As two people are caned for adultery in Aceh a report comes out claiming that women and the poor are victimised by sharia law in the province.
The two people caned on the 30th of July, a 23-year-old widow and a married 35-year-old teacher, were caught in a compromising situation at Sawang beach in late June. Nine and seven strokes respectively were meted out, with a rattan stick. A loudly enthusiastic crowd in the compound of the Al-Ikhsan mosque in Samadua, south Aceh, witnessed the spectacle. Their number was in the thousands.
Meanwhile, an Italian man, a worker for an NGO in Aceh, may also face caning for sexual offences. The amorous Italian, named Giuseppe, is being held by police for reportedly having "known" a local girl, named Wardiana, as well as for drug offences.
The Italian man was surprised by Acehnese Syariah police at a house in Pulo Kiton, Bireuen village, while in the act of celebrating his love for his Acehnese girlfriend, several days ago, said police Senior Commisioner Jodi Heriyadi.
Teungku Iskandar, a prominent figure in the province, said that foreigners should not escape the punishments of the sharia:
I hope whoever, including foreigners, who have breached the syariah law must be punished without exception.
In a timely fashion a new report, titled "Islamic Law and Criminal Justice in Aceh", on the application of sharia in Aceh, has been released by the International Crisis Group. It is long, detailed, and thoroughly researched, pdf file available.
Of most interest in the report is its claim that women and the poor are the main targets of the WH, wilayatul hisbah, or religious police. From the Executive Summary:
The zeal shown by the vice and virtue patrol [WH] in enforcing the regulations [against alcohol, gambling and illicit sex] has encouraged a report-on-your-neighbour process and a kind of moral vigilantism. Women and the poor have become the primary targets of enforcement. There is no indication that implementation of Shari'a is advancing justice for most Acehnese. But for many of its advocates, that may be beside the point. The real issue is whether man's law or God's will prevails.
Update 21 August
In the case of the Italian man it appears that only his girlfriend, Wardiana, will be processed according to sharia law. Giuseppe will be prosecuted over possession of marijuana. Usman, the Sharia Police Operational Commander explained how the two lovebirds were caught. The police received an anonymous SMS message telling them about the couple and how they had rented a house and visited it regularly, closing the curtains after they went inside.
The police staked out the place and waited for Giuseppe and Wardiana to arrive. The police peaked through the windows and saw the suspects acting "as if they were man and wife" and thereafter entered the room and arrested them. This all occured in the village of Iboih, Simpang district, Pidie regency.
“Vice and Virtue Patrol”; what nonsense. Just an excuse for religious fanatics to beat people up while a crowd of spectators releases their pent up anger by cheering it on. This is Sharia law really is, and of course it targets women and the poor. The men are in control, so it’s a way to oppress women, and the poor are targeted because the rich can pay off the enforcers.
O. Bule: This is Sharia law according to some Muslims you disagree with. Ironically, it seems that you accept their definition of the Sharia.
The truth is this: the “Vice and Virtue Patrol” is not what the Sharia (Islam) really calls for. Just see what the NU’s position on this issue. But, you choose to ignore this, don’t you?
Exactly. The poorer and more narrowminded a society – the worse for those lowest on the scale – women and children. The only thing that can change this is economic development. If we want also children of the poor to be able to have health care and live in non-violence, RI must open up to the world, not close itself. I ggod first step would be to uphold Pancacila and not let these by-laws be enforced here and there.
A fair point, but if thats the case why don’t the NU and the “other” Muslims prevent it, the government obviously cannot. As you are aware it is not just Aceh.
