Tibo Execution

Aug 11th, 2006, in IM Posts, by

Cornelius Fabianus Tibo, Dominggus da Silva, and Marinus Riwu are due to be executed fifteen minutes after midnight, Saturday 12th August.

Click for Latest News on Tibo.

Fabianus Tibo (60), Dominggus da Silva (39), and Marinus Riwu (48), who are Catholics, were convicted in 2001 of being involved in the killings of 122 Muslims and the burning down of 4 houses during sectarian fighting in central Sulawesi between May and July, 2000. Since 2001 various attempts at gaining clemency and case reviews have failed.

Cornelius Fabianus Tibo
Cornelius Fabianus Tibo.

On the 9th the Attorney General's office sent notice of the planned execution to the families of the men, as well as to the condemned men themselves. Both the men and their families refused to sign the notices.

The men have made three final requests. 1. That their bodies be taken to the Santa Maria church in Palu for requiem mass. 2. That they later be buried at the Beteleme cemetery in Morowali, central Sulawesi, while one of the men, Dominggus, asked to be buried in his native Flores, in East Nusa Tenggara. 3. That they be accompanied at the execution by Pastor Joseph Suwathan, Pastor Jemy Tumbelaka, Pastor Melky Taroro, and Roy Rening, head of their legal team.

Recently an amnesty was declared for those involved in the violence that racked the towns of Poso and Palu in central Sulawesi between 1998 and 2000, but, as Father Rinaldy Damanik, the head of the Majelis Sinode Gereja Kristen Sulawesi Tengah (GKST), explains:

If Tibo is executed then just who will the amnesty be given to? Why are Tibo, & co. not included in discussions of granting amnesty?
(Kalau Tibo dieksekusi, lantas kepada siapa saja amnesti itu akan diberikan. Kenapa Tibo dan kawan-kawan sama sekali tidak dimasukkan dalam pembicaraan pemberian amnesti itu.)

Brigadier General Oegroseno, head of central Sulawesi police, said on the 9th that he had already prepared the firing squad for the execution, comprised of officers from the Mobile Brigade. They have "training" for the execution for several months, he said.

Since the news was announced various pleas have again been made for a postponement of the execution or its cancellation. Demonstrations have also occurred in towns in the area and in the mens' native province of East Nusa Tenggara.

The Governor of East Nusa Tenggara, Piet Tallo, said he hoped the government would be fair in weighing all the factors and would not cause Tibo & co. to become victims. Whatever the result he asked that people in his province accept things calmly.

The lawyer for the three men, Alamsyah Hanafiah, complained that their execution would cause the knowledge of what happened in Poso in 2000 to be lost forever. 16 men who had been named by Tibo as key figures in the violence had yet to be tried, he said.

In Palu, near Poso, the Catholic community voiced their dissent. About 50 of them, mainly women and coming from the Santa Maria parish, demonstrated on 10th August outside the Attorney General's office. Their coordinator, Adrianus Hode, said:

Tibo, Marinus and Dominggus have only been made victims in the case of the violence in Poso.
(Tibo, Marinus dan Dominggus hanya dikorbankan dalam kasus kerusuhan di Poso.)

Lawyer Roy Janis also said at the demonstration:

Tibo and Co. were not the key men in the violence, the real culprits are still free.
(Tibo dan kawan-kawan bukan pelaku kerusuhan, pelaku sesungguhkan kerusuhan Poso justru bebas berkeliaran.)

In nearby Tentena, a heavily Christian town, more than 1000 people demonstrated on the 10th.

In various towns and regencies of NTT, such as Maumere, Ende, Sikka, and Larantuka, many thousands of people marched on the 10th and 11th. In Ende, where Tibo was born, it is estimated 5000 people have come onto the streets. No violence has been recorded.

In the capital of NTT, Kupang, on the night of the 11th, 1000 candles were lit to protest the execution.

