As predicted by Andy, a "world football codes" topic, split off from US Financial Crisis, including stuff on the state of America, the Iraq war, references to ABBA songs, and a possibly blossoming cyber romance.
Uncle B’s right. Harsh, but true.
Can’t believe their young soldiers die out there with their necks sliced open for nothing.
It is not for nothing at all because the Iraq war has providing Mr. Bush, Mr. Cheney families and His Sheikh friend tremendous benefit from the surging oil price and huge opportunity to the companies belongs to both of gentlemen. It is normal for the Ordinary American to sacrifice their son and sister to ensure the glory of their own leader.
@ Marissa and Uncle B – I do not believe that our young soldiers die for nothing. We Americans fight to prevent another occurrence of 9/11 and we remember our civilians jumping to their deaths from the World Trade Center that day out of shear panic from the flames that would engulf them. We remember the brave fire fighters and policemen who raced into the World Trade Center to rescue the victims and only to become victims themselves. We fought in Afghanistan to rid the world of the premier terrorist training ground that Al Qaeda had set up with permission from the Taliban government.
I would agree that the USA should not have gone into Iraq because it was well known (see Sec. of State at the time Colin Powell’s remarks) that it was like opening Pandora’s Box. We made the decision and for the most part it has hurt our country’s reputation as we have been accused of invading Iraq for its oil etc. If only that was true then perhaps we could be avoiding the economic crisis we now face instead of spending a reported 10 billion USD per month while the fledgling Iraq government has been able to add $75 billion USD to its treasury to date. To side track briefly, was it not only a few weeks back when the Iraqi government announced a multi-billion dollar deal with China to develop additional oil fields? The truth of the matter Sadam Hussein was an extremely brutal dictator with a very long history of ruling Iraq with an iron-fist. He used fear, murder, rape and genocide to cling to power and anyone who opposed him was marked for retribution. The violence we have witnessed in Iraq since the Iraq war started is but a pittance compared to the violence during the Sadam Hussein era. The difference is now we have news agencies from all over the world reporting on the war and the tragedies are being witnessed in living rooms world-wide instead of being hidden from view by a secretive regime.
The world should be thanking the USA for shouldering this burden but we somehow have marked my country as a villain even as a young freely elected democracy emerges in the Middle East. But what else is new as thousands of American lives were lost during two world wars in Europe and Asia. How many Europeans or Asians stop and think about the fact that they are free today because of the sacrifice America made for them? How many remember our country’s great generosity during and after the war to see that thousand upon thousands were fed, clothed, housed and when necessary relocated? How many appreciate what the Marshall Plan did for them in terms of rebuilding their countries and restoring their economies? America did not leave the Europeans and Asians to alone face the Communist threat as it committed troops, money and training to its allies and stood the course during the Cold War Era for decades. Yes! We made mistakes along the way but we are perhaps the most generous and sacrificing people on the earth so the next time you are ready to bash the USA think about how the world would be if we simply turned our backs on our allies as they have done, with a few exceptions, to us?
We fought in Afghanistan to rid the world of the premier terrorist training ground that Al Qaeda had set up with permission from the Taliban government.
But we do not think that American conducted the WAR in Afghanistan seriously as we can see …Al-qaeda is still there and the most funny thing is how can the Great US army who able to take down satellite from the outer space but they cannot catch a rat that hide in afghanistan cave
But what else is new as thousands of American lives were lost during two world wars in Europe and Asia. How many Europeans or Asians stop and think about the fact that they are free today because of the sacrifice America made for them?
However, I prefer to give a thank to Geronimo and Apache tribes who already sacrificing millions of their people to give place to settle for the great American.
@ Cukurungan – Maybe it easier to let the rat suffer in his cave then to capture him to become a martyr for his cause? Not sure exactly of the overall strategy but Bin Laden has been fading slowly away since he fled Afghanistan, has he not? Anyway, would you have the Nato allies invade Pakistan to capture Bin Laden? WOW! Your even tougher than George Bush!
