’s to 1800’s. Independence of many Indonesian region, like Minahasa from hell Republic of Indonesia is the excellent way to prevent Islamic imperialism and Islamic imperialiasm will downfall.

   If Islamic imperialism continues in Indonesia, almost every province and region in Indonesia will be the same as Timor-Leste!

   Remember, Minahas is the Republic of Singapore, while hell Republic of Indonesia is the federal states of Malaysia! That’s the most truth in the whole universe forever!

9. Hassan Says:
   October 27th, 2006 at 10:06 pm

   wow, what an interesting fairytale! shucks, it’s three o’clock already.

   cuckoo…cuckoo…cuckoo….!

10. Andrew Says:
    October 27th, 2006 at 10:10 pm

    Reality for one is fairytale for others. Welcome to the real world.

11. Oigal Says:
    October 28th, 2006 at 10:12 am

    How long before the rest of the provinces tire of the Javanese colonialism and exploitation?

12. Czeslaw Says:
    October 29th, 2006 at 5:30 am

    Just a comment:

    I do not think that there is problem with Indonesian people. They are wonderful people, I met several of them, and I am happy that I had a privilege to meet such a nice people. They were non Muslims too, as they said.

    I believe, that Indonesia will become to weak after states and provinces will try to break away from the Islamic regime of Indonesia. It is not the Indonesian fault, it is not Indonesian peoples’ fault. You have to face the reality that you are under the Islamic rule, and Islamic sward. That is the problem.

    Similar situation is in Palestine. Are Jews as bad as Islamist are saying? Are Palestinians bad? I don’t think so.

    Like I said, get the Islam out of the middle east and give Palestinians a chance to have normal lives. Similar may prove for Indonesian situation. I believe that the Islam is the problem, and not Indonesian people. So, stick together, as a big unit you have chance, when Islam will split you a part, you will loose to Islam any way.

    Organize your selves better, in a larger and more organized states. Be more stronger as a consolidated units, rather than separated small principalities. There are many advantages to be one bigger, stronger and more organized country. There are economical and military principals in this, not much space here to write and talk about it. But build a bigger and better, more organized states, country, rather than splitting off.

    Maybe radicalism need to be fight with radicalism on opposite side. Keep all options on the table. Sometimes, fire need to be take out with bigger and more explosive fire, as in case of extinguishing high pressure high condensation fires, which are extinguish with the detonations of a greater power. This technic is used all the time in extinguishing crude oil hole bursts and fires. A lots of use like this in military.

    Quazi, you are right on many points. I wonder why no one is trying to diagnose the illness, before prescribing a medicine. It is foolish, to give some one a medication, without knowing or acknowledge the illness.

    The system is under Islamic fist and Islamic sward. Wherever Indonesian person will split, the Islam is just next door. The next day, Islam will be again a problem in Indonesia. And this is the problem, and splitting from Indonesia. Splitting may prove not the solution one may expect.

    Maybe Indonesia needs to find some one like Mahatma Chandi within Indonesian people? That would a be a dream come through.

    As long as yo have Islam there, you will be doomed”¦.

    Never forget sacrifice of Mr. Tibo. Mr. DaSilva and Mr Riwu. It will happen to you all, if Islam will stay as is in Indonesia.

13. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
    October 30th, 2006 at 2:38 pm

    Because Islam in Indonesia is the purest kind of evil in Earth, today.

14. Edward Farel Says:
    November 3rd, 2006 at 5:47 pm

    my names is Farel Edward MENGKO. Mengko is my family names. its come from Remboken, Minahasa, Manado, North Sulawesi, Indonesia. I am an Minahasanese. I agree if North Sulawesi is free! but please dont forget that I am a Muslim. I hate NU, FPI, MUHAMADIYAH and so on and so on. I love North Sulawesi very much but I love Indonesia more.

15. Bradlymail Says:
    November 3rd, 2006 at 8:55 pm

    Farel you hate NU, FPI, MUHAMADIYAH but Osama laden is your hero, there’s nothing difference…bullsh*t!

16. Andrew Says:
    November 4th, 2006 at 1:34 am

    Edward Farel, you have too much hatred in your heart.

    Not good for your health.

17. Peace Says:
    November 4th, 2006 at 7:54 am

    I’m sure the majority of Minahasa people prefer to be in unity with Indonesia.

18. Bradlymail Says:
    November 4th, 2006 at 12:18 pm

    Peace glad to hear that Minahasa people want to be a part of Indonesia or just a hearsay?

