Subversive Groups & Patriotism
Aug 14th, 2008, in Opinion, by RossRoss questions the motives of Islamic groups’ sensitivity over Papua.
Fanatics Don Patriotic Guise
The recent demos by the rabid Islamist movement known as Hizb ut Tahrir in Surabaya, Jakarta and Medan were remarkable not only for their peculiar choice of language for protest placards (i.e. Arabic, which very few Indonesians can read or speak except when quoting ‘scripture’) but also for the choice of grievance.
Hizb ut Tahrir at US Embassy in Jakarta, 9/8/2008.
Some American congressmen wrote a letter making the reasonable point that Papuans who fly their freedom flag don’t really merit immensely long prison sentences. (The same could also be said for Moluccans, but unfortunately Melanesians have more votes in the USA than migrants from Maluku.)
HT apparently decided the note was an infringement of Indonesia’s sovereignty, hence a lot of nasties with their Darth Vadar lookalike wives screaming on the streets. Farid Wadji of HTI read out a statement: hizbut-tahrir.or.id
We call for the Moslem in Papua to stand side by side with the Moslem all over Indonesia to reject the plan of the Kuffar Colonizer to separate the province from Indonesia. It is because this kind of separatist movement is a great sin before Allah SWT
But paradoxically, these Islamist bigots want to erase that sovereignty themselves, in favour of a universal Muslim Caliphate.
Farid Wadji
In the context of Western countries, many sensible people have argued that HT is thus open to charges of treason. Certainly they seem reluctant to urge British Muslims, for example, to serve in the UK armed forces if the fight happens to be with any cause which can be even vaguely termed Muslim, no matter how foul e.g. Saddam or the Taliban.
Indonesia, of course, prefers to ban innocent Ahmadiyah dissidents, leaving terrorist gangster groups (FPI) free to spread hatred and violence. So HT’s subversive views are not going to be checked by this government.
However, as an ostensibly ‘religious’ body, why is HT getting into a purely ethnic/political issue? Are they motivated because they want to see an intensification of the colonisation (and ipso facto Islamisation) of Papua? Or is it a move to expand their support base among the mass of Indonesians who are not fanatics but are usually very nationalistic?
With elections next year, this deserves scrutiny.
14 Comments on “Subversive Groups & Patriotism”
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Neil of Newcastle says:
Purba, my man, scathing, outrageous and oh so now! You’ve got it. ‘Virginibus puresque’.
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Oigal says:
Like a thousand monkeys banging away on thousand keyboards sooner or later if only by accident something rational has to result ..even if only for a nano-second..
PN said
Thus, i should be eradicated post haste.
To which we all agree and concur
Georgia is another good example of US Divide uh uh ..Russia invades and slaughters and its still dem dang yanks and da JOOOWS….OOOOOH!
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Sylvester says:
HT will do whatever do fulfil their objectives, including killing no matter non-Moslem or not, because the sacrifice is needed and they believe that their satanic allah will accept it.
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Purba Negoro says:
Oigal- an amusing typo wasn’t it?
Freudian slip perhaps?Not all of us have a life entirely devoted to computer voyeurisms.
“It was the Best of Times. It was the Blurst of times? You stupid monkey!”
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Someone please enlighten me.
These people urge the Papuan muslims to reject separation and preserve Indonesia’s sovereignity. And in another occasion they preach that Indonesian government should be abolished and is to be replaced by the Caliphate.
That reminds me. There are rumours circulating in recent times that religious people are not very good at logics.
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Ross says:
Fair point, Purba, I admit to a polemical style, as it often evokes more response than a dry analytical approach. But reviewing the responses, it seems most agree that HT is ‘not a good thing.’
Perhaps we should divert to the latest pandering to fanatics by Jakarta’s Tourism Head, Arie Budhiman, who announced in the JP yesterday that all night-time entertainment will stop for 30 full days, presumably because Muslims cannot be trusted to maintain their self-disciplined self-denial if a bar is open somewhere within five miles of them.
And this guy is trying to bring tourists to town? -
This person is an idiot trying desperately to cling to power before he is booted out.
