545 Comments on “Open Thread”
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ET says:
If this is an open thread, why not discuss the present turmoil in the Muslim world? While the Arab world seems to steer towards more democracy and freedom, the country with the largest Muslim population veers towards a revolution based on a ridiculous sectarian issue. Unless the latter is only a pretext for a bigger goal, i.e. the establishment of a sharia state.
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Lairedion says:
A couple of things to discuss of today’s news:
– A FPI leader in Bekasi gets to walk free after stabbing HKBP elders. He was sentenced to 5 months and 15 days for the murder attempt but already did that time in police custody.
Remember the fallen pop star doing a couple of years now for allowing his porn vids being stealed and spread.
– Two districts in Banten are going to issue a bylaw banning Ahmadiyah outright because the people have shown they reject Ahmadiyah’s existence.
No sh*t.
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Hans says:
Assange have misunderstood the whole thing.
It’s about two women are entitled to receive the notification of sex crimes tried by the judicial system.
if he only had use the condom that morning he wake her, then ther whill not have be any problem. -
and it’s snowing in rotterdam
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and another thing that has me worried like crazy actually, the tainted baby formula, the bastards don’t even want to say about which brands all the commotion is, this is getting me all riled up, i’ve got this little fellow at home
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and this: even the pssi is reason enough for indonesians to protest ….
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Look, here’s what I think, those fckn’ losers from arab world look for place(s) where they can live (looking for other losers). You know, and unfortunately they look in indonesia. If we don’t want to be losers, kick that fckn’ arabs out of indonesia, and mingle instead with china , japan, and korea.
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china, japan, and Korea, I wonder who said the flounder. have any of these countries have ever done any home-made innovation from Scratch. to them without any hesitation they are the world’s best technology thieves, it is quite clear, looking at China Mobile what a shit! worked not with 3G only whit 2G network. photo equipment without contrast. Samsung is ok, but was it Dr who that come whit the innovation to them.
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I am will you Madrotter. I can understand the unmitigated greed and corruption, the sheer lack of empathy the robber barons display every day. However, when it comes to the protection of children these mongrel dogs still don’t give a damn and still the general public is comatose as their state fails around them. Its a bizarre place we live in.
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A discussion took place the other day wether Indonesia qualifies as a failed state? Have to admit hard to suggest it’s not or at least well on the way.
Freedom of religion..fail, protection of it’s citizens..fail, justice for it’s citizens..fail, mobs attacking Indonesian citizens with virtual immunity, mobs intimating judges and the legal process….and we sleep oN. -
Arie Brand says:
Hans
Assange have misunderstood the whole thing.
It’s about two women are entitled to receive the notification of sex crimes tried by the judicial system.
if he only had use the condom that morning he wake her, then ther whill not have be any problem.Assange understands it well enough. The Swedish judiciary misused the European Arrest Warrant system and even used an Interpol ‘most wanted alert for a CONDOM. The British magistrate dealing with the case had no choice but to grant the extradition request seeing that the arrest warrant was formally correct. The hope is now that an appeals court would be able to look at the merits of the case and see it in its ludicrous proportions.By then Assange is of course another hundred thousand or so poorer (it has to come out of his book contract).
What this is about is a two bit prosecutor in a provincial town pursuing her own feminist agenda, together with a local politico who is a political friend and also happens to be the lawyer of those two revengeful females.
Sweden is, as far as I know, the only European country where paying for sexual services constitutes a criminal offence. But it appears that unpaid, quite voluntary sexual services also can be a hazard there. That prosecutor is on record as saying that the mere notification of a ‘sexual assault’ (such as a broken condom for instance A.B.) should lead to the man involved being put behind bars so that the female can reflect in peace on what has happened to her. So the guy can count on at least a few days jail plus possibly the expense of legal assistance to get him out of that mess. Unpaid sexual services can thus turn out to be the dearest of all. This is feminism gone bonkers.
That you Swedes are happy with this – or more likely have no choice but to acquiesce in it – so be it. But it a shame that you harass non-Swedes with it.
Meanwhile we should not forget the political overtones of this all. Your earlier remark, Hans, that only his ‘communist friends’ care about Assange over there makes me suspect that the matter is portrayed in a certain politicaL light over there. Assange doesn’t trust the Swedish judiciary – and I don’t blame him. He fears that once he is in its clutches it might turn out to be responsive to American requests for his extradition. And some folk have been baying for his blood over there.
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nobody says:
what is the difference between arabisation and westernization?
have you ever been to work or to a bussiness meeting in sarung and blankon, diego?
why is it ok to force workers to copy the bules and use tie, suits and pants?
why dont you speak for the right of these workers to preserve their original cultures? -
why is it ok to force workers to copy the bules and use tie, suits and pants?
Difference is Nobody, no one does force them nor do you see ignorant groups of thugs in western dress demanding other Indonesia’s reject traditional forms of dress for Arab imports.