Sorry, I just cannot get the image of the woman be whipped watched by a huge crowd of ghouls out of my mind ((( Now if they happened to start with the top dogs (helicoptors anyone) and work their way down..perhaps I would take a more open view.
just to say…
… Keep up the good work!!!
o.bule: you really need to understand more about Islam and sharia. Islam is about tauhid and akhlaq (and a lot other topics), not just the five-time-in-a-day prayers. you claimed to be a Muslim but you certainly doesn’t talk like a Muslim should. not once i heard you said anything positive about Islam, Islamic law, and Muslims in this website. we don’t need another anti-Islamic critique, especially from a Muslim himself, those kind of rhetorics and sentiments already ecchoed accross the internet. we need someone who offers solutions and insights to our current problems, based on the Quran and Hadits of course.
as for Guiseppe in the article above, he should know that he’s in aceh, not in milan or rome. aceh is an Islam-based province, and he should act accordingly, you can pretty much do whatever you want in your own home, but on other people’s home, you must respect the hosts and their values.
Assalamu Alaikum Hassan,
Your solutions and insights, and Sharia Law, should come from one source only, Al Quran, Allah’s Holy Book. Hadith and Sunnah are the creations of men and twist the teachings of Allah into a grotesque and frightening parody of what Islam should be.
Allah says in the Quran,” Now that I have given them this book, complete and fully detailed, in what Hadith will they believe?”
Both Sunnah and Hadith since their fabrication, have been manipulated for the good of the ruling classes and the Islamic clergy to maintain their power and position.
The Ummah need to re read Al Quran and redefine Islam based on Intellect, Reasoning and Knowledge to try and pull our religion out of this nosedive into the dark ages that will only result in its total destruction.
Wasalam and may Allah guide you to his truth!
Khafi: and you left the Asyhadu anna Muhammadur Rasulullah in your sahadah. didn’t you believe the prophet when he said “and i leave you the Kitabullah and my hadith so that you won’t go astray”?
yes, the weak hadith maybe were products of fabrication, but not the strong ones (shahih). from your tone, can I assume that you’re one of those liberal Muslim from utankayu?
I agree, Oigal, this is very surprising. The people need a leader. Gus Dur is a true leader. He stands up for a tolerant Islamic interpretation – not a fanatic one that ignore thousands of years of human advances in science, gloBalisation and technology. Why should my girl be raised with such limited a view of the world when there are so much to discover. Why should I force her to obey here husband whatever? There is simply no single interpretation of Islam as some seem to think. If you claim that the Koran is the definitive way of life you then have to follow it absolutly by each word OR else you accept that the spirit in the text is what is essential and that interpretations are necessary AND accept that these interpretations change with time and that no single person today can claim to be the one and only interpreter.
Assalamu Alaikum Hassan,
Why should I leave anything from my Sahadah?, without The Messenger, I would not have Al Quran.
Allah only promised to protect Al Quran from corruption, nothing else. As for the “Ilmul Hadith” the so called Science of Hadith, it just doesn’t stand up to logic and reasoning.
Take Isnad alone, we as educated, intelligent people are expected to believe that a chain of narrators could transmit an uncorrupted message from the time of the Prophet until the collection of Hadith took place some 250 years later? Please!!!!!
Just try a little experiment, form a circle with a group of friends, 10 will do, write a message on a piece of paper, pass the message to one person in the circle such that nobody else may hear, ask them to repeat the message to the next person in the circle again so that nobody else may hear, by the time that message reaches the last person in the circle ask them to write it down again. The answer will be completely different, this is just with a small group of friends and in the space of ten minutes or less.
There is No Proof in Ilmul Hadith, in judicial circles it is called hearsay, second-hand evidence where the narrator is not telling what they know personally but rather repeating what they have heard from others. In the judicial system, this makes evidence inadmissable! If hearsay is not acceptable in a Court of Law for trying a simple criminal case, why would you want to build a religion from it? You want us to take such weak hearsay as Hadith, as evidence that the Prophet said or did something and that we should all base our religious lives and justice sytems on it?
By the way, what did you mean by the statement “from your tone” ? I wasn’t aware that there was any particular tone to my message other than suggesting the use of intellect, logic, and reasoning, as opposed to blind faith. The only thing I have blind faith in, is that Al Quran is the word of Allah.
