Sharia Application
Aug 22nd, 2007, in News, by PatungSharia can be applied without making Indonesia an Islamic state.
Fuad Amsyari of the Crescent Star Party, Partai Bulan Bintang (PBB), said in Jakarta on 21st August that the basic form of the state, Pancasila, did not need to be changed in order that sharia be applied. Instead, every law that was made could incorporate Islamic law.
It was a mistake to think that sharia application depended on an Islamic state, he said, and there was nothing in Pancasila that prevented sharia law from being applied in Indonesia. Every government policy and law could employ sharia, he said, and no discrimination against non-Muslims would occur.
There will be no discrimination because in Islam there can be no discrimination.
Another PBB leader, Sahar L. Hassan, agreed that sharia could be adopted without altering the constitution, and hoped that it could be applied at the level of the state, however, someone convicted of theft in an area for which the state was responsible would not suffer hand amputation, but in ordinary theft cases hand amputation would occur.
Meanwhile, in the interests of the further application of sharia law, the PBB is inviting clerics from throughout the country and well-known figures such as Muhammadiyah leader Din Syamsuddin, NU leader Hasyim Muzadi, Majelis Ulama Indonesia leader Ma’ruf Amin, Siddiq Amin of Persatuan Islam (Persis), and representatives of Dewan Dakwah, Hizbut Tahrir Indonesia, Dewan Masjid Indonesia, Ikatan Wanita Muslimat Indonesia, and the Badan Komunikasi Pemuda Remaja Masjid Indonesia (BKPRMI), to attend a meeting in Bogor, 24-26th August.
During this meeting it is hoped that ways to apply sharia in all aspects of life can be discussed, as well as the means of bringing this about, and specific proposals that can be put to the government and parliament. republika
246 Comments on “Sharia Application”
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Pieter says:
Jokoboyo,
Please leave Sint Nicolaas (Santa for the non Dutch among us) alone?
If not I will start a petition to have as of this year Sint Nicolaas and Santa clean shaved. Bearded people being very suspicious in the West now days!Wasalam,
Pieter -
Tomaculum says:
“When the westerners of USA & European countries declare in their countries that during the Easter, the good Friday, the Santa Claus 5th Dec & X’mas celebration are national holiday which they will off the business for 2 months cumulatively, there is no protest against it from their group of minorities such as the Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu believers, thus it goes smoothly.”
I don’t know such plan, and I live in a western country. So please not joking and blaming, blaming, blaming, Jokoboyo. It is useless for your country. 🙂“In the most populous Muslim country of Indonesia”
You mean surely the country with the most moslems living in it, don’t you? As far as I know Indonesia isn’t a Muslim country (till now 🙂 ).“Indonesia perhaps too liberal, democratic & generous to the minority groups.”
Ha, ha, ha, ha …… Ooops, you’re not joking, are you???? (I don’t mean the word too, but the words liberal, democratic and generous).Pieter,
zwarte Piet is less suspicious, isn’t he (cause he doesn’t hve beard)??? 🙂 -
tomaculum,
I did not dare mentioning “Zwarte Piet” out of fear being called a racist!
Pieter
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Ha, ha, ha, Pieter, you got it!!
It is good to communicate with people able to think and to understand what one means. 🙂
But … aren’t everyone of us a little bit racist?? 🙂 -
Cukurungan says:
Jokoboyo,
In the most populous Muslim country of Indonesia, we want the syairah islam law implementation then the minorities are rejecting violently & aggressively like this? Please common us your common sense brothers! It is very natural Indonesia will opt for syairah law, so be it “¦ why you guys so oppose to it? In anyway 90% of us are Muslim, so what? Are you all blind folded or pretend you don’t know the fact?
Cukurungan :
I almost don’t believe with my own eyes if this kind of words is wrote by the wise man of mas Jokoboyo.
I didn’t see something special or violence tones in the post have been written by the gentlemen/women in this forums. They were just expressing their hopeless and frustration about the bleak future life under sharia.
However, I let you know that Sharia Law won’t be applied at once for all in here, instead we will insert it on bit by bit or “perda” by “perda” such as “perda anti maksiat”, ” perda berpakaian layak” and so on.
So once day, we haven’t realized that actually sharia already in place with different name.
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Cukurungan,
the next Perda is: Perda anti berfikir (sendiri). 🙂 (In english: edict against thinking (independently)) 🙂 -
Cukurungan,
And we can send Zwarte Piet from Holland for caning the sinners! Since he will be out of a job soon he could come as expat to Indo!