19. Peace Says:
    November 4th, 2006 at 2:06 pm

    It’s from some ceyanang in the kampoeng of Minahasa back there

    Well…hopefully it’s not just a hearsay.
    I wish Indonesia could stay as one but of course in harmony too, unlike now.
    This country is very nice, but some of its people are certainly not.

20. farel Says:
    November 4th, 2006 at 4:11 pm

    Thanks for your attention Andrew. Thats very kinds of you but I dont know whats happened to Bradlymail. Is he crazy or what!?.

    Mr. Peace, I agree with you, there’s so much love in MANADO. I knew it because I’ve been there before. What about you Andrew? Do you know anything about NORTH SULAWESI?

21. Bradlymail Says:
    November 5th, 2006 at 8:24 am

    farel the way you talked something liked twist and turn. Once you said that you came from Menado, north Sulawesi??? Now you wanted to know anything about North Sulawesi from Andrew…!%$#@!)(?

22. Hassan Says:
    November 7th, 2006 at 11:14 pm

    Karlira Kanakahuko: “Because Islam in Indonesia is the purest kind of evil in Earth, today.”

    hence, the part where i do not believe you’re a Muslim from saudi Arabia. a saudi Arabian Muslim won’t say those things.

23. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
    November 8th, 2006 at 1:17 pm

    Hey Hassan, for your information, I’m a rebellious woman against men’s oppression from my country. That why I do this coz I don’t like Indonesia, especially Indonesian women to be like my country. You are very hypocrite!
    Why Shia and Sunnis are hating each other? I’m not not by religion, but because of only your imperial interest. You, Muslim are synonymous with Americans. For your information, I really hate Americans, but I really hate also Muslims who are imperialist and premanist!

24. Czeslaw Says:
    November 8th, 2006 at 2:27 pm

    Karlira Kanakahuk
    hate is the biggest self punishment. Think of it for a moment, please.

    That is why Islam is in so much turm oil in last few decades. Please do not follow that lost path.

    I am not sure that by screemening hate, it will bring peace and listeners to your comments.

    I am not sure that Americans are like Muslims. I wonder what makes your toughts that way?

    But, whatever you say, and think, that is your birth given right!

25. Edward Farel Says:
    November 8th, 2006 at 3:04 pm

    Dear Hassan my bro,
    I think KARLIRA is from Indonesia. I just found out it from the words she typed (premanism). Remember bro, the truth is come ONLY from Allah. not from human kind. just to let U know bro, SADAM HUSSEIN and OSAMA BIN LADEN are the greatest man in the century. next one is AHMEDDINEJAD, I hope!

26. Hassan Says:
    November 8th, 2006 at 9:28 pm

    Karlira Kanakahuko: yeah, and I’m pope benedict from the vatican. I believe you dude! LOL!

    now, admit it, you’re an Indonesian Islam hater. you can’t fool anyone with that tone.

    czeslaw: you can spare the sermon, as karlira kanakahuko is most likely an Islam hater like yourself.

    you’re a pastor aren’t you? and the only book you ever read is the bible. you studied Islam in you inter faith seminary, and your church ordered you to spread hate. that’s your true color.

27. Andrew Says:
    November 8th, 2006 at 10:42 pm

    Edward Farel: I’ve never been to North Sulawesi, but I do have quite a few buddies from the area.

    Hassan: “i do not believe you’re a Muslim from saudi Arabia. a saudi Arabian Muslim won’t say those things.” > what is this supposed to mean; are you implying that they are all kind, polite, courteous people? another generalization that noone will buy.

28. Czeslaw Says:
    November 9th, 2006 at 8:35 am

    EDWARD FAREL

    with people like you and Mr Hassan,

    we, the rest, must say good bye to peace, understanding and co-existence

    Mr Hassan, your words:

    czeslaw: you can spare the sermon, as karlira kanakahuko is most likely an Islam hater like yourself. you’re a pastor aren’t you? and the only book you ever read is the bible. you studied Islam in you inter faith seminary, and your church ordered you to spread hate. that’s your true color.

    A small correction to your grammatical miss-hap, Mr Hassan, you wrote: “..and the only book you ever read is the bible…”
    The proper way shall be, “and the only book you ever red, was the bible…”

    Definitely, koran may be good book to start with, but there are other books on the subject of Islam as well.

    - No, I am not a religious person. I am Economist-Statistician-Accountant by trade and schooling. Sorry, Mr Hassan.

    - I read a new book every other month, or so. So, I am sorry, I let you down again.

    - No, I did not studied Islam in any seminary. I never have been in any seminary. Sorry to disappoint your again.

