Causes of Disunity
Feb 6th, 2009, in News, by Patung
Another East Timor in Papua, lack of development in the province, and racism by other Indonesians towards Papuans.
East Timor Analogy
In January of 2009 an association of Christian churches in Papua, the Persekutuan Gereja-Gereja Baptis (PGBP), sent a letter to President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono complaining about the selection procedure for new employees (CPNS) of the Department of Religion (Depag) in areas such as Keerom, Tolikara, Sarmi, Jayapura and Pegunungan Bintang.
The PGBP appears to believe that Depag takes a disproportionate number of new civil servants who are not native Papuans and not Christian. A spokesman for PGBP said
The Papuan Baptist Church asks that Depag be very careful in maintaining good inter-religious relations because the issue of religion is highly sensitive in Papua.
He believed that there had been some deliberate manipulation of the final intake for new public servants that disadvantaged native Papuans, and that this was in violation of the 2001 Special Papuan Autonomy Act which specified that native people should receive preference in hiring decisions.
The spokesman added that the Department of Religion should not repeat the mistakes it had made in East Timor from 1976-99, which had alienated native East Timorese religious leaders, and helped cause that province to break-away from Indonesia, or else something similar might occur in Papua. antara
Aceh & PNG Analogies
Late in 2008 Frederika Korayn from a Papuan womens’ group asked a seminar in Jakarta
The government is willing to have dialogue with the people of Aceh, why not in Papua?
She went on to complain that since integration with Indonesia conditions had not improved much, with still 80% of Papuan women being in absolute poverty, largely un-educated and with poor health.
The Autonomy Act had been implemented only in limited cases and was largely of no value, and she said that population growth in the province was worryingly slow, that since 1970 the population had only grown by 1.5%, whereas in neighbouring Papua New Guinea growth had been at 10%.
The ‘Other’
At the same seminar Yenny Rosa Damayanti of the Association of Indonesian Legal and Human Rights Aid (PBHI), a non-Papuan, said that Indonesians often regarded Papuans as “the other(s)” because of their different skin complexion and race.
Because of the skin colour and hair we regard them as “the other”, not as brothers.
People needed to think about what constituted an Indonesian and whether the definition included Papuans, she said: tempo
Is it just Malay people? Is it just Muslims?
258 Comments on “Causes of Disunity”
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ET says:
AAB said
The nusantara is blessed with all the natural wealths other nation can only dream of, which is the reason you don’t see any Javanese economic refugees overseas.
If not economic refugees then what are all these Javanese maids doing in the Middle East, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taipei etc ?
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Aluang Anak Bayang says:
@ ET
They are not there to stay permanently, nor attempt to overstay illegally. Watch Border Security and most, if not all offenders are either middle easterns and Chinese.
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schmerly says:
I wonder why Malaysia and Singapore keeps deporting thousands of illegal Indonesians??
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dxp says:
AAB the shadow said
They are not there to stay permanently, nor attempt to overstay illegally. Watch Border Security and most, if not all offenders are either middle easterns and Chinese.
..really ?
wanna an answer & proof ?
in KL, I can find the similar news daily ….
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@ DXP
Most of your posts are written out of sheer ignorance. You have not lived in Malaysia or Brunei. If you want to bring out Melayu lands, make sure you know what you are talking about. I was from a family of regional conflict negotiators, and probably the only Javanese family to travel freely when neighbourly tension was high in the 60s and 70s. I have spent a third of my life in and out of Melayu lands since the 60s.
You have not been to China either. Deng Xiao Ping had this to say to you: chu now. malai ngin tong thon ngin hay chi kar ngin? ni fark sau hay mor?.. This is in DXP’s dialect. You should be able to understand if you want to immitate him. 🙂
You are an Indon-Chinese who don’t know much beyond the border of Indonesia. In previous posting you have praised the Melayus. You will get a rude awakening if you had lived in a Melayu land, and realised that the Javanese had been very fair to the Chinese. Be yourself, an Indon-Chinese and try to be good citizen – a priviledge not freely available to Chinese in Melayu land. The Chinese not welcomed to our land are parasites the like of Dragonball and those that bite the hand that feed them. Those whose daughters would say “nga kai pa pa hiau sak ngai” if they have Javanese boyfriends.