Pieter
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Falcon says:
In the year 2015, countries in south east asia are going through the formation of south east asia economic community. We all should wonder whether shariah will leave Indonesia out of the south east asia community picture or the idea will be abolished permanently. However, the minority community will likely be larger.
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Julita says:
It is a luxury for me to sit in front of the computer. I have a household and family comes first. So I will answer in time, one by one.
Jlta said: Christ on the cross FORGAVE the good thief Luke 23-43. ‘This day thou shalt be with me in paradise.”
Aluang: I have to correct you. Prophet Esa (Jesus) pbuh did not DIE on the cross. Allah swt replaced him with someone else.
Jlta: The verb in the above is FORGAVE not DIE. So, I am the one correcting you now. Anyway I know what you are getting at. I have all in file what I need is time.
One question. How do you or the genius know that Allah swt replace Jesus with someone else.
_________________Aluang: In Islam, woman has a high status which no past nation ever achieved. For instance in Christianity the women were regarded as someone who did not even have a soul. Islam does justice to both men and women.
Woman has a high status
Jlta: Read the following:
Men have authority over women. (Koran 2:228)
In the home: “Men have authority over women because Allah has made the one superior to the others, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them.” (Koran 4:34)
Jlta: What do we do with the many Moslem Women doctors we have now?
__________________-Women do not have equal right to their inheritance (Koran 4:11-12)
Women who disobey should be beaten:
“Good women are obedient…. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them.” (Koran 4:34)
_________________
Jlta: The above is definitely not our Indonesian culture. Just assuming ‘fear of disobedience’, not proven guilty. How about if the man is full of jealousy and the wife is very pretty and attractive to everybody’s eyes. My, my poor woman it will be hell on earth.
____________
Islam also allows sexual intercourse with one’s slave maids and as many ‘captive’ women as one desires (Koran 4:3) – even if those women are married.
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Jlta: The above is not an Indonesian culture. For those who love this treatment, it is your life, not mine, but please don’t impose it on others who are in a much better position.
____________
Aluang: For instance in Christianity the women were regarded as someone who did not even have a soul.Jlta: Did you quote it from the Holy Bible? Never heard about this; please, We need your explanation and rference..
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Sylvester says:
However, I let you know that Sharia Law won’t be applied at once for all in here, instead we will insert it on bit by bit or “perda” by “perda” such as “perda anti maksiat”, ” perda berpakaian layak” and so on.
So once day, we haven’t realized that actually sharia already in place with different name.
Just like a thieve.
But non-moslem are not stupid. Sharia is an evil, made by devil for their own sake. -
Djoko says:
You know its all going downhill when people from different religions start quoting their opposite numbers verses as if theyre some kind of expert (Muslims ripping out quotes from the Bible and non-Muslims from the Qur’an).
Perhaps people are unaware of the massive debates that are going on about these verses (or which have gone on in the past in the case of Christianity in particular). I’m particularly interested in Julita’s extensive quoting of a few Qur’anic verses there. I suppose she has read the original in Arabic, is fluent in Arabic enough to understand the intricacies of the language, has read historical arguments over the meaning of individual words (theres a massive debate for example over the meaning of the words which are translated as ‘leaders of’ for example) in said verse made by scholars, understood it in the context in which it was originally revealed, compared it to the different schools of thought which exist, read it in light of new interpretative works put out by progressive Muslim scholars and then seen varying opinions by different individual scholars who are currently alive on the matter before posting it up and declaring that according to Islam verse A means X.
Or then again maybe she just googled ‘Islam sucks’ and copy and pasted the first thing she saw. Much the same way as some Muslims seem to google ‘Christianity sucks’ and post up all manner of Bible quotations to support the idea the Islam is superiority to Christianity.
Quoting from websites like ‘answering-islam’ and ‘answering-Christianity’ is a waste of time because both sites have a clear agenda (to discredit the other religion) and thus sacrifice pretty much any scholarly value they may or may not have.
It is interesting though (after having looked at the forums here for a while before eventually posting bits and pieces) how each and every topic about Islam or religion (there are quite a few) seems to eventually degenerate into a back and forth of ‘Islam sucks’, ‘no Christianity sucks’ until eventually a new topic is posted where people can essentially copy and paste the same responses they sent one another in the previous topic about how much Islam or Christianity sucks.
Do people get tired of doing this? Just an idle question.
