Wahabi & Wahhabism
Nov 11th, 2008, in News, by Patung
The Justice Party-PKS is not a bringer of Saudi Arabian Wahabi Islam to Indonesia, says its leader.
The President of the Justice Party, Partai Keadilan Sejahtera (PKS), Tifatul Sembiring said in Aceh recently that his party was not Wahabi (the extremely strict form of Islam that is dominant in Saudi Arabia), as many accused of it being:
The PKS is clearly not Wahabi.
He said the party was simply based on the Quran and hadiths, and, to prevent its members having any misunderstandings about Islam, a minimum of 60% of the Party’s governing council (Majelis Syuro) had to have some formal education in Islam.
Tifatul Sembiring.
He added that the PKS had no intention of attempting to eliminate the wide variety of religious traditions in Indonesia, presumably whether within Islam itself, or other religions. inilah
79 Comments on “Wahabi & Wahhabism”
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Aluang Anak Bayang says:
@ Abdul Khalid al Jumhuri
Later on, still in the same town, he dropped me as friend because he was interested more to the friendship of the Wahabi circle there: students from the Middle East.
I am not at all surprised. With a mouthful of awful Arab sounding name, I would be ashamed standing next to a fellow Indonesian who thinks he is Arab.
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dragonwall says:
OMG
Iran is light years ahead of China in every possible measurable field.
It can also build its’ own rockets without dusting off 35 year old Soyuz crates.Like building castles in the air?
It also has the most 6+ star hotels in the world- it’s a beautiful nation- you should visit.
Like Hotel Al Howmany. What kind of stars were they? Of pebbles and rocks?
Halliburton is a big investor- so plenty of white money for to earn from your well-experienced bokong bencong (gay butt).
I do suppose Haliburtonwas stucked there since long ago and that things are mostly none tangible, of course they will stay there with the protection of the US government.
What would PKI do in Indonesia- using China and Russia as good scenario for estimate? Kill tens of millions. Not merely as Sukarno himself stated 60,000.
I didn’t see any statistic to the tens and twenty millions of your claim.
thought too much, wore mismatching socks- would be dead- maybe in the same hole.
Right your wore mismatching socks and think too much, thinking you are the smartest.
And you are so stupid to think Sukarno and Suharto were enemies. No- far from it- they knew each other well from 1942. Many mutual friend like Hatta, Juandah, Joyosarono, Sujarwo, Saroyoyowidono, Nasution, Wibowo, Kusumaamadjaya, Daradjatun father, Sukarjo (funeral I just attend) Sri Gust Hangkubuwana X himself.
Did anyone say they were enemies? Or is that you think too much and starting to have fantasies.
Every single one hate the Chinese- even Mbak Mega. She is just clever to show you idiot CHinese a smiling face- and so quickly you run to lick her feet- she hates Kwik Kian Gie- he is a liar, a theif and a turncoat- now he says he is a Golkar Bitch.
Her is what is all about, right. SO you finally admitted that bar none. KKG may not be that smart after all, so he might need people like you to be by his side to teach him something.
I thought he hate Akbar Tanjung so very much- but obviously not enough to kiss his ring at last Golkar Tim Sukses meeting.
Like being a godfather. Have you been with Akbar Tanjung?
Only Gus Dur like because he is banging his Chinese masseuse while getting millions in Chinese bribe.
SO he is getting millions in Chinese bribe? Have you ever got a chance to meet or sit down and talk things with him one on one? I guess not. So what you are is sheer conjecture like what Rob says of you which I think is of a split personality. This moment you behave like someone big in the ABRI but actually you are a GD Man and on the other you behave more like a woman lick spittle those whom you think that favors your matrix.
So I guess it is about time to remove the MSG from your diet so that you do not suffer from acute inferior complex that is affecting you more poorly.
And I guess you are also right, You are what you eat, yes too much pork will make you a pig. It must have been stupid for you to say this. Better a krebo. How can a PIG like you become a Krebo. Even if you are then it must be a blind krebo.
Coward.. You know why I kept telling you that you are a coward, a discriminator, a traitor, full of propaganda. I you need to know just ask and I will explain that to you picking up from all the thread one after another.
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muhammad ali says:
All those who call PKS as Wahabi are very ignorant of the Islamic movement prevalent world wide and also in the halagats (islamic study circles) in the campus mosques in Indonesia.
PKS has its affiliation to the Islamic Brotherhood (Ikhwanul Muslimin) originated in Egypt who have their own prominant figures among others Hasan Al Banna and Ibn Qutb (ra). Those on the other hand who affiliate to Muhammad ibn Wahhab (which you would call Wahabi) actually call themselves Salafi. Between the PKS and Salafis, there are differences pertaining to the methdology of the dakwah, often resulting into disputed issues in the islamic halaqats.
Salafis (or Wahabi) will not participate in the so called democratic political parties. Their main focus is grass root education on Tauhid (Islamic monotheism) as was the focus of all the Prophets. So the fact that PKS is a political party is obvious – to those who study islamic movements – that they are not Wahabi (followers of Muhammad ibn Wahhab (ra).