Don’t forget Allah’s Quran is Complete, Perfect and Fully Detailed, it doesn’t need any elaboration, what He tells us it what He wants us to know.
You cannot assume (take as granted) that I am one of those Liberal Muslims from Utankayu, there are many of us out here in the real world, who are critical of the way our religion is being taken, and want to turn it from looking back on itself to looking to the future, We don’t want to blame the Christians, or the Jews or the “West” for all of our problems, we want to face up to the fact that most of our problems are of our own making and we should deal with them first. Only when we are clean and strong can we look at the “West”, Face to Face, and say, ok we are ready to take on the future as equal partners.
I actually know nobody from JIL, but as you seem to hold them in such great esteem, maybe I will pop around to see them.
Mohammed Khafi: “Your solutions and insights, and Sharia Law, should come from one source only, Al Quran, Allah’s Holy Book. Hadith and Sunnah are the creations of men and twist the teachings of Allah into a grotesque and frightening parody of what Islam should be.”
I’m with you, Mo.
The people already have a leader, what they really need is freedom to live their lives according to non religious laws. Religion is for the individual, it is between them and their God. It should never be something which is enforced by the State, Regional or Local Authorities.
Allah says in Al Quran “there is no compulsion in religion”
As for your suggestion of Gus Dur as a leader, whilst I do agree that his leaning is towards Islam tolerance, have you so quickly forgotten why he was voted out of office? I have yet to see a reasonable explanation of the missappropriated funds. Is this really a suitable man to have as a leader?
We have very short memories in this country, and it seems that a lot of people are able to avail themselves of the “Cloak of Invisibility” by wearing their religious badges on their sleeves.
Mohammed, couldn’t agree more. But my frustration and comment about religios leadership is that there seems to be noone out there today that is promoting freedom for the masses to live their private and religous lifes without any moral lectures from religious leaders or religous by-laws. Wny, do you think, noone stands up for tolerance and non-interference? NU one day say they definetly whants to uphold Pancacila, the next day they are in favour of by-laws. Why? What I mean is that if no leader (political and religious) stands up and fight for tolerance and individual rights we will soon become and Islamic state. RI is more and more showing the face of an Islamic state, not a secular one with strong Islamic influence. Perhaps the minority groups are to few. But Islam in RI is not the same as in Arab countries. This is confusing.
I don’t think that many of our leaders in the government, civil service, military, police or judiciary are really interested in the spiritual, moral or physical welfare of the ordinary people, they are too easily distracted by the opportunity to make money, the chance to wield power over others, or the chance for celebrity and or adulation by the masses. It could even be a combination of all!
With regard to the Arabisation of Islam in Indonesia, I think it is driven by money. I don’t think it is a coincidence that the interpretation for Sharia in Indonesia is strongly influenced by Wahabbiism from Saudi Arabia, they have vast sums of money from their oil wealth with wich they can easily buy influence.
If you cast your mind back a few months there was an incident reported in the newspapers about a delegation from Saudi Arabia which was staying in the Hotel Atlet Century Park, whilst they were checking in, a briefcase was stolen from them which contained a considerable amount of money in US dollars, the Saudi delegation if you remember, didn’t even want to cooperate with the police. The police just gave up on the case without even trying to find the culprits, and strangely there was no investigation by any other authorities about how the Saudis were able to just bring those vast amounts of money into the country and what the funds were destined for?
Perhaps it wasn’t even theft, perhaps the money was taken by the intended recipients, and this way there is no evidence of where or to whom it has gone?
Oigal: You said “why don’t the NU and the “other” Muslims prevent it?”. Good question.
Now, let me give an example. Do read this: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/29/us/29delaware.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Why do you think other Christians do not prevent it?
Or, perhaps, I should’ve said, Oigal’s is a naive question.
My point is: Some of you disagree with how conservative Muslims interpret Islam. Ironically, some of you keep insisting that, that what in fact Islam is. And you choose to ignore the opinion of moderate or liberal Muslims.