In Tentena Kompas says, 11th August, that about 60 people have forcibly occupied the offices of the Attorney General. Staff are not being allowed to leave, there are conflicting reports about a hostage situation.

In Jakarta a coalition of human rights groups urged the government to cancel the execution, at the Wahid Institute. Three religious leaders in North Sulawesi and Central Sulawesi also requested similar. Bishop of Manada, Mgr. Joseph Suwatan, chairman of the North Sulawesi branch of Majelis Ulama Indonesia (MUI), Arifin Asegaf, and President of Asia Fellowship of Mission 21 Partner Churches, Dr Nico Gara, were of the opinion that the execution would harm the good name of Indonesia and reflect badly on the justice system.

Jusuf Kalla, the vice president, said that the execution was no business of the government, it was a product of the legal system.

However Attorney General's Office spokesman I Wayan Pasek Suartha said that nothing could stop the execution except technical difficulties. He said the three sentenced to death by the Palu District Court in 2001 had already used up all the legal means at their disposal.

August 12th, the execution has been postponed until, at the earliest, three days after the celebration of Independence Day on August 17th. General Sutanto of the police said this did not mean it had been cancelled and there would be no further postponements.

Continued

August 12th, demonstrations continued in Nusa Tenggara Timur despite the postponement of the executions. In Kupang, the capital of NTT, and also in Maumere, in Sikka regency, hundreds of people protested.

In Tentena the occupation of the Attorney General's office by members of the Solidaritas Masyarakat Anti Hukuman Mati (SMAHM) ended peacefully on the 12th. Three staff members who had been taken hostage were released.

The reasons for the postponement of the execution continue to arouse controversy. On the 13th Foreign Minister Hassan Wirajuda denied that there was any foreign intervention in the decision to put back the carrying out of the sentences until after 17th August. He admitted that many letters had been received by the government, including one from the Pope, but that these had had no influence.

Fauzan Al Anshori of the Majelis Mujahadin, MMI, disagreed. He wondered how a country of only 75 hectares, the Vatican, could influence the largest Muslim nation on the earth, Indonesia. The government was not serious in upholding the law, he said.

The Muslim Defence Team, Tim Pembela Muslim (TPM), a group of lawyers who usually represent terrorist suspects, were also dissatisfied with the situation. Asludin Hatjani of the Central Sulawesi branch of the TPM complained that the media were portraying Tibo and Co. as if they were heroes. He wished that the sentence of death be carried out.

Security minister Widodo Adi Sucipto vowed however that the executions would still be carried out.

August 15th saw the country's largest Islamic organization, Nahdhatul Ulama (PBNU), complain that the delay in the execution of death row convicts Tibo and co. proved that the Indonesian government was weak in carrying out legal decisions. PBNU Deputy Secretary General Syaiful Bahri Anshori said if the government did not want to be considered weak by the people, it should carry out the execution of the death-row convicts immediately, including Amrozi and the other Bali bombers, not just Tibo.

On August 16th, as president SBY was giving his state of the nation address, a member of the Partai Bulan Bintang, PBB, was heard to interject over the matter of Tibo. Later Ali Mochtar Ngabalin explained that the president had to be held to account for the delay in the executions.

August 17th, General Sutanto of the police says the three men's executions will not be postponed again. The time and place of the executions is not yet known.

Update, 19th September, 2006

Their executions are now set for September 21st.


47 Comments on “Tibo Execution”

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  1. avatar Spartacus says:
    August 11th, 2006 at 11:57 am

    It’s really sad that these men will die as scapegoats. There are too many of these types of accusations in Indonesia when the judges really are the crowd. Police, jury, and the supposedly real judge really have no say when determining who die and who live when pressured by the crowd. In situations like these even when there is not enough evidence the innocents die and the guilty go scot free”¬¶The real instigators and terror leader such as Abu Bakar Basyir went free without falling a single hair for being the mastermind and killing 202 people in the Bali bombing. This is the kind of law that is practiced in Indonesia and the world has to help the fallen innocent victims. For the law enforcers and judges, please stop closing both your eyes and ears when the guilt inside you start pounding your hearts when you hear that these three people have died as your scapegoats in helping you to keep your so called “peace”. For this will happen again and again until somebody righteous really takes a stand to stop this.

