Feminism is not suitable for Indonesian women.
Eny Dwiningsih, a professor at the Islam State University in Jakarta (UIJ), said in a seminar called “Developing Intellectual Interest in Womens’ Issues” at the North Sumatra University in Medan on 18th May that Islam rejected feminism.
Feminism was dangerous to Islam because it was infused with the spirit of secularism, opposed to sharia law, and based on false assumptions, she said.
The secularised capitalist nations of the world had for a long time been attempting to force feminism on Muslims, in the name of womens’ freedom, and they suggested that personal freedom generally was the answer to many problems, and that Islam was the source of the Islamic world’s backwardness.
Faithful Muslim women were confused today and had lost their self-confidence and belief in their special roles in the family and society, and this showed that the secular capitalists had partly succeeded in their mission: republika
This is the target of the movement, that is, to cause Muslims to lose faith in the ability of Islam to answer the problems that women face.
Friend,
Cukurungan, Mohammed Khafi, and Aluang Anak, how about some coherence ? Brevity maketh the writing. The average reader, or at least those with IQs of above their shoe size will switch off after the 4th or 5th clause of incoherent rambling. (Those with less will switch off after one — maybe they aren’t so dumb).
A communications tip: simplify, simplify, simplify. Break it down into simple sentences.
As for you, Janma, once again, I recommend you attend the Dharma Wanita. It’s been scientifically established that 90 % of feminists have facial hair and suffered problems interracting with boys in high school. Many turned to lesbianism and feminism. Others grew more hair on their legs and armpits.
If they ‘cook’ it is food like boiled sock and exhaust-pipe roasted newspaper. Yum, Yum.
I thank you, Friend.
M. Khafi,
Please don’t spread lies about Islam, you would be lowering yourself to the level of Aluang Anak Bayang and Cukurungan.
Sorry, with this
Don’t you know, that to follow Islam means to abandon their own culture (beginning with the way to dress? 🙂 )
I meant off course cynically the understanding of Islam of many, many Indonesian (look around: surban, baju koko etc, etc).
A. Sudarsono,
I’m again and again astonished by your wide knowledge:
It’s been scientifically established that 90 % of feminists have facial hair and suffered problems interracting with boys in high school. Many turned to lesbianism and feminism. Others grew more hair on their legs and armpits.
Would you mind to tell me your scientifical sources? 🙂
Don’t you know, that it is scientifically proved, that nearly 99% of males, which are against feminism and which are telling such daffic things about it, have dominant mothers and are afraid of women as spitting images of those mothers? 🙂
Peace my friend!
Pak Tomaculum,
Please leave Momma out of this. My scientific sources are based on personal observation during University. Again and again emerged the beard and the hairy appendages. The fairer sex ? No way – it was the hairer sex, or rather sek.
[rude, boorish bit deleted by admin]
Why get fixated on what’s considered halal, or some of the cruder expressions of Islam, such as historical taboos on pork or dogs. We all know such taboos have roots in practical higene practices in the ancient Middle East.
There’s no need to be defensive, Parvita. We are all on this Blog seeking The Truth.
Mas Khafi,
Aluang Anak Bayang, and Cukurungan are prime examples of why this country will never be great, both blinded to the views of others and cannot or will not accept that there is a place where mutual respect and tolerance will allow them both to live their lives as they wish.
I am a realist. Tell me how I am blinded. Between me, you and Cuk, you are the blind one. You are avoiding real issue. You closed your eyes to the dung, and smell and hear no evil. You even discard the hadith, but still consider yourself moslem. I gave you an example of individual A, B and C. Cuk belongs to A, you are B.
http://www.Indonesiamatters.com/1284/bursah-zarnubi/
Since you side stepped the hadith, you knew it is a chronicle of evil. Otherwise you wouldn’t have discarded it in the first place. The rest of your co-religionists of the qu’ran-cum-hadith brand are disrespectful and intolerant. They can believe in fairies, flying horses and doomsday for all I care, but to force it down other’s throat is hardly respectful and tolerant. IM makes a very good effort in showcasing them. And yet, you are here telling us that we have misunderstood Islam, and explaining it in your non-conformist unislamic version.
Please don’t spread lies about Islam, you would be lowering yourself to the level of Aluang Anak Bayang and Cukurungan.