Indcoup said Patung has done a good job here. I disagree. If Patung continues writing post like this http://www.Indonesiamatters.com/543/Islamic-violence/ this blog would definitely fail to engage moderate or liberal Indonesian Muslims.
As for myself, I am out of here.
Mohammad Khafi : If you choose not to believe in hadith (shahih) or sunnah, I can assume that you’re Moslem but you never sholat (pray). In the Quran, Allah tells us to sholat(pray), shoum(fasting), zakaat, and hajj. If you believe in Quran, you must do those things, with certain terms and condition of course, and I assume that you did.
But, there are some questions in my mind. how did you do your sholat? shoum? zakaat? or hajj? are you doing that by your way? your own procedure? without guidance from anything or anyone? or you did by the way of Prophet Muhammad.
If you did by the way of Muhammad SAW, it means that you DO BELIEVE in sunnah or hadith(shahih).
Quran and Sunnah is the two things that we cannot separate.
If you believe in Quran but not believe in Sunnah, It means you are ‘Ingkar Sunnah’.
Assalamu Alaikum Ganjar,
(1) The Quran is a complete book, See Quran 6:19,38,114, 115, 12:111 and 50:45. Remember that when God says that His book is complete, it means 100% complete.
(2) The Quran is perfect; no mistakes, no falsehood, no nonsense. See Quran 41:42,12:40, 30:30, 30:43 and 98:5
(3) The Quran is detailed, and when God says He detailed His book it means FULLY detailed. God does not do half jobs. See Quran 6:114, 7:52, 11:1, 41:3, 10:37 and 12:111
(4) God does not need any addition to His book. God teaches us in the Quran that He does not run out of words and that if He so willed He could have given us hundreds, thousands or millions of books besides the Quran (see Quran
18:109). Since the Quran is complete, perfect and fully detailed, God did not give us any more books.
(5) God calls His book, the Quran, the BEST HADITH. HE called on His true believers to accept no other hadiths as a source of this perfect religion . See Quran 7:185, 31:6, 39:23, 45:6, and 77:50.
(6) God calls on His true believers to make sure not to fall in the trap of idol-worship by following the words of the scholars instead of the words of God. See Quran 9:31
(7) God calls those who prohibit what He did not prohibit, aggressors, liars and idol-worshipers. Idol-worship is the only unforgivable sin, if maintained till death. See Quran 5:87, 9:37, 7:32, 6:119, 6:140 and 10:59.
(8) Muhammed is represented only by the Quran. The Prophet Muhammed was the last Prophet and a messenger of God (See Quran 33:40). He was not the messenger of God because of who he (Muhammed) was, but because he was given the Quran (the message) to deliver to the world. The religion of Islam is a religion of God, not about Muhammed, who was blessed by God with the delivery of the message of the Quran. He did not have an agenda of his own. His job was to deliver to the world what God was giving him, the Quran. See Quran 42:48, 13:40, 5:99-100 Muhammed cannot prohibit things, or make lawful things on his own. When he tried to do that God admonished him publicly, see Quran 66:1 66:1 reminds us that God is the only ONE to prohibit or make things lawful. NO ONE can attribute to Muhammed a prohibition that God did not give him in the Quran. Anyone who tries to do so is admitting his/her refusal of God’s words and commandments in the Quran.
(9) The TRUE believers KNOW that when God says something, He means it, and when He does not, He means it as well. Everything given to us in the Quran was done deliberately and everything left out was also left out deliberately. God does not forget. See Quran 19:64. We are not to add to this religion what God deliberately left out and claim it to be from Him or His messenger. His messenger has only ONE message, the Quran. God already told us He does not run out of words. See Quran18:109
(10) God does not need us to improve on His book, the Quran, but we very much need Him for every aspect of our lives. Those who think they have some improvement on the Quran are but asking for recognition of their idols as gods besides the ONE and ONLY GOD.