  2. avatar Miss Indo 07 says:
    August 11th, 2006 at 5:02 pm

    Exactly! I hope God will make a miracle tonite and don;t make this happen. What about the Riots of May 98? What about Amrozi? and a lot of people that obviously kill a lot of people? Bombs the WTC in NY? and in Bali?
    Our government is soo stupid!! ( I hope one of them read this, because I really dont know how to express my feeling, how to express my opinion.)
    Is it a democratic country? I think this country is just too democratic for FPI!! and also to all the anarchy people who can do anything to force what they want.
    I’m so sad that this happen to my country. And I’m more sad that Tibo etc have to die at the hands of those useless people.
    God bless you Tibo and friends, I’ll always pray for you.

    —–

    Tibo and friends will die while the real culprit’s are still happily alive and still doing other crimes. What a shame for our country. How I really want to cry and scream. How I really want to curse and say bad words to the government. God, help them.
    Hey you people, don’t be happy for this because the punishment will come to at the time. And it will be hundreds or thousands of times more scary than what you have done to Tibo and other people. Tibo and friends and family be strong! God will never leave you.
    He knows the truth.

  3. avatar Apache says:
    August 11th, 2006 at 8:08 pm

    I’m definitely sad to hear about this news. The government could have been more transparant and calm in making decisions. I undersrtand that there are lots of pressures but that doesn’t mean they can’t weight the face and make the right and just decision I dont know if they realize what are the implications of their decisions for executing Tibo and friends.

    People are crying and pleading for justice but yet the leaders who are supposedly leading and setting examples are missusing their power for their own agenda. Hopefully, the local government come to their sense and make a more intelligent and wise decision.

    —–A better Tomorrow for Indonesia—–

  4. avatar Andrew says:
    August 11th, 2006 at 10:42 pm

    A lot has changed in this world, but not the outrageous injustice that’s running rampage in Indonesia. That bastard Baasyir should die, too.

  5. avatar Ben says:
    August 11th, 2006 at 11:31 pm

    Hey let’s just all take a lesson from this. I know most of the Christian thinks that Tibo should be released. But, he did confess to the judges and said that he deserved to be death sentenced. Plus there are eye witneses that saw that really happen.

    We know what Moslem’s did in Poso is wrong, but killing is not justifiable (tidak dapat dibenarkan) in any way. All the religion clearly said that. And the country law too.

    So please, to all people, please stop killing. Some Moslem said to me that they would be rewarded in heaven if they killed non Moslems, but those words may be in their Syariah, but it is absolutely not coming from the GOD Almighty. But it is coming from the person that is filled with rage in his heart (you know who’s im talking about?)

    —–

    I actually heard the story from the local people that the actual killer consist of 3 people (that right!!!!) that come from a very little tribe. Tibo Cs was just there to clean up Moslem left over. And the actual number of casualties is around 3000 people.

    This 3 people are using black magic and they are not visible to all people that they killed. Thats why they escaped and Tibo was arrested for lack of magic of invincibility. The killing method is similar tothose in Sampit which is decapitated.

    That give me goosebumps!

  6. avatar Miss Indo 07 says:
    August 12th, 2006 at 12:47 am

    It’s delayed!! Yeah!! They’re still alive! God still protect them. Time will show, I just absolutely agree that Baasyir and Amrozi should die.