Hate to break the news to you but the Apache nation only numbered in the thousands and not millions! If you think about it the whole history of the human race has been about invading and conquering lands and people. Not saying its right but I am saying it has happened since we formed tribes. Anyway, we have admitted our misdeeds against the indigenous peoples of America and today they are having the last laugh as thanks to Congress, they own many casinos across the nation and many Indians are raking in the dough and all tax free!
Is that how your politicians have been telling you? That your soldiers off to war to save the world and to shoulder its burden? No wonder some of them committed suicide down there. Bet they don’t tell that on TV.
If you’ve been thinking that the troops fought war for us third world asswipes, that’s the result you’re going to get. It’s for nothing, they die for nothing. At least Cukurungan showed some courtesy by referring the Al Qaeda guy as a rat.
Fight for your own country, Patrick. Fight for Babe Ruth, for John F Kennedy, for Martin Luther King, Jr, fight for Lindsay Lohan, forchrissakes. The courage is well deserved.
At the mean time, watch this vid. Just a friendly reminder.
@ Marissa – Look I am not so naive to think that we (USA) are just a bunch of do-gooders running around the globe like policemen to save everyone’s butt without having our own national interests at stake and that often includes commercial, strategical and political considerations. What I am saying is that the world is not better off without the USA and it is only deluding itself if it thinks it is. Nobody in their right mind wants to ever go to war as their is nothing romantic about it at all. War is savage but sometimes there are no further options as not every country wants to play by the rules. Iraq invasion of Kuwait for an example. Do you think the world should have just stood by? Or how about Nazi Germany and Imperialist Japan, during WWII, should we have done nothing at all?
We have been exposed by the news to the fact that too many of our young soldiers have committed suicide both while on duty and after their return to civilian life. This has troubled our country but also motivated us to find solutions to this problem. Many Viet Nam veterans, as an example, have taken it upon themselves to seek out these newly returned soldiers and to offer assistance to help them as they also have had to cope with the psychological effects upon their return to society. I think every generation who has gone to war has had to deal with these troubling effects and it is a situation that demands attention. I would like to point out on the flip side the re-up rates for our military serving in Afghanistan and Iraq have been extraordinarily high and the number one reason given for re-enlistment is to finish the job that they started as they can see that their efforts are making a difference in the countries that they serve.
I know we will never completely agree about this topic but I want you to know that I do respect your position and I only wish that I could be more like you and really believe that all war is wrong no matter what the cause but I am afraid that that is a slippery slope in itself and maybe I am just too gutless to walk that path?
@ Marissa – I watched the video and I suspect that you already know that I love American football as it was my favorite game to play when I was young and its still my very favorite to watch. Yes, it is sometimes violent but it is also akin to a chess match as the offensive and defensives sides decide on strategy of play on each down. I know you are probably shaking your head at me and have decided I am a hopeless case and you have most likely made the connection that Americans are violent because of the games that they play. However, I have also witnessed live soccer (football) where a riot broke out and the referee was badly beaten by the fans. I was only about 8 years old at the time and it was very scary for me to be there and I can promise you that I have never been afraid at an American football game. X-treme sports are by definition violent and are a world favorite among today’s youth. Should we make the same assumption and say that all participants are masochistic and fans of the sport are themselves sadist?
P.s., I know Achmad will be all over this one! LOL!!!
American football? Why did you just say American football? Just FOOTBALL! Football is American football. Aussies have rugby. Brits have soccer. Americans have football! Bring the pain! You know, ARRRR! That teeth grinding stuffs. Hulk Hogan, is he in NFL? Chuck Norris, how about him?
Sheesh, you sure don’t sound like an American, Patrick. Anyways, I may be an Indonesian girl, I may be naive and innocent (glance at me gravatar, please), but I do think like a Japanese tourist, no?
No, actually that was a sincere friendly reminder, a temporary cure for overseas amnesia. It happens to a lot of expats, or so I’ve heard. Too much sun in the tropics perhaps. Or too much ABBA.
Just as how you Americans do with NFL, we simple minded, peace loving Indonesians also have entertaining activities to watch, especially during the season. For instance, we have petasan. Petasan everywhere, explosives here and there, how delightful. Achmad would’ve preferred that more than NFL, seriously. I’m afraid NFL would be a bit too intimidating for us Indonesians to watch. I mean, yes, the violence of it all, and the muscles of those testosterone-driven men! Oh, the humanity..