(11) God calls on His TRUE believers to verify every piece of information they see, hear or read, see Quran 17:36.
Are you a True Believer Ganjar?, or do you prefer to take the words of men rather than the words of Allah?
The Jews were given Torah, but follow Talmud, the Christians were given Injeel but follow The New Testament, the Muslims were given Al Quran but follow Sunnah and Hadith, do you see a pattern emerging?
I do not need hearsay, falsehood, or folklore to follow Allah!
To Mohammed Khafi:
respect to you. You try to discuss objectively. Try to keep this style.
Do you really except, that other can do the same like you? I read in the answers already emotional movement and tendency to hit your person but not your arguments.
By the way, I’m worry about the development of Indonesia, also in religious affairs.
Islam in Indonesia was unique, and I hope it will be further.
It was full of understanding and tolerance. To my opinion, these all represent the teaching of Rasulullah in Al qur’an (I’m not a Moslem, but I owe an Al Qur’an. It is one of my favorit lectures!).
Of course, there are many of the parts/suren I don’t really understand. I think, Indonesia especially need more of peoples like you. Open minded, objektiv and not grim.
To the other sisters and brothers in Indonesia: don’t forget our cultur of tolerance and musyawarah.
Wassalam from Germany
It says in Al Quran:
“Goodness and evil are not equal.
Repel evil with what is better.
Then that person with whom there was hatred,
may become your intimate friend!
And no one will be granted such goodness
except those who exercise patience and self-restraint,
none but people of the greatest good fortune.”
I sincerely hope that others will be guided to the straight path by logic and reasoning, there are others who share my views but due to the threats and intimidation they receive, they are of course reluctant to stand up and make their voices heard.
Mohammed Khafi: you sounded right, but you’re not, obviously.
prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was always guided by Allah SWT, if he commit a mistake, Allah SWT will always reminded him. Allah wouldn’t let a single mistake by the prophet uncorrected. so Muhammad’s (pbuh) words, sayings, and teachings (the hadith) were always free from mistakes. saying otherwise will be pure speculation.
let me ask you again, did you or did you not trust Muhammad (pbuh) when he said: “and i leave you the Kitabullah (Al Quran)and my hadith so that you will not go astray”? did you or didn’t you?
believe in the Quran and hadith is one of the main tenets and principles in ahlussunnah waljamaah (sunni), you cannot accept one but not the other, so by saying otherwise you had gone a separate way from the ahlussunnah waljamaah teaching. tell me, are you by any chance a shiah or ahmadiyah?
there are things on the hadith not mentioned in the Quran, like how we must pray. the Quran only told us to pray, but not how to pray. how did you pray khafi, if you do not believe in the hadith?
the shahih hadith were preserved by the people who had preserved the Quran, if you do not trust them (past ulamas) in preserving the hadith, then why did you trust them in preserving the Quran?
if by any chance you are a free minded rational person, let me tell you, you had thought about it too far, your mind had been contaminated by liberal-ish pattern of thinking, and you are skating on the thin ice of heresy, nauzubillahimindzaalik.
peace be upon you.
Assalamu Alaikum Hassan,
I am not suprised at your reaction, even after being show the verses of Al Quran which clearly show you that you should have no source for your religion other than Al Quran, you still insist on using Sunnah and Hadith.
“And he whose sight is dim to the remembrance of the Beneficent, We assign unto him a devil who becometh his comrade;
And lo! they surely turn them from the way of Allah, and yet they deem that they are rightly guided” 43:36-37
Your assertion that ” Muhammad’s (pbuh) words, sayings, and teachings (the hadith) were always free from mistakes.” is clearly incorrect. The Prophet himself, in at least 12 verses describes himself as human, and all humans make mistakes, See Al Quran 80:1-12, 66:1
As to your statement that “the Sahih Hadith were preserved by the same people who preserved the Quran” Al Quran was protected by Allah, he doesn’t need the intervention of Humans and their infallabilities. “Absolutely, we have revealed the reminder, and, absolutely, we will preserve it” 15:9
I would like to think that I am free minded, rational person, and that is the reason that I have come to the conclusion, after taking the evidence into account, that the vast majority of the Ummah have been led astray by evil. That is the only thing which could account for the lack of morality, selfishness, violence, ignorance, inability to reason, blindness to their own faults, and general corruption, which seems to pervade the Muslim world at the moment!