  7. avatar Apache says:
    August 13th, 2006 at 4:01 am

    Hey Ben, I’m just curious of where is it stated that Tibo conffesed of his wrong doing ? I just read from Kompas that stated otherwise

    “Suara Tibo dapat didengar massa setelah disambungkan ke dalam pengeras suara. Tibo menyatakan, jika dirinya membunuh orang, maka warga Flotim tak usah mendukungnya. Tapi dia mengaku tak pernah membunuh orang seperti yang dituduhkan.” (Kompas, 8/10/06)

    Are the comments of the eye witnesses documented somewhere? not that I dont trust your word but I do want to read it myself and have a full picture of what’s going on out there.

  8. avatar Andrew says:
    August 14th, 2006 at 2:14 am

    I hate to say this, but I have to: we cannot trust any system in Indonesia, including the justice system. Everything single aspect is so influenced by money, politics, personal or group interest. No, this is not just based on a passive observation, I’ve seen it first hand.

    Tibo & friends, I believe, are just scapegoats.

    This nation has no integrity nor conscience.

  9. avatar Apache says:
    August 14th, 2006 at 8:53 pm

    I agree with what Andrew said. However, please look at the efforts of some of those people who fight for human rights and putting their life on the line (I seen this too) Look at those people who have integrity and do love Indonesia so much.

    Anyway, lets not just point fingers at government but always keep the effort to maintain the integrity in wherever we are. I guess the easiest place would be in how we practice our proffesionalism.

  10. avatar Andrew says:
    August 15th, 2006 at 3:10 am

    Apache is correct, I should not have generalized the situation; there are a few who tried to fix it. Let’s just hope they don’t vanish among the majority.

  11. avatar Bradlymail says:
    August 15th, 2006 at 3:07 pm

    my mighty god (Allah) please save Tibo and his friends…pls forgive them.. I know you are listening,they are not Osama Bin Laden which killed innocent people by using your name and prophet mohamad saw. Amin

  12. avatar lunarjanto says:
    August 15th, 2006 at 9:20 pm

    I’m new here, but from what I’ve read so far, there’s a tendency to turn any matters into religious affair…maybe the world will be better without religion…agree?

  13. avatar Czeslaw says:
    August 15th, 2006 at 10:56 pm

    Mr. Fabianus Tibo, Dominggus da Silva, and Marinus Riwu execution will be another prove that dead is not the answer to any question. Actually, many questions will never be answered. And I hope, that this is not a goal of Indonesian people and Indonesian government. Certainly, it will not cool off the situation. In the interreligious conflicts, executing opponent, means falling back to the stone age traditions of pagan cultures. Also, issuing amnesty to a select group of people, and withholding same amnesty from others, on similar crimes and/or violations shows government bias and selective judgements, which was typical in Communist Russia as well as Nazi German during WWII.
    As I have written to the Indonesian consulate in the US in this regard that Indonesia’s 61 anniversary of Independence will be a great opportunity to grant amnesty to all involved in this tragic crisis. I trust, that Indonesian people strive to comply with the international treaty of human rights, and will consider equally among all religious groups in this wonderful country.

    —-

    When I read what others are saying here, kind of leans toward the hate. All of you remember that hate is the biggest self punishment. Focus on a single agenda and hate will have no place in your hearts. Also, Muslims shall do more to take their religion back from the terrorists. No one can notice or see any movement toward that direction. Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists are Muslims. Why is that?

  14. avatar GIAS says:
    August 22nd, 2006 at 9:05 am

    I just known this news after I read the email from Pope to SBY last sunday, when we are on the Indonesian Mass for Indonesian Independence day.
    I don’t know what happen before, but I do know what I read is right. Pope just asking SBY for amnesty for these 3 innocence people, regarding the upcoming Indonesia’ s upcoming celebration.
    and in the email, Pope also says that the FAST trail of these 3 peoples must be reviewed.
    Indonesia for me as Indonesian, is a very unique and come unity of diversity. But the Legal matters make this diversity become a negative aspects. I don’t what will Indonesia be, if all of this radical voice always takes over the legal matter. look at Abu Bakar B. after convicted on the mastermind of Bomb Bali, he still can be free.
    Hoping this case will be reviewed again and the true actor from this matter will be found sooner.