Patrick. you are welcome. I am exchanging my view for a more valuable opinion.
I just wonder to all that matter about US Financial Crisis right up to Indonesian crisis I failed to understand the discussion from NFL to US Iraq war to singing for a song.
@ Dragonwall – sometimes we are quite serious on this site and other times we just have crazy fun. We also often get side-tracked onto to other discussions that pull us further and further away from the original topic. Just do your best to follow along and ask questions if things get a little confusing. Read uncle B’s comments above and that will clue you into how we got into the Iraq war. The NFL and singing a song…LOL ….that just Marissa and I being crazy in love for each other! It happens you know on this site more often than you realize? ha ha ha ha! Just joking!
P.s., It is easy to tell that you are very smart with financial matters. On this thread people will attack each other and carry on for days, weeks, months and maybe even years? However, for the most part people are respectful of each other and don’t take things to heart so easily. Think of it as a big family that is easy to fight with each other but deep down we all care about each other as well. Good Lord I am going to cry…… and am I really this sappy? Please don’t anyone answer that question. Thanks! : > )
Correction Marisa, while rugby is big in Australia and we are usually quite good at it, Australian Rules (AFL) is our major football code. Last week the Grand Final was played in front of 100,000 fans. Check it out sometime, it is as violent as american football but without the padding and helmets and faster and more skilful than soccer.
And Rugby League would be a minor code?
Not at all…but in the pecking order AFL is first, League second and Union third. None of them are ‘minor’ codes but some are bigger than others.
Why did I not just say American football? Maybe because my Irish parents had me play Gaelic (Irish) football as well a soccer. Around the world football is soccer except for a few countries like the USA. No! Your not like a Japanese tourist at all Marissa they are to prim and proper and much too nice. You are much more feisty and therefore not afraid to say whats on your mind! That makes you a thousand times more interesting than a Japanese tourist. Come to think of it did you not say “check out me avatar”. Thats along with the green shading is a dead give away that your really an Irish colleen. If you are not an Irish woman than you certainly have the spunk to be one. Remember, in this world there are only 2 types of people those who are Irish and those who wish they were! : > )
Hi Patrick, it wont be long before this becomes a breakaway thread titled ‘world football codes’. I’m Australian and must admit even while living in Indonesia, I never called soccer ‘football’. You know you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. I must say I find it cringeworthy when I hear the sports desk on the news call it ‘football’ and ask ‘What country do they think we are from?’ That’s one thing I admire about the states..They call a spade a spade and don’t wish to imitate anyone. The main sports there are front and centre and anything else is just a niche market.
Hi Andy – Your quite correct and let’s not forget Canadian Football which is similar to the NFL but with some different rules variations such as a wider and longer field of play, 12 men instead of 11 and 3 downs instead of 4 etc., Wow! we really are way-way off the topic! : > )
That’s one thing I admire about the states..They call a spade a spade and don’t wish to imitate anyone.
Brilliant. They call a sport football while it’s primarily played with the ball in their hands or throwing the ball with their hands. The only times we see the foot being used are with kick-offs, punts, field goal attempts and conversions.
Football is the one and only right description to refer to the game Aussies and Yanks call soccer. If you would travel outside the English speaking world you would know.
FIFA: Fédération Internationale de Football Association
UEFA: Union of European Football Associations
English: football, FA (The Football Association)
Some odd descriptions: Indonesian: sepak bola (kick the ball), Italian: calcio.
I saw Aussie fans during their World Cup success (under the guidance of brilliant Dutch manager Guus Hiddink) in Germany in 2006 screaming: “From now on it’s football in stead of soccer”. How ’bout that?
Notwithstanding the fact I like to watch NFL, Aussie Rules and rugby union. But not as much as football….
@ Pubra Negaro – I know you have your many detractors on this site by I am not one of them. I don’t agree with allot of things you say but nobody is as entertaining as you are on IM and your style is quite a funny read if you don’t take everything you say too seriously. You have a gift for flair and with no equal here!