“Shall I seek other than Allah as a source of law, when He has revealed this book, fully detailed? ….The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice. Nothing shall abrogate His words; He is the hearer, the omniscient. Yet, if you obey the majority of people, they will take you away from the path of Allah. That is because they follow CONJECTURE, and they fail to think.” 6:114-116
Who do you really think it is, who is “skating on the thin ice of heresy”? The person following the revelations of Allah, or the person following manmade oral traditions?
Don’t forget that I have only quoted from Al Quran during this discussion, your argument is not with me, it is with Allah himself, his word is good enough for me, why will you not believe Him?
“When Allah alone is mentioned, the hearts of those who do not believe in the hereafter shrink with aversion. But when idols are mentioned besides Him, they rejoice.” 39:45
easy question: did you or did you not trust Muhammad (pbuh) when he said: “and i leave you the Kitabullah (Al Quran) and my hadith so that you will not go astray”? DID you or DIDN’T you believe in the prophet? or is he just a machine that supllies us with the Quran (just a medium), and his words are meaningless?
i reiterate that the believe in the Quran and hadith is one of the main tenets and principles in ahlussunnah waljamaah (sunni), you cannot accept one but not the other, so by saying otherwise you had gone a separate way from the ahlussunnah waljamaah teaching. are you sunni, shiah, or ahmadiyah? lastly, from where did you get your praying ritual? and your hajj manasik? it’s not in the Quran. answer those questions and our discussion is through.
Assalamu Alaikum Hassan,
With reference to your first question, which I assume is in related to The Prophets last Sermon.
There are three versions of this in Hadith:
1) I leave with you Quran and Sunnah
2) I leave with you Quran and Ahl al-bayt
Muslim 44/4, Nu2408; ibn hanbal 4/366; darimi 23/1, nu 3319.
3) I leave you for the Quran alone you shall uphold it.
Muslim 15/19, nu 1218; ibn Majah 25/84, Abu dawud 11/56.
Which one do you believe?
This is typical of the confusion in Hadith and Sunnah, despite the fact that there were thousands of witnesses at The Prophets last sermon, we still have three different versions of your quotation. You see, only Al Quran is protected and unchanging!
Your second question, yes of course I believe in The Prophet, without him I wouldn’t have Al Quran.
The third question, well of course he is no machine, but is, in fact, a form of medium, doesn’t Allah himself refer to him as Rasool or messenger? Whenever you read in Al Quran to follow Mohammed isn’t the instruction to follow Rasool Mohammed, never Nabi Mohamed, therefore implicitly stating that you should follow the message and not the man.
Question three, I am none of the following:
Sunni, a follower of Mohammed
Shia, a follower of the Hidden Imam
Ahmaddi, a follower of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad
Submitter, a follower of Rashad Khalifa
Nation of Islam, a follower of Wallace Fard Muhammad
Druze, a follower of Al Hakim
I am just a plain and simple Muslim, a follower of Allah
“Those who divide themselves into sects do not belong with
you. Their judgment rests with Allah, then He will inform
them of everything they had done.” 6:159
“(Do not fall in idol worship,) like those who divide
their religion into sects; each party rejoicing with what
they have.” 30:32
“Ironically, they broke up into sects only after the
knowledge had come to them, due to jealousy and
resentment among themselves. If it were not for a
predetermined decision from your Lord to respite them for
a definite interim, they would have been judged
immediately. Indeed, the later generations who inherited
the scripture are full of doubts.” 42:14
Your last question, my prayer rtitual? What ritual? Communication with Allah requires no ritual.