Next time innocent women and children are slaughtered to the chant of ‘Allahu Akhbar’, you have blood on your hand.
A quick visit to Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Turkey, and even many of the Gulf States would soon dissavow that idea. Please do not allow Wahabbism to win, by promoting their understanding of Islam.
Who are you kidding? Why visit countries so far away from us? Why not visit neighbouring Brunei and Malaysia, and see what Islam has done to these 2 countries. I am sure you heard of Dr. Farish A Noor. Google search this name and read his article. Mas Khafi, no offence but I think it is time for you to wake up.
I have a quick visit to those countries you mentioned and I’ve seen enough.
http://www.afrol.com/articles/24466
http://tailrank.com/1827092/Huge-Crowd-Protests-Against-Islamic-Rule-in-Turkey
Shepherd,
Remember that we are great descendants of “trahing kusumo trembesing madu” we don’t need to eat a disgusting foods like pork, dog and rat, even in Japan, pork meats is only for poor and low community people……
You sneaky little weasel. You have a quick peep at your Arabian fairy book and slip in a page. Mind I remind you, you are herding sheeps, not camels.
Ibu Parvita,
I was calling for brevity and clarity. The last paragraph is a humble attempt in this direction. But I’d offer the same advice I gave to others: I recommend you attend some classes at the Dharma Wanita to learn our Indonesian ways of femininity. The traditional Indonesian woman is full of virtue and the DW and Pancasila help to bring those values out.
I thank you, Achmad.
Mbak Parvita,
But that is exactly why Dharma Wanita is good for women who have been polluted by Western feminism. It will teach them to obey their husband and overcome their egotism and make sacrifice for their family.
I don’t mind if woman has a career in her spare time, as long as she attends to her duties in serving me first. Besides, the extra income can be useful. Sometimes I prefer to nongkrong with my friends instead of going to work and the extra money can help me do that.
Also, if I have a second wife, one can be deployed to earn the money, like you said, and the other to performing home duties. That will take a lot of pressure off me and I can enjoy life, relax and nongkrong.
But thank you, Parvita. Your english is very good, so I suspect your husband helped you with it ??
Anyway, thank you. Merdeka !
P.S. — also I note your earlier posts about caucasians not being able to compete. Thank you in joining the fight to put the White Man in his place.
Achmad,
I’m sure now you are for feminism and against those misinterpretation of islamic (and other religions) teaching (and also against such generalising platitudes against the caucasians). You express it with your cynicism, ironism and sometimes sarcasm.
Unfortunately such ways of expression are frequently misunderstood in Indonesia.
🙂
“The traditional Indonesian woman is full of virtue and the DW and Pancasila help to bring those values out.”
Your name is Sudarsono is javanese, so I wonder that you don’t even know the position of the women in the javanese society.
Btw: there is no traditional Indonesian woman. There are many different cultures in Indonesia, so we surely just can talk about javanese or batak or aceh or papuan woman. And their position in the each society is also different.
In former javanes is the feminism a part of the normal situation.
Btw: what is for you “virtue”?
Friend,
I was discussing this with a beautiful Javanese woman called ‘Dewi’ who I met walking one night at Taman Lawang in Menteng. I said, ‘Dewi, you are unusually beautiful, but I what, for you, is virtue ?’ . Then she attempted to show me, but I won’t go into that. Unfortunately, friend, I am far from virtuous, so not really qualified to say what virtue is. But if it is the kind that Dewi showed me, it can’t be all bad ! 🙂
Ono, your comments are so demeaning to women, I wonder if you have a mother and sister/s? So what if P’s english is good? Why does it have to be that her husband helped her? She is strong, she divorced her husband, who probably didnt deseve a strong woman like that. Why do you think that smart women need help from men? I hope you have a miserable life and your wife cheats on you.
Parvita,
Khinsir is the little finger, however Khinzir, the correct word, is more correctly translated as swine, any of various omnivorous, even-toed ungulates of the family Suidae, including pigs, hogs, and boars. I would suggest that the prohibition in Al Quran was based simply on the fact that the meat was contaminated, if that contamination (trichinosis worm) is removed, then I think there is no harm in eating the flesh, as that is the only thing which is forbidden, the flesh! Al Quran specifically states that if forced by necessity there is no sin in eating the flesh of swine, so the prohibition is not about anything evil it is purely for reasons of health.