  15. avatar Bradlymail says:
    August 22nd, 2006 at 3:29 pm

    i appeal to Indonesia government to release Tibo and his friends.They are not Abubakar bashir or FPI’s leader.The Indonesia government can released abubakar bashir and other Bali’s bomb terrorists without thinking twice..they are more dangerous than Tibo and his friends.

  16. avatar Czeslaw says:
    August 22nd, 2006 at 11:20 pm

    I have appeal to the Indonesian Embassy in the US for clemency to all prisoners held in this case. I mean the good and the bad guys. I stated that the Indonesian 61th Independence anniversary would be a great opportunity for such a gesture of Indonesian government. It is almost two weeks, and I do not hear their response, of which I kindly asked. I heard that the main brain of the Bali bombing was released, I saw his picture on the net, and this same article said, that the sentences of others were reduced. What that means in Indonesian?

  17. avatar Yolly says:
    August 24th, 2006 at 6:58 am

    There are far too many concerns about the way this trial was carried out to let these sentences be carried out. If we find out later that they were innocent – as we very well might be – then the executions cannot be reversed. These sentences should be squashed and a re-trial ordered.

  18. avatar Hassan says:
    August 24th, 2006 at 10:44 pm

    Ben: interesting fairytale, dude. I always liked stories of magic, fairies, and dragons.. *yaaaawn!*

    this religious bias is quite amusing, when it’s about Tibo and co. most Christians will say the government should free them because they’re innocent and all. uttering words like: use love for life and empathy, abolish death sentence, and humans don’t have the right to take other human’s life.

    but when it comes to Amrozi and co. the same Christians will yell : fry them! sent them to hell! let them rot in hell!

    the fact is both Tibo cs. and Amrozi cs. had admitted to their crimes. now, where is the love? talk about clear cut bias.

    btw, I’m not blaming or defending anyone, just pointing out something i thought was interesting.

  19. avatar Yolly says:
    August 25th, 2006 at 5:03 am

    Hassan, that’s really not fair.

    Many Christians believe it would be wrong to kill the Bali bombers regardless of how heinous their crimes were, because they oppose the death penalty for anyone.

    Anyway, regardless of what you say about them “admitting” their part in the massacre, I think there is much evidence that Tibo and the others are actually innocent and the trial was flawed. That is very different to Amrozi and the others, who have been delighted to confirm again and again that they are mass murderers.

    Tibo and the other two should not be executed while there is ANY realistic doubt about their guilt.

  20. avatar Czeslaw says:
    August 25th, 2006 at 8:04 am

    There is a difference between Islam and Christianity. Christianity forbids killing for any cause. So it is irrelevant if we are talking of Tibo and &, or Amrozi & Co.. Neither shall be put to death. The 5th Commandment given to Moses by God, states it clearly. Do Not Kill! It doesn’t matter for what “sin” or whatever. There are no exception or “gray areas” given to the 5th Commandment. It is nice clean slate.

    Completely off-topic part deleted -
    admin

    And I believe that Tibo & Co., went probably the way I just described. I believe that non Islam countries will raise with fire power against Islam hostilities. And non Islamic people outside of Islam conquered countries shall support freedom fighters like Tibo & Co. I will not let Islam conquer Poland. I would defend my Christian believes and my Christian country. If I would have a military command, I would go to Indonesia with my army and free Tibo and Co.. I would arm non Islam people in Indonesia so they could defend them selves against Islamic aggressions. I do not see other possibilities. And that is truly sad.

  21. avatar Hassan says:
    August 25th, 2006 at 11:06 pm

    czeslaw: do you even know that Islam in Indonesia spread through trade and peaceful means? Arab and indian traders back in the 14 -15th century brought this religion to Indonesia and slowly the people here began to embrace it. it is infact Christianity who were brought here through ‘conquest’, by our beloved dutch colonialists (note the ‘…’ sign).

    poland invade Indonesia? I don’t think so. poland’s military is laughable. the last time your ‘mighty’ army got into a fight, the germans blast through your pathetic army in days. plus you know how many of us here? 80% of 220 million people in Indonesia, and 1,4 billion worldwide. better think more thoroughly.