Been to many business meetings lately? No shortage of Batik around. Trouble is as usual, the thugs tend only to focus on the symbol of their sexual insecurity, being any sort of assertive woman. It’s a sick joke being played on Indonesia by traitors within. Already the Balinese are rejecting the impositions of these foreign interlopers and their Indonesian lapdogs and the other regions will follow.
As a matter of interest, you will find plenty of Westerners and Indonesians working every hard to preserve Indonesian culture unlike your Arab friends who provide cash handouts to ensure their twisted view of the world get a hearing.
Here in our local village, the local mosque provides a monthly cash hand out to all males who dress their women like chattels in that grotesque custom of ownership they call the Burqa. Its sad to see these black ghosts being created for a couple of pieces of tainted silver.
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well. they (western wannabees and their enforcers) don’t need to roam the street to force people verbally, do they? it is already in the system! if you go to bussiness meeting in blankon and sarongs, at the minimum you will be laughed on and be shown the door, but if you insist on it, you can even be fired, effectively telling you that if you want to eat, you have to conform to this western dress code. That mosque you mentioned (if your story is indeed true, as I found it hard to believe. I think you are just repeating hear says of hear says) are just offering some money which you are free to take or not, but this institutionalized western style dress code is forced upon workers who have almost no choice, the alternative being getting fired.
Batiks etc is just small nuances, like color, which does little to change the fact that it has to be suit, shirt, pants and tie. The equivalence would be using batik patterned jilbab or burqa..
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yes oigal i agree and if anything makes it clear that indonesia is now a failed state it should be this news:
i see the most horrible accidents all the time here because of this, a state that cannot maintain its infrastructure is a failed state, there is absolutely no excuse for this.
and when they do fix parts of broken roads it takes about two weeks and the roads are back in the same state as before they fixed them. why? corruption of course. i spoke with somebody who has a friend working with one of these crews, first, when they start the police always show up and force them to pay what they call a “road-fixing tax”, then the companies that do these jobs siphon off lots of money so only a small portion of the money available is left…..
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and those burqas are starting to appear in bandung too these days weirdest dress code ever
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Arie Brand
On Assange.
What a shame for such a brilliant mind to get involved in one-night stands with women he barely knew personally and of which one was already known as a radical feminist and ‘campus sexual equity officer’. He had studied philosophy in Melbourne but apparently never heard of the ‘honey trap’, the pre-eminent device to bring down the powerful and controversial. Didn’t Bill Clinton ring a bell?
Makes one almost long for sharia law where a women charging a man with rape has to produce at least 4 male witnesses. -
Oigal
A discussion took place the other day wether Indonesia qualifies as a failed state?
Here in our local village, the local mosque provides a monthly cash hand out to all males who dress their women like chattels in that grotesque custom of ownership they call the Burqa.
I wonder if there’s a connection between failed states and burqas.
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Arie
Assange have misunderstood the whole thing.Thought it was a fun and humorous text, the text is not in a Swedish newspaper, it is from a internatonal comment on how much money the horny goat costs.
yeah I know crazy monty python humor.
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a Connection Between, failed states and burqas, very possible, I’ve read about several cases of prominent female entrepreneurs in Europe who managed very well with their business. Then when they started to wear religiously when they went to board meetings and in business dealings, then all their credibility and the concept foundered, and none have been like to do business with them anymore. When they returned to normal boring ethics clothes also ther confidence in them has become normal.
anyone want to do business with an old oak stump.
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There’s a point when a certain level of islamization results in a failed state. Indonesia has already crossed that point.
“Building mosques to combat casual sex between teenagers”
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Madrotter said:
and when they do fix parts of broken roads it takes about two weeks and the roads are back in the same state as before they fixed them.
What were the pre-war roads like? Here is some British testimony:
The roads in Java must surely be some of the most delightful highways in the world; at all events, I know of none in any country to compare with them. There are (Heaven be praised!) none of those bare, characterless racing tracks with which we have defaced the fair countryside of England; but the surface of Java’s main roads is as perfect as that of any ” arterial” horror, and even that of the by-roads is so excellent that if it could be reproduced on the main highways of Australia it would transcend the Commonwealth motorists’ wildest dreams.
From H.W.Ponder, Java Pageant, London n.d. p.285
And here is some more British testimony:
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.. I think that I can say without exaggeration that in matters of efficient organization the Dutch in their East Indian possessions have few equals in the colonial world. Roads, railways, airways, sanitation, hotels, clubs, picture-theatres, swimming baths, shops, markets, factories, sports-grounds, racecourses, telephones, are all first class – and when I say first class I do not mean a first-class imitation of the same thing in Europe, but a good model for others to copy.
From R.V.C.Bodley, Indiscreet Travels East, London 1934 p.35
This post harks back to a discussion I had with Ondinius who relegated Dutch colonialism to the bottom of the barrel because he judged it by what he saw around him today. Excellent infrastructure is, of course, not the only criterion for judging a state – I know. But nevertheless it was there – once.