“And before God prostrate themselves, willingly or unwillingly, all things and beings that are in the heavens and the earth, as do their shadows in the mornings and the evenings.”
If Allah wished you to perform a ritual he would have commanded you to do so in Al Quran, He didn’t! The same applies to Hajj Manasik.
If I decided to follow these traditional rituals, I would only do it because it would mean that I didn’t have to keep explaining myself to people like you, who despite having clear explanations of everything from Al Quran still cannot see the truth. I would not be doing it because I consider it to be a commandment from Allah. If I did that I would be commiting shirk.
“Shall I seek other than Allah as a judge, when He has revealed to you this book fully detailed? Those who received the scripture recognize that it has been revealed from your Lord, truthfully. You shall not harbor any doubt.” 6:114
“These are Allah’s verses that we recite to you truthfully. In which sayings other than Allah and His verses do they believe?. Woe to every fabricator, guilty. The one who hears Allah’s verses recited to him, then insists arrogantly on his way, as if he never heard them. Promise him a painful retribution.” 45:6-8
“And who doth more wrong than one who is reminded of the Signs of his Lord, but turns away from them, forgetting the (deeds) which his hands have sent forth? Verily We have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this, and over their ears, deafness, if thou callest them to guidance, even then will they never accept guidance.” 18:54-57
The Arabian word “Hadith” (Ø£ØØ§Ø¯ÙŠØ« , ØØ¯ÙŠØ« ) means: transmittal, story, bulletin or review, describes also a (profane or religious) news.
The cumulation of the hadiths emulates the sunnah.
Sunnah (Ø³Ù†Ø© ) means custom, usage, course of action. In Islam Sunnah describes things what the prophet said, done, consciously not done or acquiesced.
The Sunnah ist the second essential source of the Islamic jurisprudence (ÙÙ‚Ù‡ = Figh) after Al Quran. The religious legitimized law is the Shari’ah.
Tanziilul kitaabiminallaahil ‘aziizil hakiim (Al Ahqaaf/46:2).
Dzaalikal kitaabu laa raiba fiihi hudal lil muttaqiin (Al Baqarah/2: 2, read also 3,4,5).
Thank you Muhammad khafi, I see now a little bit clearer.
I am sure to be religious means not to follow blindly, but also to think, to feel and to open our eyes. Whatever you believe.
what a twisted… Khafi good job mate. and Hassan, stop insisting ur twisted jokes about “the truth” u don’t even know much. Khafi sounds have lots of intelectual better than u about Islam. u should check ur Quran, maybe it was misprinted.
Mohammed Khafi: let me ask you one last question, say IF you don’t have to keep explaining to people like me and others about your praying ritual, would you still do your prayers like it was today? (meaning subuh two rakaats, asr four rakaats, etc.)
or would you just prostrate and bow down to Allah, without rakaats and reading the alfatihah, for example?
Molisan Tono: stay away of affairs you don’t understand. do you even know what we’re talking about? why don’t you check your own bible, what version was it? the King James, or what? the new or the old testament?
assalamualaikum Mr.Mohamad Khafi,I’m in your side…i base only one holly book,that is alQuran.
I read almost all version of Bible Hassan… for ur references…
it’s just funny to me, how u my friend the out most intelectual Moslem to me, fighting against each other ur fellow of what is being the truth or not.
I think u must got twisted sect with you. gee….
iman Hassan ‘said’ adultery is ‘halal’
Molisan Tono: arguments are a common thing. religious arguments are also a common thing. don’t you argue with your Christian friends sometimes tono? an argument doesn’t create sects. I was just curious of how Mohamed khafi perceive Islam. I didn’t intend to judge his beliefs.
btw, I’m not the most intellectual Muslim or person here, I’m just one of the more outspoken one.
Bradlymail: who’s imam Hassan? this Hassan says that adultery is ‘haram’. now buzz off, and stop saying things on other people’s behalf.