Now back to the Indonesian illegal workers in Malaysia.
Even if they had wanted to live in Melayu land, it is still within the nusantara. There is nothing wrong with Chinese wanting to live in Hong Kong or Taiwan. In Malaysia, many Melayus will protect and harbour them. Same as mahatir covertly allowed the Pinoys to populate Sabah. Pinoy is as Malay as the Javanese. The same cannot be said for the Chinese.
I refer ‘economic refugees’ as those who tried to stay on illegally in bule lands – kim shan kor hoi. Now we are talking about thousands Chinese economic refugess trying to scam their way in by any means.
I also recall a posting of yours telling PN that Melayus hated our gut out. In Malaysia, a Melayu would gladly kill a pribumi for their Chinese population. I wonder where you get that from. Care to take this further with me.
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dragonwall says:
Someone is testing my patience. Honestly speaking after making my last posting I had intended to leave for persona reason. I believe most of them posting remarks are here not to share opinion but try to show off their writing skill with all sorts of putdowns to others with regardless. In most of the blogs it is always revving into one direction.
HATRED, DISCRIMINATIONS, THE CHINESE ARE ALWAYS THE ONE THAT DID WRONG TO THE INDONESIANS PRIBUMIS.
You could virtually see that the hate issue always present with such persistence. So I think offer any kind of advice on the Indonesian economic or socio politic would help Indonesians in any way would not quell the hatred of such idiotic bigots who are religious morons possessed by devils. So you said.
Ahh .. a disgrunted Singaporean who is now banished from exploiting Indonesians.
You see that as a person banished and exploiting the Indonesians? No wonder someone would say,
AAB.. You are such a dick!
Didn’t you say your Indon in-laws helped you with Javanese connections?
Can you point us all to that direction that I said so? Or is that another of your envious detestation! Jealous and unable to accept what is known as reality. If you can’t then what does that makes you?
Where is the gratuity?
What gratuity are you talking about? Why must I and why should I?
If you welcomed a poor beggar to your luxury home, clothed and feed him, then one day there was a robbery, he helped the robber tie you up. What would you do to him once you managed to overpower and chase the robber out of your home?
Now, since when you welcome a poor beggar, clothe and feed him? And since when you have a luxury home?
Now, swap ‘the poor beggar’ with ‘chinese fortune seeker coming to our land’; and ‘the robber’ with ‘Dutch’. You get the picture?
Is that how you make comparison on someone who has been successful? And you also claimed that the Dutch are also robbers? There is no such thing as swapping and the picture you are drawing is that you try to put yourself in such a way that everyone owes you a living and that picture I don’t get it because you cannot show us anything concrete but just fabrication filled with your hatred. But on the reverse I would picture it as that you parents who were brought up by Chinese nanny sucking her breast and that your parents had sent you to suck her breast and upbring such unfillial rebels turn traitors. Don’t you forget to go through the links I offer to show your DNA to prove you to be one of Chinese origin. The only exceptions is that perhaps while you parents were having sex they didn’t turn on the light.
If the Javanese had welcomed you to their land, the least we expect of the chinese were some loyalty and respect.
If the Chinese were not loyal then Indonesia might not have enjoy the 30 odd years of prosperity until the riot. So you expect them to be loyal when people like you and your parents who were fed by the Chinese and in return you guys start biting their hands! Where is your gratuity? Not only did you not show your gratitude but propagated against the Chinese and Chinese Indonesians by showing your hatred. What must they call people like you. Like I said Cowards! Traitors! Or what?
Lick splitting with the Dutch, and helping the Dutch kill thousands of Javanese was not an honourable thing to do, or was it?
You said the Chinese help the Dutch kill thousands of Javanese? Consider if that is true and lets swap position, then what will be your comment?
The chinese do not know they are dealing with a highly sophisticated culture that was as old as human civilisation itself.
Civilization existed billions of years ago, but definitely not you. You can continue professing you religion but nothing will bring you any closer to mankind because of the devil in you. And you are permitted to bring anyone into this or any blog and I will personally take you all out one by one and make you guys vanish in thin air.
An egalitarian society far more advanced in moral values than ALL
Your so call egalitarian society were so vague that you even forget your ancestors let alone moral values, so how could you compare yourself to ALL their contemporaries?
