Atheist Threat
Oct 10th, 2008, in News, by Patung
Young atheists on the internet, and eradicating atheism and communism in Indonesia.
Governor of North Sumatra, Syamsul Arifin, said on 8th October at an occasion marking Pancasila Day that all elements of the nation must continually fight against and eradicate atheist beliefs among the people.
Atheism, which seeks to erase Pancasila and which once threatened the nation in the guise of the Communist Party of Indonesia (PKI), and still does, has to be guarded against, particularly because it still finds support among sections of the poor.
Syamsul said children should be taught from primary school through to university to hate atheism, so that the creed could as far as possible be obliterated.
A 4th ‘T’ – Rakyat tidak ateis.
The butchery of the atheist-PKI backed murderers of the September 30 Movement of 1965 (G30S PKI) could not be allowed to happen again, he said, hence the need to struggle against atheism. beritasore
Young Internet Atheists
On the internet at least some Indonesians seem happy to declare themselves as unbelievers.
Running an “affiliation” search on the social network site Friendster.com for “atheist” brings up about 144 matches friendster.com, while “ateis” produces 185 odd results friendster.com, although more than a few seem to be claiming to be atheist as some kind of joke.
On the same site, created on January 23rd, 2007 is the “Atheist Indonesia” group friendster.com, with 76 members and a fairly active message board, and some of its members seem to be active in an Indonesian language Atheist Wikipedia. ateisindonesia.wikidot.com
1,311 Comments on “Atheist Threat”
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Many, many years ago, 1997, there was a big fair in Bandung. A paranormal exposition in the Sun building in Jalan AsiaAfrika…. There were handreaders, dukuns, a big glass window and behind it there were little puppets looking a bit like very small trolls and they said, these are real people! there was all kids of weird shit going on…
anyway, there was this then quiet famous dukun from surakarta, often on tv back then, i forget his name , and i was still having some problems with old injuries from my jiu jitsu days (broken left shoulder, broken breast bone, 2 cervical and 2 thoraxal hernia’s, a bad hip and messed up joints in wrists and elbows in case you’re wondering) and i had a lot of shoulder problems, so my wife’s parents told me to go for it, he’s really very, very good!
so i went. they gave me a big glass with yellowish water to drink and then led me away. little did i know that i would be entering a little bit of hell. they send me into a large room where some 70 indonesian people were vomiting, because that’s what the yellowish water made you do. vomit. some people were projectile vomiting, others were hanging over buckets. others were just lying prone on the ground, moaning, in huge piles of puke. there were 5 beds in the middle of the room with holes where the head is and under that hole a bucket would be standing, people were lying on those on their bellies and you could see long threads of vomit/slime dangling from the left to the right….
it takes around 45 minutes for the stuff to start working and i started to feel very bad. i was sitting down, but i couldn’t vomit. looked to the guy sitting next to me and he was vomiting huge chunks of shit all over his shoes and well, i puked my heart out….
there were quiet a few elderly women vomiters there too, obviously very wealthy ones , they would come in, very sombong with all the airs and shit but in a short while you’d see them rolling on the ground in their own drool….
after maybe an hour or so they took me out of that hell hole and put me on a stage with that dukun, there were hundreds and hundreds of people looking. he started mumbling in front of me, took me by the head and forced me down on the floor where he kept mumbling. i had only lived in bandung for a year so i didn’t know what the hell he was going on about…. i got a huge ovation from the crowd…
then they sold me these huge bags of black pills and brown powder. jamu. had to take that shit for a month which i did and it didn’t do a goddamn thing for me and it tasted like earth that was pissed upon…. charged me a lot too, i remember paying 700.000 rp for it which was quiet a lot of money back then in those days. a guy i knew went in the next day and payed 250.000 for the same stuff, the same amount….