    “Islamic aggression”? the last time I checked, there is absolutely no Islamic country everywhere currently occupying non-Muslim states. but a Christian majority country (the US) had attacked and occupied Iraq and afghanistan, two Islamic contries. so really dude, who is the aggressor here?

    dude, stop munching on the hate crack or whatever you are on right now. this world had enough of hatred and bigotry. there is too much people preaching hate (you being one of them) and too few preaching love and peace.

    —-

    yolly: I wasnt talking about Christians’ attitude in general, but only Christians on this site. just read under the headings of ‘Tibo’ and ‘Amrozi’. you’ll see the different of tone used by our Christian friends.

  22. avatar Czeslaw says:
    August 26th, 2006 at 10:53 am

    Hassan: my last post here was deleted, after your red it, I guess. So, censorship is used on this web-page, like was in old communist Poland in th 50s and 60s, . I do not mean to stir the pot for any purpose but a dialog and some historical facts. Yes, Poland didn’t had big army when WWII started up. On Sept 1th Germany attacked Poland from the west, and on the September 14th., ’39 Communist Soviets attacked Poland from the east. Poland never intended to keep bigger army, for Poland never intended any aggression toward others. We never did. When I said, if I would have a military power, this is what I would do… etc.. I do understand military, I served under the Warsaw Pact treaty, which was Moscow’s joke to the rest of you naive. Hassan, what you freely skipped is the aggression part, due to the censorship on this web? was the Christian Ormians’ Genocide in 1915 by the Islamic Young Turks. You skipped the ongoing Genocide of minority people in Darfur. It is happening right before our eyes right now. Only Islam people and UN are blinded to this Genocide, as they were in Rwanda, and prior to this in Cambodia. I believe, that you would benefit by learning about the causes of the “western” hate in the Muslim countries. Terrorist trained in Pakistan, received money from UK Pakistanis for the earthquake reliefs funds. Pakistani Islamic terrorist used these funds to fund the terror attacks on the jet liners in UK flying to the US. Hassan, name one non Islamic religion today involved in terrorism or Genocide like in Darfur. Maybe this too, will open your eyes. Why Islamic Arab countries are not helping Arab Islamic Palestinians? Hassan, to me doesn’t matter if your believe in Islam, or Hindu, or Buddhism, or Shintoism, Shiiatism, etc.. I would despise any one who would hurt you trying to convert you to another religion. In koran, Islamic person have to convert other person to Islam, with the 3 step program I outlined, and as I stated in my prior post, which was deleted. I hope that you will enjoy prosperity in your spiritual life, and share your blessings with others in a peaceful way. Maybe you can convince your Islamic friends to take action and help people in Darfur and Palestine. Or, at least let others do it without any hostilities toward those are there to help. Also, why Islam is afraid of democracy?

  23. avatar Hassan says:
    August 30th, 2006 at 11:06 pm

    czeslaw: yes i realized that there are so much violence in the name of religion these days, including Islam. but one have to be fair on judgement. maybe it’s Islam’s turn this time to be depicted as violent. but Christianity and other religions have their fair share of violence.

    lets take a look back at history: the crusades, the imperialism era, the two world wars, the holocaust, and the hiroshima and nagasaki bombings, to name a few. those are acts of violence and genocide that had killed millions of innocents worldwide. those are not done by Muslims. in the last millenia, which religion had claimed more lives and was responsible for those violence? not Islam.

    thanks to people like osama and saddam, nowadays it is Islam who is having a bad name. please understand that we are having difficulties and can not control the actions of those people. we are as powerless as you are when it comes to telling them not to do those things. so, please your empathy when judging other people and their religion. our religion never told us to kill others without a reason, but the killings continues. lets give peace a chance by being tollerant and understading to others.