    - I do not represent any church, when I do voice my opinions. My opinions are only my opinions. A voice of a lone person.

    - About 12 years ago, I thought, that God lost me, or I lost God. So, I went on the journey to find the God. I had to leave religion realms and influences, to avoid any religion influence, in order to get a clear picture of the matter. I am analytical by trade, so this is the way my mind works.

    Definitively, people like you Mr Hassan, and your bro Mr Farrel, are steering people like me off in the search for the answers, away from true Islam, which I would doubt that you, or your bro Mr Farrel, have and posses any knowledge of Islam as a religion.

    Hate is the biggest self punishment, and both of you are on the receiving end of it right now.

29. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
    November 15th, 2006 at 2:22 pm

    I aggree with tumaculum, many Indonesian regions and provinces separated as became other nations, becuase of Indonesia’s inequality, discriminationa against non-Muslims and most of all, Indonesia’s being one of the most corrupt country in the world and the Islamic-Arab imperialism in Indonesia.

30. Hassan Says:
    November 15th, 2006 at 11:02 pm

    czeslaw: on the contrary, I had never hated anyone from a different religion. I only hated bigots and self righteous fascists like you!

    andrew: nope, I was just saying that saudi Arabian women doesn’t speak like Karlira Kanakahuko. as in you doesn’t speak like pakistani for instance, or i don’t speak like a pastor. no generalizing intended there, just analysis.

31. Czeslaw Says:
    November 16th, 2006 at 12:45 am

    Mr Hassan, one day your type of Islam may emerge from the 12th century darknes.

    I hope you still be around

32. Karlira Kanakahuko Says:
    November 16th, 2006 at 1:23 pm

    Like me, Indonesian women,even Muslims are very vigilant against men’s oppression like from Sharia law. Why Indonesian women are against anti-pornography law? It is because Indonesian women are very broad-minded, unlike women in the Middle East and South Asia.

33. Joseph Erwin Says:
    February 16th, 2007 at 4:59 am

    My dear friends,

    Here I am hoping you will not hate me because I was born in America and because I grew up in a religion that claimed that it was the only correct one. I think of myself as a citizen of the world, but it does not surprise me to learn that some people hate all Americans. The policies of my country sometimes promote such hatred, mostly by being poorly informed and misunderstanding people from other nations and other cultures. There are many Christian people in America who wish to claim that America is “a Christian nation,” but they are wrong–and sadly, those who promote this idea are among the most ignorant of other cultures. The most extreme of these promote a kind of religious imperialism, and sadly, some political elements in our country–notably some of the wealthiest and most powerful–exploit the voting of the most ignorant in order to gain and maintain power. They seek to enrich themselves and their elite supporters through fostering international paranoia and waging war in ways that only drive people farther into hopeless anger and hatred. Some of my fellow Americans and I should not be the targets of hatred, but I can understand why this happens, when the policies of our country promote hatred. Now, for Indonesia, it is very sad to see fragmentation. I understand some of the reasons. The balance is delicate. The power from some areas over others has been excessive. I have been many times in all parts of Sulawesi Utara, especially Minahasa, but also other parts of Sulawesi (Sulawesi Tengah, and Sulawesi Selatan–even in what is now Sulawesi Barat). Also in what is now Papua (Irian Jaya, when I was there a few times) and to some locations in Maluku (Ternate, Ambon, etc.). I was nearly always treated well and with respect by people I met–only a few exceptions, where young men looked at me and thought I represented something they hated, that I was “untrue” “false” “infidel.”

    I do not ask anyone to tolerate the intolerable, but responding to hatefulness with stereotyped hatred is not a positive choice. Let us all try to find ways of creating progress and cohesion and harmony. If we focus our energy and talent and effort on constructive and progressive policies, we can overcome those who choose to hate for a living. I understand that patience wears thin, but there is not really an acceptable alternative to the use of our brains to find ways of peaceful harmony in the real and present world. Let us, among other things, draw energy and ideas across international boundaries.

    Your friend,

    Joe

34. touminahasa Says:
    June 17th, 2008 at 3:11 am

    INDONESIA = ISLAMISASI = JAVANISASI, sad to say that it’s happened in a country claimed to be proud of multiculture and multiethnic. but the javanese people and the moslem are indeed the aggressor of our(MINAHASAN) culture, social, economic. OTDA/OTSUS is not enough. we should had been joined the ducth instead of NKRI.

    NKRI sucks! FREE MINAHASA RAYA, I YAYAT U SANTI, PAKATUAN WO PAKALAWIREN, God Almighty bless minasahan!

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