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went to this party years ago, up in the mountains in dago some where. there was one corner where it was very busy. a guy was sitting down and people were lining up. to be touched by him. we were told that he was a dukun with very strong powers and his touch would heal you.
so i’m watching it. and every time somebody would sit down, tell him their complaints and he would touch them for a few moments on the place that was hurting he’s turning the knob on a transformator giving ’em little jolts of electricity and people pay him too!!!
but i can’t help myself, you gotta love these small time hustlers. like those two guys in buah batu years ago, begging, with their legs all fucked up, crawling over the ground from car to car, their legs looking like the sons of the son of blob decided to move on there, all red angry looking welts and puss and shit… the it would start raining and you’d see them pack up their things and run for shelter, the paint from their fake wounds running down their legs 🙂
which reminds me of that guy in buah batu taking care of traffic on a busy intersection. he comes there every morning at 7 sharp in his clean white uniform. always had all these pieces of wood under his right arm, god knows why, and he does a superb job. cops let him do it, they’re happy with him. he’s very obviously mentally handicapped but like a said, he does a superb job, he’s happy and damn, can he blow that whistle…
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madrotter says:
but then again, you can just stay back home in europe as well for loads of weirdness….
had this girlfriend once and she was heavily into reiki. she took me to parties where people were all into reiki, they would be hugging trees giving reiki energy to those poor trees. she took me to bhagwan parties, some of you might remember him, his ashram in puna, india is still going on and you still have to do an aids test before you can enter. he was one shady mother, but his followers were a lot of fun, all dressed up in orange. in the middle of these parties everything would just stop and they would play cassettes of bhagwan making speeches, all the listeners all laughing at the appropriate moment. after that they would have laughing sessions…..
it wasn’t really my scene, but bless ’em, it beats the nazi skinhead scene with whom i’ve had many a problem back in the early 80’s….
among some of the weirdest things i’ve seen was “hawaiian blanket therapy” where somebody lies on a bed and 4 people take a blanket and wave the bloody thing above ’em, claiming it cleans all the bad energy from your body….. and people pay big bucks for that shit!
gabber rave parties in a place where they normally ice-skate, almost nobody dancing but walking in endless circles, making weird faces, chewing the insides of their cheeks to bits. seen a very young girl die at a party like that, next days newspaper said they found 20 pills in her stomach….
rotterdam in the 70’s, the 80’s and the 90’s and suddenly indonesia doesn’t seem to be such a weird place 🙂
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Ah the late seventies 🙂 even sleepy old Adelaide (the city of churches and serial killers) was an interesting place for a conservative country boy fresh from the backblocks. I wonder where the Wiccan girl is now, my mom was horrified.
Slightly more sinister, a couple of years back we got robbed. The better half was most offended but few days later came back and declared that she had taken some of the ragbags blood (I won the fight but lost the race as it bolted from the house) to the local dukun. For a mere 3 juta, our thief was to die of stomach cancer. Sheesh, I was thinking a good thrashing would do, hence I have been on good behaviour ever since (well mostly).
Still it’s well known that you don’t Fck with a Dayak ask Mr Kalla, whose thugs and his evil self was sent scurrying home last year.
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that’s pretty harsh euy, stomach cancer 🙂
jep, the dayaks, have you read indonesian gold from kerry b. collison? i know, i know, he’s not the best of writers, but he’s very knowledgeable about indonesian affairs and he does a really good job in that book describing just how ferocious the dayaks are and how tni/kopassus were shitting their pants when up against these guys….
which makes it so much more sad, to see what they’ve done to kalimantan and the dayaks….