Now there is a great difference between Salafi and Terorrism. For this discussion, the the International Crisis Group has made a very thorough study titled “Why Salafism and Terrorism Mostly Don’t Mix.”
I myself used to be a member in the PKS halaqats during my university years but Alhamdulillah, by the grace of Allah, I have turned to the turest form of Islam – Manhaj Salafiyah.
But I guess, either PKS and Salafiyah (wahabi) don’t make any difference to anybody Islamophobic. Doesn’t matter. The main point is PKS is not the so called Wahabi.
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Hary says:
I am not Islamophobic. I do agree that Wahabism is one form of Salafism. I cannot agree that there is any place in modern Indonesia politics for any political party having affiliation to Wahabism.
Because;
1. Wahabism condemns ” taqlid”. G-d gave us a mind to think and to reason.
2. Wahabism’s approach is to compel and not to urge. Moderate Islam cajoles and exhorts Muslims to do right. Wahabism compels. There is no choice. Look at the religious police in Saudi Arabia, Taliban Afghanistan and Iran. The FPI is bad enough. A Wahabi linked party will be all for compulsion and use of force to ensure compliance of the population to set behavioural and moral norms determined by their own interpretation.
3. Wahabism preaches the imitation of the first three generations of Muslim. This is unrealistic. It takes no account of differences in society, tradition and historical context. To simply transplant 7th Century Arabic way of life would mean certain disaster for Indonesia.
4. Wahabism rejects all other forms of Islam. You only need to read their literature to see the hate they have for other moderate Muslims.
5. Wahabism rejects “democracy”. There is no concept of democracy in the writings of Al- Wahab. In fact, they blame democracy for all the ills of their times.PKS is funded by the movement. It is naive to think they will not heed their master’s call if they are in power. Lets call a spade a spade.
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Barry Prima says:
That should at least solve the problem of Islamic fundamentalism in Indonesia.
If only it was that simple.
I have never been as proud of the man as I was when I read his post that day.
I would hope for your sake that you should have other things to be more proud about and have a life outside Im forum..You are not a Muslim nor Indonesian, nor do you live there, and if you are one of those who goes to Indonesia for pussy as you said elsewhere, then i hope you continue to live with the fear of being blown to bits.
All politicans here are rubbish… corrupts… immorality…
All politicians everywhere are rubbish…actually so are all people everywhere rubbish too and morally hypocritical..Including moi…that hardly means anything..its easy to point the finger.
Let see countries whose majority of the population are buddhists (or related), Japan or Taiwan for example
That would also include: Tibet. Cambodia, Thailand Burma etc…Religion is just one of many factors, in fact one of the less significant ones.
The majority of Japanese are not in any discernible way Buddhist…in terms of religious affiliation/sensibility Shintoism acknowledged or not has had a hugh impact on Japanese psyche and Japans politics in relation to other countries including Indonesia in a way that has been for the most part very negative.Ah, and let’s not forget China
Unless your Tibetan.uighar or a muslim…20 years of seeming progress (at a Hugh moral and human cost ) does not suddenly make a hundred years of suppression ok.
Be religious if you like (turkey)
It’s never that simple.. You can’t be religious if you like in turkey either… One of my friends was continuously verbally abused for wearing peci in Turkey…..religion is banned from many aspects of Turkish society.
You talk rubbish here. WTF, convert, otherwise be silent?
Basically don’t try to tell Indonesians or Muslims how they should run their country, unless you become a muslim yourself and can understand their world view. Your ideas about democracy/freedom etc have no meaning for them. Let Muslims and Indonesians fight their own battles.
Hary..pretty much in agreement with everything you said, but ill just elaborate on this before someone else takes you to task for it.
Everything else has been man made rules and interpretations
Yes and no, there’s a lot more in the Quran (forget the hadiths for now) than the five pillars But i guess yes overall as the way the qurans injunctions have been understood balanced and prioritised is definitely man made. It is very difficult to establish exactly what Shariah law is, which is very fortunate.
I have turned to the truest form of Islam – Manhaj Salafiyah.
The sooner people get over this idea of the truest form of Islam, the better. There’s no such thing, there never was golden age, the sahabbas were killing each other as soon as Nabi Muhammed passed away. Even Muhammad (pbuh) arguably kept the true reality of his message hidden and revealed it to Ali and not Umar.
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diego says:
Basically don’t try to tell Indonesians or Muslims how they should run their country, unless you become a muslim yourself and can understand their world view. Your ideas about democracy/freedom etc have no meaning for them. Let Muslims and Indonesians fight their own battles.
WTH? The ideas about Freedom / democracy do have meaning for me, and I’m Indonesian, and I’m _not_ a muslim. I’m sure freedom / democracy has meaning for many other Indonesians.
Are you saying non-muslim indonesians don’t count? Are you saying muslim indonesians who support freedom / democracy don’t count?
Mind you, many posters here are Indonesians. They have the rights to decide how to their country should be ran.
Are you saying for them to be able to decide how to run their country, they’d have to convert to islam first?