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thanks arie! again an interesting read as always:)
the thing’s they have done in bandung!!! take alun alun for example, the beautiful little park there where young lovers would meet since colonial days, where the fortunetellers were sitting and the folks peddling their magic potions and where there was this beautiful old mosk. all gone, they tore down that beautiful mosk, replaced it with an awful horrible huge ugly thing that’s already showing signs of falling apart (paid for by kuwait), tore down that beautiful park and replaced it with a horrible place and threw out all the colorful people that were making a living there because the folks running the new mosk didn’t like their presence…. now there’s just nothing going on there…. so many beautiful old buildings in a total state of disrepair… braga road, once THE shopping street of Indonesia, people from all over South East asia would go there just to be seen, it’s now nothing more than a slum area, they started about two years ago to renovate it and with the job only partly done it looks more horrible now than ever. meanwhile the only thing going here are more and more luxerious complexes for the elite to have their HOLIDAY and WEEKEND palaces, more and more malls where the poor folks can go windowshopping…..
gotta say, paris from java is kinda nice, c-walk is kinda nice….
i swear this mayor is the worst thing that could’ve happened to bandung. recently in a radio interview they asked him, what do you think about the incredible traffic jams that are now plaguing bandung, soecially in the weekends when all the jakartans are coming here? it’s great!!! he said, each week we make about 7 billion because of them!!!!
i wonder where that money goes then, certainly not in maintaining this once so beautiful city, certainly not in repairing the roads….
i’ve said it many times here before, a mayor who is filthy rich but goes on a 1 week holiday to texas paid for by the city at a cost of 75.000 dollars FOR ONE WEEK….
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when I started to read your text about the romantic park, I came directly to dream myself back to the boardwalk “Avenida Infante Don Henrique” in Ponta Delgada, where I after a little walking arrive to a very romantic park, with a small playground, just one such a park you are talking about where the young romantics meet after skollan and steal a few kisses from her beloved.,
In the dictatorship of oil! (Saudi) the dreamer of romatic kisser will be whipped with 70 lashes of romanticism, a rape must be witnessed by four Muslim men to have rapists convicted. ha ha this is the life of Brian and monty python humor.when they do fix parts of broken road
I know a lot about such construction works, maintenance of roads in the Malang area is often laughable, usually it’s about to fix cracks or so-called pot holes. they who know little about these jobs can easily see that they’re doing wrong and suspicion is that they can not be so damn stupid , but they do it like they want the work back over and over agian.
At one time I worked on the Volvo, drove often speda motor (1100r) to work, often came up in 280 km/h, which I would never dare do in Indo. -
Nobody, I can assure you it is true as close friend (Indonesian) is in a daily battle with these throwbacks as they ramp up their none so subtle intimidation of the local village, including late night visits to the residences of single women demanding they change their mode of dress and take a husband as it is unseemly for a woman to live alone. I will never understand the support, passive or active people like you provide for these bullies and thugs.
Madrotter, Bandung is one of the great failures of Indonesia. As little as ten years ago, I was telling anyone who would listen Bandung is where I hoped to retire and live out my life. After last few trips, not a hope in hell, the search continues.
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agan says:
@Maddrotter: I agree with your description about Bandung and I can sense your vibe of genuine care for the city.
Walking along and around once glorious Jalan Braga one can still imagine what tempo doeloe must have been like then, promenade street lined with art deco grandeurs
Savoy Homann, The Preanger, Gedung Merdeka /Concordia , wide and expanse broadway Jalan AA.
But I highly doubt if they were all built for the convenience of regular folks rakyat Bandung
they prolly all built for the very convenience of colonial Robber Barons at the time
and as usual poor rakyat always get shafted then and now. Nasib euy. -
OIGAL I hoped to retire and live out my life. After last few trips, not a hope in hell
The feeling is similar, I have actually proposed to the wife to sell the house in Lawang.
It is nice and cool on the volcano slope and whit a mosque just a stone throw away.
O NO SHE SAY we most have it, shitt and I who like go to Nice I love the English promenade ther. -
looks like a lovely park hans! first time i came to bandung was in ’91 stayed here for two weeks, absolutely lovely, no traffic at all, imagine! the traffic in jl. cihampelas (jeansstreet) was two ways!!! now people risk their lives trying to walk there on the crumpled pavement… somebody told me recently that bandung was the 5th most corrupt city in the world, don’t know if it’s true but i can believe it… i’ve lived in that city for some 7 years but moved out to lembang 8 years ago….
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The only example I have personally found of what the Dutch called pre-war ‘een lief plaatsje’ (a lovely little place) is the main place of Tidore. This was in 1995. I wonder what it is like now.
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open thread? YEAH! here’s my grand daddy somewhere between 1936 and 1939, the box in the front says Surabaya, who knows he was all over the place,mostly in Bandung but also Papua, I remember him telling me about flying planes that were mostly canvas and those Papua arrows would fly right though them:)