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reading about kerry b. collison, i’m quiet surprised by his life story actually:
Kerry entered the Royal Australian Air Force in 1962. He was later cleared to the highest level of security and sent to the RAAF Airforce Base at Point Cook where he spent one year, along with a select few friends, learning Bahasa Indonesia. At that time President Soekarno’s Indonesia boasted the third largest Communist Party in the world. Australia’s involvement in the Vietnam War had just started and there was a growing fear that the threat of an Asian invasion of Australia was becoming a real possibility. Immediately upon graduation, and only 22, Kerry was sent to Jakarta as the Assistant Air Attaché and interpreter in the Australian Embassy during the final stages of the time which became known as the Years of Living Dangerously. This violent period lasted from October 1965 until the end of 1967 resulting in the death of some half a million Indonesians.Kerry spent almost three years in the Embassy before resigning from the Airforce and then establishing his own business in Indonesia. This soon became successful due to his access to the Indonesian Military and his former association with the Australian Government. Kerry was sought after as a commercial representative and was appointed by more than twenty major international groups to oversee their interests in Indonesia. He became involved in such ventures as the supply of helicopters (Hughes) to the Indonesian government, and flew with Lee Archer on the first successful helicopter flight from Singapore to Jakarta in a Hughes 500.
In 1971 President Soeharto granted citizenship to Kerry. This was the first time any foreigner had even been given such status without application. Immediately, due to his former security background the Australian authorities became concerned due to the sensitivity of material he had access to during his term in the Embassy and the Department of Air in Canberra. Kerry’s Australian citizenship was stripped from him. Kerry is a sixth generation Australian. Disillusioned, he then went about establishing himself in his adopted country. Within a few short years Kerry had successfully carved a formidable niche in the Indonesian community. Some of those achievements are:
He was founding member of the Young President’s organisation in Jakarta. Over a period of 18 years Kerry founded and co-founded more than twenty companies and joint ventures in Indonesia. He built the villa estate in the mountains outside Jakarta known as Coolibah, in Cimacan, and developed other housing estates in Kalimantan. The George & Dragon, The Cellar Bar, Joanne Drew Salons were but a few of the many investments Kerry started. In 1985 Kerry was responsible for the promotion of the first private universities in Australia. He was co-founder of several educational institutions in Australia, including what became known as the Beaufort College in Perth. In 1989/90 Kerry established the first external satellite television service from Australia, Topaz, which was the first private satellite license issued by the Australian government. Kerry commenced working in Indochina in 1991 and currently continues to reside in Asia. Having lived in South East Asia for thirty years he brings unique qualification to writing his chilling novels.
surprised because to say that his books are somewhat critical of the indonesian elite and the soeharto government would be an understatement….
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that’s pretty harsh euy, stomach cancer
Well I dunno if actually worked but probably about effective of paying the police the same to investigate.
Actually yes, I have read all of Kerry’s books and if you have tad more than superficial knowledge of the names and places business and politics wise it was a lot of fun working out who he was referring to. Lets face it, he was not very cagey about it. After reading the bio, he seems to resemble one of his shady expat characters in the books.
The Dayaks still have a very strong reputation and ask any Java wife how she feels about her husband going to work in Kalimantan. I have a mate who married a Dayak girl and I have always admired her back tattoos (all done with bamboo and sticks). However the real story was when they tied the knot officially. Travel up the river and lo and behold there is the Mother in Law, head to toe in tattoos including the face tattoos. We even got to visit the skulls. Simply amazing and a little scary, as I said to the mate “I would think very very carefully before I played up on this girl my friend”
And yes the Dayaks and Kalimantan have been right, royally shafted more than a lot of other provinces. That said, they can still rally to be a force to be reckoned with. Heaven help Jakarta if they ever get a real charismatic leader to rally behind as a group.
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i might be wrong, but the feeling i get, after reading his bio is that he probably was one of those shady characters indeed, was in with the important people to know and then probably got cheated the hard way with some big housing project or something and then vented his anger by writing all this stuff about all those people, but like i said, i could be completely wrong of course but sounds very plausible to me 🙂
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By the way and totally off topic (but in the absence of Patrick and the shroud of Turin). If you like Bio’s. Read “One Crowded Hour” . It’s about a combat photographer Neil Davis who reported on any number of SE Asian wars and Coups including Vietnam.
A real old time adventurer, who had more wives, g/friends and reading between the lines not a little knowledge of the drug trade. Yet when he died, they found he had been donating his entire pay for years to one the Vietnam Orphanage. He prefered travelling with the ROK and SVA as he considered the Australians and US a sideshow to the real war.