  24. avatar Czeslaw says:
    August 31st, 2006 at 1:55 am

    Hello Hassan, it was good to hear from you again. I believe that this is the way to voice different opinions without violence and kills on both side of the table. I study the world religions since 1996. By trade I am accountant and statistician. So, I stick to the facts, rather than feelings, emotions and “opinions”. There is no doubt, that the religions are the major causes for genocides and mass murders than any other reasons combined. It is in human history.

    I am glad that as a Muslim person you touched and acknowledged the Holocaust. I am not a Jew, so I do not have reasons, other than humanity, to touch the subject. The short fellow the “president” in Iran openly is denying its existence. I went on his web blog and invited him to visit me here, and I will take him there. I promised to him that I will pay his trip both ways. I never heard back from him. I live about 120(?) km from Oswiecim-Brzezinka. The biggest death factory know to a man kind. 15 km from me was the Gross Rosen (Great Rose) camp for children. They were killed there. I have been to Dachau, etc.. So, I do not understand this man denying the historical facts. Is his hate to others blinding him so completely? How an ignorant person like him can find so many followers?

    Hassan, what I am concerned also is the Islam military and politicians are saluting in the Nazi manner, lifting their right hands like SS, Gestapo and Wermacht troops. They are having Nazi swastikas (haken crux) with the Islam symbols on one flag. Why Islam wants to be seen as a extansion of Nazism? Why today Muslim parents are rearing their children in hate to others? I have pictures of Muslim Palestinian parents wrapping their own children with TNT belts, and brain washing them to commit suicide in the name of “Allah”. A 5-10 year old child is learning how to blow him/her self up. Imagine that child 10-20 years later, if this child will live that long. His or hers life is meaningless, no future, except suicidal thoughts.

    Why in other countries children are going to kinder gardens (pre-school) classes, are learning to love another child, to share, to enjoy others’ children company. But Muslim children are “destined” for suicide mission, without hope for anything. Why Islam is destroying its self from within, rather than from outside? Why Palestinian refuge Arabs are ignored and used by other Arab Muslims to fight the wind-mills, (Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, etc…) like Don Kichote with his friend Pancho?

    Hassan, I encourage you to study worlds religions, so you can too take a look as a human being. I can give you some book titles you could try. Try to read some on the religions of pre-Christian and pre-Muslim times. Learn some Asian, European and pre-Columbus American native religions. Very interesting lecture. War and love are human creations, an end to its own means. Hate of others is the biggest self punishment. If we could get to these basics and work our difference that way, the world would be much better place to live. Hassan, sometimes I am getting an impression, that in order to find God, a man have to separate himself from the religious influences and doctrines, which are man and not God made. That is just me and my thinking. It is nice talking with you….

  25. avatar David says:
    September 19th, 2006 at 12:14 am

    Continued at Tibo, et al. Execution.

  26. avatar Shanthan says:
    September 21st, 2006 at 12:45 am

    Hi all. I’m actually Singaporean and was directed to this site as my Indonesian Catholic girlfriend told me to pray for Tibo and his friends tonight. I am saddened by this story which somehow reminds me of Braveheart or Che Gueverra. It is indeed an unfortunate injustice.

    That being said. Let us not lose perspective. Looking at the posts above, there seems to be a lil bit of mud slinging. Remember though, we are all not perfect. Imperfections make us human. That said, don’t let a few bad apeoplees spoil the whole barrel. Catholic priest molests kids. That doesnt mean all Catholics and Catholicism is bad. Christians hung black people, killed them, raped them, burnt them alive , and left a burning crucifix on the lawns (KKK). That does not mean all Christians and Christianity is bad. Hindus desecrate Muslim mosques in India. That does not mean all Hindus and Hinduism is bad. Muslims blow up buildings. That does not mean all Muslims and Islam is bad. Jews are cold blood killing Lebanese. That does not mean all Jews and Judaism is bad. ect.