Personally I choose not to eat pork meat, but I think that if I did by mistake, I wouldn’t be too worried by it.
Just to bring this back on topic, Parvita and Ihaknt, I believe that you both are supporters of feminism, as is my wife. You all give me home in the future of our beloved country, as long as we have women like yourselves, we have a future.
Peace
Friend,
Mbak Parvita — I think it’s mean for you to be accusing anyone of being a prostitute- let us not forget our President’s 3 don’ts, which include not slandering people.
Divorce is acceptable in Islam – as long as the husband requests it 3 times, so Ihaknt, I think it’s mischevious at the least to suggest Parvita is not a good Moslem woman. In fact, as mentioned, I am seeking a second wife, and I will not let your comments influence my decision to seek a meeting with her !!
MK, I support women’s equal rights, not necessarily feminism. I see women as Allah’s creation so why can’t we be as equal as men. We are different in functions but I see it as no less in value.
ps – friend, just to be clear – I meant a ‘cyber’ meeting.
PPS –very sorry to hear about Parvita’s divorce, but it sounds like she’s doing very well. Didn’t mean the comments to be personal.
HEY ONO! You really get on my nerve. What makes you think (if you think at all) that I suggest that she is not a good Muslim? All I said that she is a strong woman and DOES NOT need a man to help her in anything, let alone in speaking English! Can you read properly first before making stupid comments??!?!?
Ono, please note that what you just did is a slander against me and if you are a good Muslim you know it’s sinful to slander other people. READ PROPERLY!!
And you said if the man asks 3 times. WAKE UP DUDE!!! Women these days can divorce men too! I read P’s blog and I love her style and her guts which earn my respect more. And as for you, I pity your closed mindedness.
Gee Achmad, I envy you. Sometime I wish my wife is more devoted moslem, so I can start scouting for extra partners to help with the household’s income.
Ihaknt,
Hey…calm down, Islam is about understanding others and controlling our ego. It sounds like your temper needs a bit of work. I’m just trying to explain a little about women’s responsibilities, not just rights to some of these so-called feminsts. After all, this hairy-armpitted bra-burning has only been around since the 1960s. Islam’s been here since the 7th century. But most of all, this discussion, is focused on why feminism’s not suitable to Indonesian women. I respect you’re right to comment, Ihaknt, but Patung’s put alot of effort into this blog, and we should try to stay on the topic, without straying into personal slurs or slanders. I’m just saying this as a fellow Muslim. I’d be happy to explain some of the more subtle points of Islam any time…
Achmad.
Ihaknt,
In future, I suggest you to ignore all achmad sudarsono’s comments. If you let his comment get into your nerve again, it means he is successfully meet his boss purpose to disturb your and others emotion. He is a devil’s instrument… the devil is achmad sudarsono’s boss.
Congratulation Achmad Sudarsono,
you’re successful again! 🙂
As Patung wrote: you’re right entertaining!!!
Achmad Sudarsono,
It will teach them to obey their husband and overcome their egotism and make sacrifice for their family.
I don’t mind if woman has a career in her spare time, as long as she attends to her duties in serving me first.
Are you talking about women or about slaves? The more I read your posts the more I fail to understand why you want to fight the white man. Because you sound like the re-incarnation of a Dutch colonial with his Indonesian servants. You must be glad that you can relive those days and use women as your servants.
Also, if I have a second wife, one can be deployed to earn the money, like you said, and the other to performing home duties. That will take a lot of pressure off me and I can enjoy life, relax and nongkrong.
Did you ever consider a career in the prostitution business? There you can indulge in “deploying” women for you own benefit. Must be heaven for you and suits your pimp mentality. Are you sure you wanna fight the white man? A lot of white people would embrace you and your – very white – ideas.
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Cape ngomongin ginian. Bigots will always be bigots. One refuses to learn from the other. One feels more superior than the other. That’s what happens when pig-headed people willingly close their horizon and refuse to use their inteligence and common sense. The cycle will never stop.
MK, unfortunately, no matter how well you recite the verses and how much it makes sense to understand these, some of us will only want to see their taken-out-of-context interpretation. Sad reality. If those animals are created by Allah and as a human we see them as ‘disgusting’, does it mean we see Allah’s creation as disgusting? Does it mean that it’s sinful to even think so?