Bizarrely he filmed his own death and his last words were “Aww Shit” -
Patrick says:
A new religion is emerging, started by two English comediennes, (but of course) as congregations of believers are meeting in large mega church type auditoriums to worship NOTHING!!! They come by hundreds, they say, not knock God believers but to congregate with other non-believers and celebrate life without God. They are proud to point out that the amount of people attending Church is down significantly in the last ten years and that an increasing number of Americans are losing their faith in God. However, they fail to mention that as church attendance has dropped there has been an increase in crime and single family households. As our country, more and more, embraces so called “Humanist” ideals such as homosexual marriage we are unfortunately losing our way and being led down a path that will be the ruin of our nation. The motto of the Atheist Congregation is “Live Better, Help Often and Wonder More. It makes me wonder how will we live better as the nation continues to decline along with church attendance? It makes me wonder how we will help more as it’s already been pointed out that major studies indicate that atheists give much less of their income than God believing people. Yes it makes me wonder what folly will come next from these so called humanists?
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kripik says:
It makes me wonder why are you so afraid?
Nations that have adopted humanism, same-sex marriages and lifestyles, heavy taxes, strong public social services and low religious profiles (socialist nanny states in US terms) are not ruined but are topping the list in human well-being.
Good examples are the Scandinavian nations. Key elements are effort, pragmatism, inventiveness, tough-mindedness, transparency and constant thinking about self-organisation plus the notion that capitalism is a servant and not a master. That’s why they have largely escaped the economic problems of Southern Europe and indeed worldwide and the social problems plaguing the US.
Of course you can cling to your guns and religion. Or you can take these challenges head-on and try to adapt and invent a new solution. Human progress means using your brain. In terms of technology the US perhaps still have no peers, in terms of ideology they are so lagging behind.
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Kripic – spare us your leftist idealogy as what you say is only a distorted truth. The Scandinavian countries you have mentioned, and with all those admirable traits, all would rank in the bottom 10 poorest states if they were part of the USA. Their economies have managed to stay afloat largely because of their oil production. All of these countries also rank in the top 10 of countries with the highest suicide rates as the USA is ranked 18th. You must admit that is a dismal fact that clouds your argument and the USA ranking is a remarkable achievement for such a miserable country. 😀
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Patrick,
No country is free from problems and indeed Nordic countries have an above-average suicide rate but they’re not plagued with social ills in the way the US are.
Only Norway has oil revenues but is rapidly changing into a knowledge and service-driven economy like Sweden and Denmark.
This is not leftist ideology. Today, in the Nordics and Western Europe politics and society have very little to do with ideology like socialism and religion. They’re interested in a system that works and how to maintain and improve this. There is surprisingly little disagreement between left and right on public social services, access to health care and education, environmental issues, gender equality, LGBT rights. Immigration, finance and economy and the EU are the main topics and the classical left-right division is very hard to apply, if not impossible.
Call it what you want Patrick but there is plenty of material available on the net invalidating your fear. But you can always hide from the gay/atheist gangs under your bed with your shotgun… 🙂
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Patrick, to get back to your initial statement. If same-sex marriage and humanism are being increasingly adopted would that increase suicide rates? Do you think those are correlated to one another?
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Links somehow didn’t go through:
You can be put to death for atheism in 13 countries around the world
MUI: Atheis Tak Sesuai Asas Pancasila
Freedom of thought is at stake here….
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@ Kripic – ” humanism as defined by the dictionary – is an outlook or. System of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanists beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems”.
On the service the definition of humanism looks squeaky clean, tidy and rational but is it? First, it must be noted that Christianity has claimed that God can only act in a rational way in all matters and by definition God can never act irrationally. Interesting atheism seek to take the very ground that Christianity has claimed for more than 2000 years.
