Illegitimate Children
May 5th, 2007, in News, by PatungThere are no more “haram” children in Surabaya.
The head of the civil registry office in Surabaya, East Java, says illegitimate children will no longer by called “haram” (“forbidden”, in Islam) by his office and will be able to obtain birth certificates that say:
….a child from a woman….
Imam Sugondo says the measure has been taken to prevent illegitimate children suffering psychological or other harm due to their being labelled “haram”.
If you call them “haram” it implies they have committed some sort of sin, it’s not good for their development.
Sexual relationships outside of marriage remain illegal, but any children resulting from them should not become victims of their parents’ sin, he said.
Protecting children is more important than worrying about being accused of legalising adultery.
The abolition of the “haram” category on birth certificates was formalised in a 2006 local law.
Profesor Eko Sugitario of Universitas Surabaya suggests that in the past very few illegitimate children ever got birth certificates and that this caused such children and their mothers many difficulties later in dealing with schools and the bureaucracy. tempo
19 Comments on “Illegitimate Children”
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Janma says:
Great News!!!! Really great to have some good news from INdonesia…. more like this please!!!
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Of course, it’s about time. I didn’t even know that such regulation was actually implemented as it sounds so ridiculous. Maan, there’s no such thing as haram child, what the hell. Every baby is born pure and holy, so what the heck with that birth certificate.
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Aluang anak Bayang says:
Every baby is born pure and holy, so what the heck with that birth certificate.
This only applies if your religion is Islam. There is no such thing as ‘born pure and holy’ in Islam vocab. If you do anything petty crime and got caught, they will shame you and your family. Moslems believe shaming the perpetrator and his families is an effective way to deter crime. In Saudi, caning, stoning and beheading are done outside the main mosque every Friday.
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Bas says:
It’s only in Surabaya so far. What about Bandung, Semarang, Padang, ACEH, Jakarta, Yogja, Malang, Denpasar, Balikpapan, Medan.
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Mohammed Khafi says:
Aluang anak Bayang,
Once again you show your limited knowledge of True Islam.
Islam considers newborn children to be pure, they cannot inherit the sins of others, as we will only be judged on what we have personally done.
And We have made every man’s actions to cling to his neck, and We will bring forth to him on the resurrection day a book which he will find wide open:
Read your book; your own self is sufficient as a reckoner against you this day.
Whoever goes aright, for his own soul does he go aright; and whoever goes astray, to its detriment only does he go astray: nor can the bearer of a burden bear the burden of another, nor do We chastise until We raise a messenger. 17:13-15It is Christianity however that has the concept of Original Sin, the sin of Adam and Eve which all Human beings have inherited and which can apparently only be lifted by accepting Jesus as your saviour, as his death according to the Christian faith washed clean all of the sins of mankind.
The shamers, caners, beheaders, and the followers of what you perceive to be Islam are just as limited in its understanding as you appear to be.
Peace
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Colson says:
Mohammed Kafi: I gladly surrender to your superior knowlegde of Islam. But, for an interested outsider, it is hard to be sure whether the real Islam is to be found among those who are the shaming, the caning and the beheading believers or among believers who deny real Islam has anything to do with these intolerant and shocking practices and opinions, including the one on haram children quoted above.
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Colson,
The real Islam can only really be found starting in a believers heart, if read with the right intentions, the Message of Al Quran is one of tolerance and understanding, reason and learning, love and caring. The current practices of mainstream Islam are far away from what God wishes us to be.
The misinterpretation of Islam has unfortunately turned into a means of giving a living and power to a clerical structure which should in reality not exist. If it were not for this clerical structure, the problem would be simple enough to fix. Education! unfortunately to continue their powerhold over the people the Mainstrean Islamic Hierarchy will continue to teach corrupted teachings. Unfortunately because they themselves were brought up with these corrupted teachings, they are blinded to the truth, and are themselves convinced of their own sincerity.
To me it is simply a matter of asking myself these simple questions; Would God instigate a religious sytem, which is totally exclusivist, would God teach his followers to use violence to make others follow his path or as a punishment for crime, would God deny his followers beauty and pleasure as part of his deen, Would God teach that young love is something to be punished, Would God discriminate between men and women?
If you answer yes to any of these questions you are not a follower of True Islam.
Peace
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@Mohammed Khafi: Probing questions indeed. Although probably my definition of “God” is slightly different from yours, I’m happy to see we have the same (kind of) answers.
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I don’t really have a definition for God. Maybe It is simply ‘That Which Science Cannot Explain”
Infinity, Compassion, Creation of the Universe, Creation of Life, Natural Instinct, Self. Maybe when we know the answers to why these things exist, and how they are created, we will finally understand God, or maybe we will not need the concept of a God at all.
Peace
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Mohammed Khafi: While our mutual agreement seems to grow and is maybe nearing 100%, our spiritual community probably is shrinking dramatically in number. Although at least the statement of the head of the registry office in Surubaya shows a kind of congeniality of mind.
(Pfff – glad to be back on topic again)
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Yes, Imam Sugondo has at least shown that there are some who are willing to challenge the system, he has seen the unfairness of stigmatising the children with somebody elses mistakes. Let us hope that there are more like him, who will reject these old rules and put in their place, more caring and humane regulations.
Peace
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The shamers, caners, beheaders, and the followers of what you perceive to be Islam are just as limited in its understanding as you appear to be.