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Are you saying for them to be able to decide how to run their country, they’d have to convert to islam first? –> Are you saying for them to be able to decide how to run their country, they’d have to convert to islam first (and specifically the flavor of islam that has problems with freedom/democracy)?
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I’m sure freedom / democracy has meaning for many other Indonesians.
Are you saying non-muslim indonesians don’t count? Are you saying muslim indonesians who support freedom / democracy don’t count?The concept of freedom and democracy within Islam is different to the western concept, as muslims are the majority in Indonesia to advocate a system which is contrary to their understanding of reality is impracticable. It’s as foolish as muslims in western countries asking for shairah law.
Democracy in the western sense only makes sense in the context of their personal history, not the history of asian countries.
As for converting, please don’t…it’s important in the development of any country that there is a diversity in religion and politics…but expecting a democracy along western lines is would not only be unfeasible, but would also be in a manner of speaking undemocratic in Indonesia.
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ET says:
@ PN
The military remains the sole institution in the nation who deals regularly with the very lowest base unit of Indonesian society and thus understands its’ mentality and needs- as well as best future path for the krebo.
This has been proven time and again with concrete result.How? By raping and killing in the outer islands?
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Purba Negoro says:
ET
Provide facts that will stand up in court instead of uncorroborated peasant anecdote. and NGO masturbation fodder.The Ambonese and Malukunese thugs are the ones shooting and hacking at each other- they are the ones who make up the Polisi there.
The military are more interested in running the legitimate fishing businesses with Japanese partners.Besides- outlying islands are devoid of any resouce aside from the marine and submarine.
The Islanders are very ugly with poor hygiene- who would rape them- these men have beautiful Javanese, Sundanese, Balinese, Buginese, Batak and so on wife.
Islanders are afraid of western medicine, cigarette lighter only 20 years ago and distrasut education- very backward primitive people.
They have no skills, work poorly and no useful knowledge- so what is motivation to enslave them?
None.Sorry- on closer examination- Western NGO propaganda is proven to be total fabricated nonsense.
Go to Amsterdam and tell your NGO to at least print the name places with correct spelling.
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It still give me the creeps to notice that the army, call it ABRI or TNI, is needed against their own compatriotes in order to keep the peace, unity and – like you seem to insinuate – law and order. I was educated with the notion that armies are needed for border protection and for enforcement of international affairs only and are to be avoided as becoming a state in a state.
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Michael grosso says:
I will vote for PKS… THIS is THE REAL INDONESIA FUTURe..
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Astrajingga says:
This Purba Negoro is thinking in a Soeharto’s New Order way. Seeing his red-berret, I think he’s Prabowo himself, or at least Fadli Zon, or whoever maniacal-tyrannic-minded enough to support people like Prabowo’s or Soeharto’s way of thinking.
Congratulation Pak Prabowo to be VP candidate, hope you don’t win though.
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Odinius says:
@Astrajingga
Purba is no longer with us. Apparently, he wasn’t even Indonesian. Don’t know the whole story, but recall it’s a bit stranger than the typical IM method acting.
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The more I scrutinize each commenter’s English, the more I recognize who isn’t Indonesian. If they speak damn good English, they’re not Indonesian, IMHO.
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Cukurungan says:
Purba is no longer with us. Apparently, he wasn’t even Indonesian. Don’t know the whole story, but recall it’s a bit stranger than the typical IM method acting.
Purba is Indonesian and Javanese here from his blog:
Hometown:
Surabaya
Neighborhood:
Pondok Indah
I Belong To:
Angkatan Bersenjata Republik Indonesia sampai mati
When I’m Not on Topix:
Di bakar wong cina
Read My Forum Posts Because:
They are worthy of reading
I’m Listening To:
Suara wong cina di api
Read This Book:
Suharto: Pahlawan
Favorite Things:
Dead Irian, dead Timorese
On My Mind:
Merah Putih
I Believe In:
Majapahit Empire of Indonesia Crush Malaysia Crush Singapore Crush Australia
but Purba is ultra racist Javanese who think that Chinarand He was Arek SuroboyoPatung fabrication to give impresion that Javanese is not racist -
Stinger says:
What a crazy and dangerous person this Purba, he would be a good candidate to run a concentration camp.
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camion says:
(Purba)
or better still,a benevolent dictator who would not tolerate all the current or alternative bullshit from all the corrupt & greedy vested interests………if only there was a position vacant for him,I like much of what he spruiks. :-)) There is only one thing that will really change Indonesia for the better for all & that doesnt bear thinking of…
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Nah, if AAB is correct and the Javanese will not, cannot, and do not except Wahhabism then why the worry about the PKS. Surely they will not be able to get the numbers to be a success because people will see through their public pronouncements to their Wahhabi core. And, then not vote them into national office.
Chris…I would have thought that if the PKS leadership was serious about convincing the general Indonesian public about their intentions with regards to the separation of religion and state (in the PKS sense it would not be Church and State but Mosque and State) then it would not only have listened to you but also adopted your suggestions. From what I can see they have not adopted that position.