Can man throughout history claim that he (she) always acted rationally? The answer is a clear NO when we look at all the wars and atrocities committed during conflicts. Unfortunately, we can not even claim rationality today as we can watch on the nightly news fighting and hostile acts being committed by countries, groups and individuals around the world so it must be rejected that man is always able to act in a rational manner.
I presented through the years study after study that demonstrates beyond a shadow of a doubt why homosexuality is not only dangerous to society but to the very individuals caught up in the life style. Therefore is it rational to believe that homosexuality can ever carry the same benefits as heterosexual marriage? It cannot because heterosexual marriage benefits society through procreation while homosexual marriage only offers sexual pleasure and therefore that pursuit leads to an individual viewing such an arrangement as being beneficial only when their pursuit of pleasure is satisfied and that also explains the inability of homosexuals, by in large, as being unable to sustain long term relationships. Fidelity for the great majority of homosexual couples is not achievable. It’s the lifestyle that causes dysfunction and the feeling of separation from society and the social ills of increased rates of suicide, drug use, sexual partners and alcoholism.
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BrotherMouzone says:
“It’s the lifestyle that causes dysfunction and the feeling of separation from society and the social ills of increased rates of suicide, drug use, sexual partners and alcoholism.”
Agreed, Patrick. Feeling separated from society could have a huge negative impact on a group’s feelings of self-worth and overall well-being. I’m glad that, while we’ve come to this from different angles, we have arrived at the same conclusion that we need to accept our homosexual brethren, just as Jesus would have, and welcome them into society and the church.
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Hi Bro M, it’s been awhile, and while I can agree that society can indeed make an impact on an individual or a subgroup’s well being I must vehemently disagree with your rather unfounded assertion that Jesus would accept homosexuality and those practicing it into His Church. With that said, Jesus did come to save sinners and He would indeed welcome those people who renounced their homosexuality into His Church as He did with the adulteress when He forgave her and commanded her to sin no more.
If we read Romans 1, we learn through Paul, perhaps the greatest evangelist the Church has ever known and a reformed persecutor of Christians, that those who mock God and deny His existence will be led into homosexuality. “Therefore God handed them over to impurity through the lusts of their hearts for the mutual degradations of their bodies. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie and revered and worshiped the creature rather than the creator, who is blessed forever, Amen. Therefore, God handed them over to degrading passions . Their females exchanged natural relations for unnatural, and the males likewise gave up natural relations with females and burned with lust for one another. Males did shameful things with males and thus received in their own person the due penalty for their perversity. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God , God handed them over to their undiscerning mind to do what is improper. They were filled with every form of wickedness, evil, greed and malice, full of envy murder, rivalry, treachery and spite. They are gossips and scandalmongers and they hate God. They are insolent, haughty, boastful, ingenious in their wickedness and rebellious toward their parents. They are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. Although they know the just decree of God that all who practice such things deserve death, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.
(Romans II: 22 – 32 -
In the past we have discussed and debated the consistent morals of God and atheists have often countered that they can be very moral and have a keen sense of right and wrong. My response has been that God’s morals are never changing while atheist can change their position on any issue on a whim. Recently, I read a study conducted by Angus Reid Public Opinion, and entitled “American Public Opinion Differs Greatly From Canada and Britain”,that was presented in the Vancouver Sun Newspaper, and that backs up my argument that if people get to decide morals they will inevitably become different. The study found that morals between these English speaking countries were different in areas such as divorce, prostitution, and abortion but all the nations had a high percentage of respondents giving disapproval to infidelity. Capital punishment was viewed by the majority of Americans to be morally acceptable and was very unacceptable to the vast majority of Brits and Canadians.
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Me and my wife, we took over a backpacker hotel last year, the moritz in bandung (now new by moritz, its in quiet a few travel books, internet etc. so it made sense too keep the name). in the colonial time it was a dutch cemetery. i’ve never seen her but some of the staff and guides swear there’s a dutch lady with very long blond hair on the top floor walking around. downstairs a young woman with a very small child, all ghosts…. but like i said, i havent seen one yet!