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Aluang Anak Bayang says:
Dear mbak Julita, thank you for your response. However I see that you had misunderstanding in regard to the cruxification of Prophet Isa. Christians were evil (sorry no offence) because they worshipped an evil man stapled on some wooden cross. Check this out,
“they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them” (Qur’an 4:156)
Judas, not Jesus, was crucified on the cross, in a case of mistaken identity. Judas Iscariot, the betrayer and thief, is the real saviour of Christians. It was Judas who actually died on the cross and because Judas had a similar physical appearance to Jesus even his own mother didn’t recognize him as she wept at the foot of the cross. For 600 years Christians had been preaching Christ crucified. Then prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) comes along, and gets a direct revelation from God setting the recoed straight – all the the 10,000 manuscripts of the Bible, are wrong.
I will explain the rest of your misconception when time permit. Salam.
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Shorty said: provided we respect and defend each other, what’s wrong with you do your thing, I’ll do mine?
Jlta: Excellent, I applaud your above statement. I mainly clarify your misunderstanding.
about “I’ll become Catholic so that I can go to confession and keep all my bits!”
It has the twinge of undermining the great value for Catholics.Take care.
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Janma says:
Djoko!
Kudos…. couldn’t have said it better myself! Monday morning and a breath of fresh air!Janma.
*tired of it too* -
Colson says:
@Djoko: Yours is the only one appropriate comment. You’re quite right. So let’s stop this bickering of closed minded letter fetishists.
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they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them” (Qur’an 4:156)
Judas, not Jesus, was crucified on the cross, in a case of mistaken identity. Judas Iscariot, the betrayer and thief, is the real saviour of Christians. It was Judas who actually died on the cross and because Judas had a similar physical appearance to Jesus even his own mother didn’t recognize him as she wept at the foot of the cross. For 600 years Christians had been preaching Christ crucified. Then prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) comes along, and gets a direct revelation from God setting the recoed straight – all the the 10,000 manuscripts of the Bible, are wrong.
Christian never bother what moslem believe but moslem always get irritated about Jesus resurrection?
The point is if moslem believe it, it means mohammed is lower than Jesus.
So, to avoid that, mohammed and his follower fabricated the bible, torah, etc, mix it into one = al quran. -
proof or at least provide a link.
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where did you get the information that Judas looked exactly like Jesus, to the point that his own mother couldn’t tell them apart….
Proof or provide a link you hypocrite! -
Dear mbak Janma, please do not resort to name-calling before you give me a chance to provide proof.
Allah punished him by making him look like Jesus.
Salam.
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Sylvester Says:
Just like a thieve.
But non-moslem are not stupid. Sharia is an evil, made by devil for their own sake.Cukurungan :
I always remember with my whiteman friend advice to me.
He said “hey my brown man friend ” please do whatever it take that something be opposed
by the whiteman because it must be good for your country and please reject any recommendations made by the whiteman because it will make no goods to your country. -
Sylvester Says:
Christian never bother what moslem believe but moslem always get irritated about Jesus resurrection?
The point is if moslem believe it, it means mohammed is lower than Jesus.Cukurungan :
Actually , God explanation in Quran just to clarify that Jesus is the real prophet and not an magician who killed himself but not death ….we don’t want our beloved prophet is lowered under level of David Blance and/or David Coperfield who didn’t die even exposed 24 hours in blocks of ice.
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Janma Says:
whitemen haven’t paid back yet”¦.. that’s why they poured millions of dollars into relief for all your tsunami’s, natural disasters, schools and education etc etc etc etc”¦..
and borrowing religions from the Jews”¦. now that’s something Mohammad never did hey?
Think AgainCukurungan :
Madam Janma I do think again and now I get some figure of cost need to be paid back by the whiteman. The whiteman shall pay $60 million on every of our Muslim brother killed during Occupation. So you can imagine how little the millions dollars poured for those relief assistance by the whiteman compared with their obligations. Please be noted I haven’t yet reckoned the wealth already looted and stolen from this country by the whiteman
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Sputjam says:
The Muslims got the wrong idea concerning messages in the koran, during the time of Mohamed, the Arabs was already worshipping stones.
God states very clearly in the koran transmitted through Mohamed that pagan worship is sinful.
God clearly states that you can contact Him 24hrs a day, anytime, anywhere, in the koran. you do not have to be in temples, mosques, churches to communicate with Him. And you can contact Him facing any direction, not neccesarily mecca alone.
None of the previous prophets collected any money from the masses, so how come Muslims are required to contribute towards a religiouts tithe(zakat fitrah).The Koran states very clearly that the Arabs were hypocrites, not the bedouins as the traditionalist says.
The Arabs wanted Mohamed to alter the contents in the koran, and he almost did. Had he done that, according to the koran, God would have him punished. The Arabs after Mohamed introduce the hadith and sunnah in order to deceive.
There are no 5 daily prayer rituals stipulated in the koran. Why are Muslims wasting their time and effort on this. No friday prayer nor any method of ritual praying.