There was no human sacrifice, no infant girl killing, no incestous relationship, no perverted sexual ritual, etc, etc. We are not uncultured Austro or Afro Blackies, or American Indians or even Papuans.
How about pedophile, juvenile sex offence, female circumcising and above all incest. Go read more of the news then you tell us about incestuous relationship. How about you and the Arabs having a 15 years old sitting on your lap and rubbing her against it!
We have court ethics, we have sages, we have artisans, we are highly organised. Plus we are not stupid, we know who our enemies are. The Dutch could not conquer us, nor the once welcomed chinese will ever betray our trust again.
You should know one thing. When a person is insane, he will tell the whole world that he is sane. And that is the likes. And of course you are right. You are a bunch of highly organized corruptors. So well organized that the AG is unable to crack your nuts.
The nusantara is blessed with all the natural wealths other nation can only dream of, which is the reason you don’t see any Javanese economic refugees overseas. It is only the poors that dream of kim shan koh hoi. chorn dor dor lui..
These will also demonstrate the coward in you by being unable to accept the fact that you now see more and more Javanese economic refugees overseas. You said you were well verse in Chinese and Hokien and now Hakka? Ha Ha Ha? Did I said wrong earlier that you had someone to whisper by translating them over the phone. By showing these will only further confirm and prove you are a no better person but more like an idiot. Gold mountain! Make a lot of money! Well of course! When they put in their efforts it should be obvious that they are entitle to make a lot of money.
Because we only engage on “halal business” unlike your kind who can run any kind business such as “Judi Togel”, “Bandar Narkoba” and “Penyelundupan” include “perdagangan manusia and bayi”.
How about you falsifying invoice and stealing money from your company? Had that made you any richer by now? No wonder Pertamina had the Dirut change to a woman and continue the corruption under a skirt, well covered and camouflaged and be invincible to the law or Sharia Law?.
He wasn’t successful until his Indonesia in-law helped him.
I guess like what Patung say of someone who is aging and his mind had started to slag and can’t think to well. Didn’t I say that my father in law was a cobbler? And that when I married my wife his business had already gone bust? So can a totok Chinese help bring me to such height? Think it yourself for a moment because the more I elaborate the more I will make people like you who claimed to be superior Javanese a bigger a fool.
Singapore being overcompetitive; the downtroddens and underachievers looked toward Javanese Indonesia.
In today, Indonesia is being considered to be underachievers, and down trodden and because Singapore is a society that is always reaching new heights so since when Singapore became over competitive? Each day a new bred is born, so new ground must be broken that is the greatness of high society. Only the conservative stays behind in Singapore. Those that are well educated are being sought after abroad and to them it would be obvious on their part to accept and expand abroad.
We treated our Chinese population reasonably well which was why multi millionaires and billionaire chinese only exist in Indonesia. Dragonball can confirm that with you. In Melayu lands, there is no way for Chinese to make it rich. Ask him why he didn’t seek his fortune in Malaysia or Brunei.
I was in Brunei, I was in Sibu, I was in Sarawak. The reason I didn’t stay behind is I am clastophobic and I need space. When I was working with financial institutions in the 70’s I traveled there consulting finance with my clienteles there. Do I need to stay there?. Is there anything worth for me to stay? With timber and logs?
During the 70s and the 80s, there was a popular trend among Singapore’s underachievers to seek fortune in Indonesia. The rag-to-richess short-cut was to woo or impregnant daughters of wealthy Indonesian businessmen. That was what he did.
I guess that was what you do? Right! I married my wife in 1988 and my first born 1990. And you consider a busted cobbler is wealthy Indonesian? Now I know your standards.
From there with his in-law’s backings and connections, he was able to make millions (his own claim).
Ahh backings and connections! I wonder how he managed that? If he does then I should consider him to be a great person, no doubt about that.
Dragonball possessed no skill. He prided himself of economic forecast precision, yet missed the US economy bubble burst by 3 to 4 years.
This also shows your utter stupidity. Show me an economic to make a forecast better than I do. You even failed to understand what economic is. If you do then you would have understood that the bubble burst came in earlier than expected is because the inside of Indonesian economy is actually “kropos” therefore it crashed earlier than expected. If I am in the Indonesian cabinet then I would have given you the precise assessments of Indonesia’s situation but unfortunate I am not therefore I can only forecast based on my own research. Tell me how many Indonesians economist have done that? Z E R O BESAR.