Motivation: money.
According to CNN reportt on Indonesia recently (past fortnight I believe) a number of foreign commentators in Singapore stated SBY’s government has been mediocre at best.
Only Finance Minister Ibu Sri Mulyani Indrawati, although I must say very pretty and tendency to pout, escape criticise- she has done much against a lot of resistance. Shre market has responded well to her ministry.
I would single out corrupt parasite Pangestu- whose husband and also brother are now magically billionaires.
SBY is a staff soldier- not combat- and also an American puppet. So he lacks ability and initiative to command- unlike Pak Sutrisno, Pak Prabowo and Pak Sutiyoso.
Pak Sutiyoso is far less stupid than people paint him to be- you do not become Kommandant of key strategic post like KOSTRAD (Pak Suhartop’s former post) for being dim- however loyal one may be.
Mayor Wibowo has also been rather disappointing- promising much and much left unstarted.
Sutiyoso was better- which is comical to some. -
tomaculum says:
“I would single out corrupt parasite Pangestu- ”
Off course Purba, because she is Chinese, isn’t it? And what about the other corruptible ministers? Should they also be singled out? Or is it not so crook just because they are “pribumi”s?
And do you have any proof that MEP is corrupted?“whose husband and also brother are now magically billionaires.”
Are you sure they aren’t already rich before? If you sure, please write your sources, I will damne ME Pangestu too.“SBY is a staff soldier- not combat- and also an American puppet. ”
According to Gareng in this thread:
http://www.indonesiamatters.com/1893/self-promotion/
Prabowo Subianto, your hero, has undergo these trainings:
“ 1980 special training in Fort Braggs, USA”
“1985 short training stay in Fort Benning, USA”
And as you maybe know every training for foreign soldiers in the USA happens only with an agreement of CIA. -
Cukurungan says:
Kopral Geddoe said:
That reminds me. There are rumours circulating in recent times that religious people are not very good at logics.
Me :
Friend, that is only rumor but the real fact as we seen in this forums that non-religious people can’t use logic at all, even they can’t explain simple logic which appear the first in this world either chickens or egg.
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“Friend, that is only rumor but the real fact as we seen in this forums that non-religious people can’t use logic at all, even they can’t explain simple logic which appear the first in this world either chickens or egg.”
I ask myself if it is a logical answer of this question, if yes I’m sure Cukurungan can answer it (Because it is for him so simple.
I’m waiting for your answer, Cuk: chicken or egg? -
perseus says:
Secession is one of the most interesting of political topics. Personally, I am of the view that South Carolina had every legal and constitutional right to secede from the United States in 1860. If South Carolina had no right to secede then how come the counties that comprise what is now called West Virginia had a right to secede from Confederate Virginia?
I am also of the view that the North had a right to invade to free the slaves but this is not really why they invaded. They invaded to “uphold the Union” not to free the slaves. (Freeing the slaves was not a major item on the Northern agenda until 1863.)
Well, the short answer is that might makes right and it is not treason unless you lose (or have not won yet).
The case of Papua is that they are short on an mighty external ally intent on helping them secede. (South Ossetia and Abkhazia have Russia helping them so they will get what they want.) Australia is not really interested in West Papua seceding. Neither is the US. The Indonesians are paranoid and think that everyone in the region secretly wants them to break up. No one is really interested in Indonesia breaking up. People would prefer Indonesia to get its political act together and create a republic its minorities want to be part of. Certainly, in recent years we have seen improvements. Greater autonomy for the regions is a good start and the maintenance of secular rule is essential unless you want to be fighting some serious jihad in your archipelago to force the non-Muslim minorities into conversion.
Certainly the “Act of Free Choice” aka the Act Free of Choice by the political wits was as dodgy as a three pound note but as the notes between the powers that be stated at the time – West Papua was pretty much a Stone Age culture so what meaning could you attach to “democracy” being given to such primitives?