Hi Mas Khafi, how can you call me ignorant when that is exactly practised by Islamic countries. You can show me verses that says otherwise, but the point is, it is a known fact that shaming criminals is condoned by the general moslem population. If a dad was caught stealing and was flogged or had his hand amputated, his children might be mocked by others in school. You know how children are. You can find verses that say there is no compulsion in Islam, but try leaving Islam in any Islamic countries. You might even lose your life, if not by the Islamic state, you are most likely to be lynched by the mob.
Mas, if Islam can be misinterpreted by an overwhelming majority of its followers, and usually this misinterpretation means the worst sufferings and the greatest atrocious crime ever committed by its adherents, should we discard it and use our brain instead, or at least defer and wait for clearer revelation by Allah?
When there is natural disaster such as earthquake or tsunami, pious moslems read it as sign that Allah is punishing them for not following the true Islam. Brother, I think otherwsie. I read that Allah is mad at us for following Islam. I can see that He is trying to tell us something. Signs are obvious if the moslems can open their eyes and look around themselves. The atheist Chinese are getting richer, the cow-worshipping Indians are progressing, the immoral Westerners are discovering new grounds. Like brother Cuk’s chant, “It seemed already proven”. Yet, ALL moslems still believe that should they create an Islamic haven and be good moslem, Allah will reward them with brains intelligent enough to decode the ‘book of everything’, and in no time, they will catch up with the rest of world. How dumb!
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Aluang anak Bayang,
Ignorant is too harsh a word, I just think that you perceive Islam as the Mainstream believers perceive it, perhaps because you have based your understanding on them and their actions, rather than studying and understanding Al Quran.
Just because the majority do something in a certain way does not make it correct, just remember that there was a time when most people thought the world was flat!
I agree with most everything else that you have said, other than “ALL moslems still believe that should they create an Islamic haven and be good moslem, Allah will reward them with brains intelligent enough to decode the ‘book of everything’, and in no time, they will catch up with the rest of world.” You are quite correct however in your last statement “How dumb!” I and many like me believe that they are mislead, and are doing what we can to try and educate as much as possible to allow people to see things differently, you have pointed out the inherent dangers of this, but I still believe that it has to be done!
You will if you research further, find that there is a different, tolerant, reasoned interpretation of Al Quran spreading around the globe, this will take time to spread to all followers but I believe that “Good will triumph over Evil” and that you will hopefully see a subtle change taking place in the Islamic world as people become more educated and reasoning. Iman Sugondo’s actions are a small example of this.
Peace
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Hi Khafi,
….. because you have based your understanding on them and their actions, rather than studying and understanding Al Quran.
Action speaks louder than words. The behaviour of moslems are putting people off worldwide. Probably it is also what Allah willed.
Just because the majority do something in a certain way does not make it correct, just remember that there was a time when most people thought the world was flat!
Mas, thinking that the world is flat won’t hurt anyone, but putting into action by wrong interpretation of Allah’s book create havoc. Children are orphanged, women widowed and everyone is suffering.
I agree with most everything else that you have said, …..
You don’t have to as I am writing what I believe to be fair dinkum.
“….. in no time, they will catch up with the rest of world.” You are quite correct however in your last statement “How dumb!” I and many like me believe that they are mislead, and are doing what we can to try and educate as much as possible to allow people to see things differently, you have pointed out the inherent dangers of this, but I still believe that it has to be done!
Mas, it will be a slippery uphill track. Good luck on you, but I suggest you try Acheh and Poso first. Javanese moslem are easy to handle. Just tell them Islam is for Arabs in no time, you will gather a huge following.
You will if you research further, find that there is a different, tolerant, reasoned interpretation of Al Quran spreading around the globe, this will take time to spread to all followers but I believe that “Good will triumph over Evil” and that you will hopefully see a subtle change taking place in the Islamic world as people become more educated and reasoning.
Yes, I did and it seems most, if not all are from non-Islamic countries, Bule countries to be precise. We need someone coming from within, otherwise it is like shouting toward the sea.
Iman Sugondo’s actions are a small example of this.
Iman Sugondo is from East Java, so chances he is a Kejawen, not a real moslem. But what if he is out of office and a real moslem took over. It will be back to the old barbaric law.
Peace
Peace can only be achieved if no one believe in heavenly fairy tales.
Regards.
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@ aluang anak bayang: Like a lot of people you seem to be worried about political Islam. But I think it is just unfair to damn all because of the sins of some.
First of all because that’s counterproductive. By lumping moderates and radicals all together one paves the way for the latter. I think moderates of all religions and political convictions always should fight the radicalism in their own ranks. Moderates of all denominations should be careful not to hamper the efforts of congenial spirits in other groups.
And it is unfair as well. Especially to allies like the head of the Registry office in Surabaya. Just as it’s wrong to blame the American Micheal Moore for crimes commited by the US army in Iraq or Mother Theresia for the torturing of heretics by the Roman Catholic Inquisition. Neither, I think, one should generalize about a loud and angry minority of Muslims and attack the large majority of decent fellow men and women, just because they call themselves Muslim as well.
And last but not least: moderates should not worry but try to understand the cultural, social and social-economic causes of the anger. And should try to do something about it.
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Piddy says:
This is a reasoned development. I would be interested in how the change was made. Was it just the convictions of the Imam Sugondo, or is there more to the story?
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Rhya Ellliot says:
Hello there.
I need some info on adoption and illegal adoption back in the late 80’s. Can anyone help me? Please email me at idbirth@gmail.com
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Sherrine Khan says:
This is right no child should suffer from the mistakes their parents made and they never chose to enter the world. I know a baby who is being called haram by some of the muslim community and even labelled a w**** or a s*** which is pretty sick as this is a one year old baby we are talking about. This baby will never be accepted in muslim society but I’m sure she will do just fine.
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