Patrick-I know you have your many detractors on this site by I am not one of them. I don’t agree with allot of things you say but nobody is as entertaining as you are on IM and your style is quite a funny
Yes it is, so funny in fact I really do doubt he is Indonesian. Indonesians are rather humourless for the most part but will laugh at slap stick and visual comedy. Sarcastic wit is largely lost on them. An example of this is the fact that only Mr Bean rates as a British comedy. The rest are way too subtle. And a great example of a popular local comedy is ‘Extravaganza’. Cross dressers yelling, screaming and falling over. But it is the most popular show on Indo TV.
Purba’s humour is very British to me so wouldn’t be surprised if he really is a pom.
Oh, Patsolicious. Considering I’m such a naive and innocent Indonesian girl *gravatars please, thank you* raised in a slightly bit dark-colored family, thus my father will forbid me from having a relationship with a whitey, it would be a horrifying, unforgivable disgrace in my family. It’s like wearing mismatched socks.
If you love me, prove it, convert. Set me free from this golden cage.
Convert, dearest. To Satanism.
For that matter, we, victimized Satanists, have had enough of your Christianism, Islamism, Judaism, altogether your McDonaldism cruelty.
How can you take our place in hell, drive us away from our home, and corrupt the minds of our young? And not give us extra Happy Meal toys! You bastard.
And even after what your people have done, I still give you the chance of love! Do you not feel thankful at all?
So? Do you or do your not submit to my wish, American?
Speaking of being Irish, I may fall into category #3, the Satanist young adults raised by Japanese tourists. Hated the fact they haven’t taught me much about how to be an asswipe, but I love them for who they are.
Enough about me, let’s talk about me. I mean, my country.
@ purba negoro
Sharia (banking system-cum-new world order) can run if Big Brother wants it to run.
Big Brother is going to need mass power.
The mass is going to need a justification to do so.
Big Brother could give it.
I’m not an economic analyst, but I do watch NFL.
Ah hell, let them have it.
@ sweet Marisa My halloween wedding dream!
I woke up this day from a bad dream that my love, my one true love, sweet Marisa, was the Indonesian daughter of Satan himself. I always suspected that she was really an angel but a hell’s angel? (Side note*Please Mr. Sonny Barber don’t sue me for copy write infringement as it would be cheaper and more convenient if you would just kick my ass!). Anyway in the dream, there we were at the Gates of Hell themselves and I rang the door bell and Mr. & Mrs. Satan came to the door and there they were standing there looking strangely like Ozzie Osbourne and his wife Sharon but only they are an Indonesian version complete with Batak. Mrs. Satan smiling at me pleasantly invites me in and meanwhile Mr. Satan’s demeanor is not quite as friendly and one could say that his deep red eyes penetrated into my soul and strangely I felt pleasantly violated. With his nostrils flaring with smoke and fire and his face charred brown he asked me to sit and explain my intentions with his daughter. Nervously with my head down and my knees quaking, I started to say how I love Marisa and blah blah blah but the conversation was going nowhere fast until suddenly I found a surge of new found confidence and looked him straight in the eye and realized hey this is the devil so what in the hell do I have to be worried about? After all he is a cool guy and he himself has tempted many a young man with naive & innocent maidens. So I said, Mr. Satan my intentions with your daughter are to…and before I could say another word he roared diam-diam! Suddenly, my confidence left me and my nervousness returned. The devil with a sly smile replied I already read your rather primitive and disgusting Western thoughts concerning my daughter and neither you nor any man may have her unless he is ready to pay the price to marry her. He continued and in order to marry her you must also be of the same religion. So being a Yankee Doodle Dandy I said oh! What religion is your family exactly? Are you Southern Baptist, Methodist, or maybe Pentecostilist? He just looked at me with that type of quizzical expression, you know the kind, the kind that quickly starts to look like raw hate and I thought to myself you idiot think Asian religions so I inquired if they were Muslim, Buddhist, or Hindus perhaps? He just shook his head side to side and with a sudden burst of energy I blurted out you’re not Catholics are you? This really angered Mr. Satan and he grew instantly to 10x his normal size and he easily dwarfed me in the room. He held