Well…. the “primitives” are not so primitive now. Many of them are educated enough to get elected and run the provinces of Irian Jaya. One wonders how a referendum on independence for West Papua would go if the question were put to the people without the threats of incarceration for “treason”. Bottom line is your political legitimacy in a democracy depends on being able to survive this sort of question. If you have to chuck people putting these questions and waving these flags in jail for 10 to 15 years, you are a tyranny and you can bluster about international law until you are blue in the face…
In Australia you can fly a Torres Strait Islander Flag, you can fly an Aboriginal Flag, you can call for the secession of Western Australia from the rest of Australia and people will not chuck you in jail for 10 to 15 years. You will get a polite hearing and be politely ignored because no one is seriously interested in breaking away from Australia. Well some of the blackfellas might be but I am not aware of any serious secession movement amongst the Aboriginals or the Islanders.
The report of the International Crisis Group makes for interesting reading. Papua is “not a happy place”. Would it be happier as an independent state or would it be another Melanesian problem nation like the Solomon Islands? Could be the pro-independence Papuans have a serious case of the grass is greener on the other side and their aspirations if realized could be disappointing.
I do find it unsatisfying that a mob of diplomatic worthies can quietly brush the aspirations of millions of people into the “too hard – no one is interested basket”. People are interested in self-determination. It is a basic human right as per the UN Declaration. The question will not go away.
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Too late for your moral angst dilemmas now, whitey.
Every major international organisation fully recognises Indonesia’s legal ownership of our territory of Irian Jaya- the Great Coveted.Indonesia’s legal ownership is so utterly water-tight, the US and Russia compete for access to it for submarine plans.
I think in the utterly ridiculous hyopthetical Irians will have a case of East Timorese disappointment- their “saviours” will turn out far worse than their “oppressors”.
But- Irian is Indonesian forever more. Quoth the raven.
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Darth Sidartouw says:
Hey Purba Negoro, if you don’t know anything why don’t you shut up?
MEP corrupted? For heaven’s sakes! Are you out of your mind?
whose husband and also brother are now magically billionaires
FIRST OF ALL, her brothers and husband WERE already rich before!
Her first brother, Tikki P was already the Research Policy & Cooperation Department in the World Health Organization way before she became a minister. Hm i don’t know, maybe JUST maybe, he’s rich.
Her other brother, Pingky P.has already been a well-known architect and a businessman since ages ago. Who do you think created Bintaro? BSD? The Pakubuwono Residence?
And lastly, her husband. He was the Marketing Director of Schlumberger in Texas, and now he is the Director of Shanghai Axal To IC Card Technologies Co Ltd.
So yes, ALL of them were already rich BEFORE she became a minister.AND just for your information, do you think MEP actually gains money from this job? BELIEVE ME, her salary was heaps bigger before. WHY did she take this job? To honor her father and for the good of this country!
So stop saying rubbish, if you don’t know a thing.
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An interesting article- but I argue it borders on the polemic and biased.
I would argue that whatever the motive- the Indonesian Constitution defines Indonesia as Secular Nationalist. Therefore any Darul Islaamiyah Baru is illegal and seditious by definition.
Thus, i should be eradicated post haste.
Furthermore, the American Senator has nothing valid to comment on as the matter pertains purely to Indonesian law and outside whatever knoweldge or expertise he may claim.
Moreover, as a US Senator who most likely approved the Halliburton-Unocal-KBR Oil Robbbery and or the Camp X-Ray and CIA torture centres, impingement of US citizens’ Constituional rights, illegal phone-tapping etc it is very clear he has no solid ground whatsoever to stand on.
Quite obviously, this highlights a history of US-US affiliated NGO agitation to foment separatists for their corporate “johns’ ” economic gain.
Past behaviour is the best determinate of future behaviour- thus as we saw with America’s attempts at breaking the Republic and Allen Pope’s confessions re Sumatera in 1957- we see again.
Georgia is another good example of US Divide et Impera separatism strtegy. Yet again- it “blewback”- just like Tim Osman/Osama bin Laden- I believe the correct CIA terminology is.
Caught red-handed again. Will the Imperialist Great Satan ever learn?