Put on your thinking caps and stop doing things you are not required to do.What makes you think Mohamed was successful in converting the Arabs to God’s way when Jesus and moses failed. In fact, it is the other way round. The Arabs have successfully deceived several hundred million people to embrace their pagan religion.
Religion is not in any part of God’s messages. Trust God, have faith in Him and do good and righteous deeds. That is all you require. No praying nor fasting nor paying zakat nor doing the Haj. And never take clerics/priest as your leader. For God is too glorious to have partners.
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Assalamualaikum mas Sputjam, re,
…..The Arabs wanted Mohamed to alter the contents in the koran, and he almost did…..
Mohammad (peace be upon him) did not alter the content, but Sputjam (peace be upon him) successfully did. See verse below.
Letters in bold do not exist in Q2:221. You sneaked it in.
Q2:221 And do not marry the pagan women until they believe. And do not marry the underage girls“¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦.
All sources from the Quran, Hadith, Sira, and other Islamic writings related that this “Islamic” wife beating is physical and painful. You added ‘lightly’ after ‘beat them’.
Q4:34
….. send them to beds apart and beat them lightly. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. Surely God is high, supreme……
I wonder if the CIA or Jew pay you to do this. Salam.
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dewaratugedeanom says:
Pieter said
“¦The local appointed agent did add shameful amounts to the local bills to be redistributed to the officials.
Would be nice to know who is this local appointed agent and which officials are involved. Can’t you give us a clue Pieter?
Djoko said
Perhaps people are unaware of the massive debates that are going on about these verses
Do these scholars have nothing better to do than hairsplitting and nitpicking prophetical delusions and nonsense? Who pays for all this? Did or does it make the world a better place?
I’m particularly interested in Julita’s extensive quoting of a few Qur’anic verses there. I suppose she has read the original in Arabic, is fluent in Arabic enough to understand the intricacies of the language”¦etc. etc.
Do Christians also have to learn Hebrew, Greek or Latin to be able to live by the message of the Gospels? Do Hindus and Buddhists also have to understand Sanskrit or Pali to meditate on the meaning of Veda’s, Upanishads and Sutra’s?
Is religion meant to make people better or to give linguists and navel-gazers a job?What happened to common sense?
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Cukurungan:
1. Madam Janma I do think again and now I get some figure of cost need to be paid back by the whiteman. The whiteman shall pay $60 million on every of our Muslim brother killed during Occupation. So you can imagine how little the millions dollars poured for those relief assistance by the whiteman compared with their obligations. Please be noted I haven’t yet reckoned the wealth already looted and stolen from this country by the whiteman.
Well, well, and did we forget the yellow man, how much should they pay? After 350 years of white man’s (Dutch) rule came the Japanese almost over night with a so called liberation of the colonizer. Soon many locals regretted the Dutch. Since my mother’s family lived in Batavia during this period I had first hand account of this period.
So how much should the Yellows pay for their brutality?
Pieter
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Cukur said
The whiteman shall pay $60 million on every of our Muslim brother killed during Occupation.
And how much does the ‘whiteman’ has to pay for the non-Muslims?
Maybe you should pay the ‘whiteman’ for doing the job of the good Muslims. -
Dewaratugedeanom,
No I would not disclose any officials even if I knew them. But do not hold your breath as we are not talking at high level but at local level. Sorry but more I can not tell. I can also not disclose the (appointed) private sector partner we dealt with as they are very much known.
But just have a look at the immigration department and see what goes on there if you are foreigner. Or get a passport in some parts of the country as my sister in law had to do, only to find out that she had to pay double than the recommended fees. Or each time I entered or left the country I was solicitated for uan rokok when they saw my business visa prior to get my rubber stamp.
These practices are at all levels.
Pieter
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Pieter,
If they ever try to harrass you in Bali try this hotline (0361) 224111. I don’t know if it helps but this is supposedly an anti-corruption desk.
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Jokoboyo need help & seriously puzzled.
Indonesia perhaps too liberal, democratic & generous to the minority groups. When the westerners of USA & European countries declare in their countries that during the Easter, the good Friday, the Santa Claus 5th Dec & X’mas celebration are national holiday which they will off the business for 2 months cumulatively, there is no protest against it from their group of minorities such as the Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu believers, thus it goes smoothly.
In the most populous Muslim country of Indonesia, we want the syairah islam law implementation then the minorities are rejecting violently & aggressively like this? Please common us your common sense brothers! It is very natural Indonesia will opt for syairah law, so be it … why you guys so oppose to it? In anyway 90% of us are Muslim, so what? Are you all blind folded or pretend you don’t know the fact?