up his pitch fork to strike at me but my beloved sweet Marisa shouted Daddy you promised to behave and not to do any harm to my precious & delicious Patsolicious! Mrs. Satan who had sat there silently the whole time with her head in a downward position said to her husband in a syruppy sweet buttery voice now dear please behave after all Patrick is in our home as our guest. The devil snapped back OK! OK! But you better not insult me again you stupid American. You and my daughter sudah look like a couple (no pun intended) mismatched sox. Stuttering for the right words I meekly replied maaf bapak! The devil with a twinkle in his eye said the price to pay for my daughter is 500 million RP and you must convert to Satanism! And there’s more! Both you and my daughter may never own property in Hell and your children will never be citizens of Hell either! Once again sweet Marisa intervened and said daddy you remember that you just changed that law so of course your half-breed grandchildren that we may produce have the right to now choose to become citizens of Hell or Americans. Now Mr. Satan’s eyes lit up and his whole demeanor changed quickly and with a trace of green (family trait see Marisa’s gravitar) envy exclaimed Americans now those ass wiping people truly frighten me! He thought to himself with a hint of jealousy what other people on this earth could have come up with a more devious plot to make the whole planet obese. This strange McDonalds tasted better than nasi-goreng and even came with little toys to choke tots! Impressive indeed are these Americans! OK! Patrick or Pastolicious or whatever your god-damn name is, what is your decision? Now to tell you the truth I only heard one part of what Mr. Satan said and the rest I tuned completely out. Now, I truly love sweet Marissa and blah! Blah! Blah! But 500 million RP! Did these gila Satanist have any idea how much young ayam that I could buy in hell with that kind of money? Do they know how many politicians and businessmen I could have in my pocket? I figured that I could own at least half of hell in no time if I wanted. I was about to tell Mr. Satan where he could go to…..when suddenly I was jolted out of my sleep by the sweeter than sweet sound of ABBA on the radio singing Dancing Queen!
You crazy Americans.
Ozzie Osbourne and his wife Sharon but only they are an Indonesian version complete with Batak
Complete with Batak? Hm. What is this Batak thing you’re referring to exactly?
You sure you got the translation right?
Okay, anyways, all things dating and relationships may go to another discussion thread– even though that’s the least of my concern. Seriously. I don’t want some Javanese, Sundanese, Madurese chicks or whatever ethnic you guys date these days to give me the eye for stepping too far to their territory.
Hey Marisa – The Notre Dame football team (nicknamed The Fighting Irish) won a big game today against their rival Stanford University “GO IRISH”! Grrrrrrrrrr!
I think Batak was a slight misspell and should have been Batik. Hope that makes better sense?
You know I poured my heart out to you and now you “cut & run”? LOL
Seriously, I cannot imagine how a confident & beautiful woman such as yourself would ever be frightened away by any woman and never mind some young ayam that could never hope to stand up to your intellectual abilities? But if you are not tough enough for the game of love then just continue to make excuses and play it safe.
Hey another Abba song just popped into my head “Take A Chance On Me” : > )
Whatever footy code you all follow, I hope the Melbourne Storm kicks Manly’s ass in this afternoon’s NRL Grand Final.
Go the Sea Eagles!
Manly – Melbourne Storm
40 – 0
I plead not guilty.
Hi Marisa – You did not say exactly explain which charge your are pleading not guilty?
Is it the 1st offense of cutting & running? Or the 2nd about not being tough enough and playing it safe? Do clear this up for the Court of Public Opinion. Thanks!
@ Marissa the New York Giants (NFL Super Bowl Champions & my hometown team) beat the Seattle Sea Hawks Sunday extending their record to a perfect 4-0 and placing them on top of the very competive NFC East Division.
Checked with the Indonesian embassy about the paperwork needed to convert to Satanism so that we can get hitched together and they replied “it was not necessary as all USA passport holders are considered dual citizens of the USA and Hell.” Something to do with us being the “Land of the Great Satan” or something like that?
@ Marisa – I will take your hint and put an end to our little cyberspace love tryst! wink! Sincerely hope that my postings did not cause you any undue embarrassment? Apparently my detractors have noticed that I am wearing my gulp”heart on my sleeve!