    All we can do is pray and keep the faith that God has a wonderful plan for all of us. Isn’t that the foundation of religion. Faith.

    I am Hindu by the way.

    God Bless.

    I just had to check it out. Really tragic. Macham like Braveheart or Che Guerra. God bless his soul and we are grateful for the lives that have been touched, lessons learnt from this incident. Reading the posts above though, I am reminded about something my girlfriend told me once. All religions have bad apeoplees, but don’t let the bad apeoplees spoil the whole barrel ya. Catholic priest molests boys, Spanish use the excuse of Catholic evangelism as a mandate to invade lands to the West and East of Spain ( when all the wanted was the resources and money from the natives ) ,

  27. avatar kasih says:
    September 22nd, 2006 at 5:16 pm

    It is a tragic comedy story. It’s tragic for people who ask for the truth and justice but it’s funny for people who like to make a joke with God’s Words. He will be very angry to those ‘funny’ people. Today my priest said that reality will not tell the truth but the Truth will become real.

  28. avatar Heng's says:
    September 22nd, 2006 at 10:01 pm

    I an new here.
    I am Indonesian. For few things I agree with Czeslaw. But, What i see in Indonesia, “most parents (fanatics) Moslems here (in Indonesia) taught from child to be anti and hate to non Moslem” ( I don’t know why they hate non Moslem). Indonesia law said respect to other religion. My opinion this not happen in real life in Indonesia, maybe just in theory (book). Why? “because many Moslem freely no need to respect other religion”. For example FPI (mafia).
    Why Indonesia have many terorist? as I said above in double quote. LAW only for non Moslem. (Prove that i maybe wrong)

    I don’t hate Moslem, I just need a little respect from them.

    Sorry not related to Tibo execution. But this is real condition happen here.

    Hassan: maybe you should thank to US for Hirosima and Nagasaki. Because if Japan never bombed by US, Indonesia never have any independence from Japanese untill these day. (Become a Japanese Colony)

    Bradlymail: if you are Moslem in Indonesia, it more easy for you to free from punish or get a short punishment. But if you are non Moslem, you’ll hard to free from punishment and will have losing a lot of money. Police in Indonesia love your money. No justice right?? (You can prove it)

    Hassan: >> czeslaw: do you even know that Islam in Indonesia spread through trade and peaceful means? Arab and indian traders back in the 14 -15th century brought this religion to Indonesia and slowly the people here began to embrace it.
    I am not agree with you Hassan, it’s not Arab and indian who brought here. it was persian and Chinese who brought to Indonesia by trader. Most walisongo’s (no one from Arab).

  29. avatar atmars says:
    September 22nd, 2006 at 10:44 pm

    people who’s involved in Tibo’s death:
    1-all Islamic hardliners in Sulawesi and all Indonesia, because they threatened judges so that they issue death sentence for Tibo. 2-Indonesian vice president jusuf kalla, because he support the Islamic radicals to prevail their wicked plan 3-Indonesian president susilo bambang yudhoyono, because he rejects the cancellation of death penalty of Tibo even though he knows that the Moslems are the trigger of the war. The blood has been shed already, now the curse is coming to those people mention above, unless they repent to GOD i mean the true GOD who teaches about love and forgiveness, not the one who teaches about violence and morder just as what the pope said .

  30. avatar Amran says:
    September 23rd, 2006 at 10:46 am

    I an new here
    I am Parigi people, about 160 Km from Poso
    Before convicted in 2001, Poso is peacefull town, no terror and bloody.
    Now, thats condition is legend.
    Why the conflict must happen ? Because the peoples like heng, miss Indo 07, andrew and so on (the people with the negatif thingking for all Moslem community) always to provocation the Tentena community (about 50 KM from Poso) to attack other community (Poso). They burning the village, killing the peoples (oldmans, pregnants and childrens). And Tibo is the field leader of the agretion. Are Tibo the Hero ?

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