He claimed to make millions with chemical dealings
Did I say chemical dealings or chemical factory? You idiot.
I wonder if that was possible without Javanese connections.
Do I need that?
He claimed to be a lawyer, look at poor English vocab. This is only a short list.
Well what are you trying to prove? Envy and jealous. I have elaborated that earlier so my guess is that you are trying to compile rubbish to occupy space? Or that you are a better person?
Comrade DXP, in China what should we do with undesirables like him?
I had earlier said I going to China, and as to whether desireable or undersirable is left to be seen and for your to find out.
is a good idea because up to 99.9% of yin nee hua chiaw will be gassed.
Did you said this? So have I wronged you? A coward and a traitor who tries to deny you have chinese ancestors!
Coming back to Lim soe Liong, did you guys know that he had a mistress living in singapore(not sure if she is singaporean or indonesian), who bore him a daughter, who later married with the eldest son of mahathir bin kutty mohamed (a man who lead the leading malay political party UMNO for 22 years and considered as a bumi, but was registered as an indian by the british).
What has Lim soe Liong has got to do with bastards like you. Whether he had a mistress is none of your business, right! So Mahatir is an Indian and that also had something to do with you. Does that shows that your hatred and discrimination had became more and more inconceivable?
During the financial crisis of 1997, the son (Mirzan) tried to commit suicide as his businesses failed and wife abandoned him and obtained divorce only after threatening to spill out govenrment secrets.
I think the Malaysian government and the Melayu should engage you to be a spy. Bego.
They are not there to stay permanently, nor attempt to overstay illegally. Watch Border Security and most, if not all offenders are either middle easterns and Chinese.
What do you know? Second hand news broadcasting? Islamic news blackout?
You have not been to China either. Deng Xiao Ping had this to say to you: chu now. malai ngin tong thon ngin hay chi kar ngin? ni fark sau hay mor?..
Did Deng Xiao Ping said that? He is not a Hakka but your half past six utter hakka nonsense shows that you are a chu now and did Deng Xiao Ping said that malai ngin tong thon ngin hay chi kar ngin? Fat dream.
The Chinese not welcomed to our land are parasites the like of Dragonball and those that bite the hand that feed them. Those whose daughters would say “nga kai pa pa hiau sak ngai” if they have Javanese boyfriends.
That is about the best you could do, right? Of course if they do then their parents will say “nga kai pa pa hiau sak ngai” no doubt about that. You vocab sucks, so start sucking an egg.
In Malaysia, many Melayus will protect and harbour them. Same as mahatir covertly allowed the Pinoys to populate Sabah. Pinoy is as Malay as the Javanese. The same cannot be said for the Chinese.
So that is why the Malaysians are deporting as much Indonesian as they could to such extent that the two countries are constantly bickering. Must be great with your concept.
I refer ‘economic refugees’ as those who tried to stay on illegally in bule lands – kim shan kor hoi. Now we are talking about thousands Chinese economic refugess trying to scam their way in by any means.
Chinese as to Chinese from China or Indonesia? Now scam….you must have a new language
You can continue to brag as much as you like but let me say this to you and that is Diao nga mei, ngai oi hi zong gue.
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diego says:
Dragonball possessed no skill. He prided himself of economic forecast precision, yet missed the US economy bubble burst by 3 to 4 years.
This also shows your utter stupidity. Show me an economic to make a forecast better than I do. You even failed to understand what economic is. If you do then you would have understood that the bubble burst came in earlier than expected is because the inside of Indonesian economy is actually “kropos” therefore it crashed earlier than expected.
Dragie, learn to read. Sr. AAB clearly said: “… US economy”.
Honestly, people like you, and dxp, and wandi, etc, got me thinking: why are the motives of these “people” bitching so much about indonesia, when it’s very clear they have no attachment whatsoever to Indonesia (except, maybe in your case, your-ex coolieland. you know, the place where you thought the people were easy to manipulate). Is it simply because they’re frustrated lunatics?
Seriously, your rantings here proved nothing but you’re not going to be of any use for indonesian society. In spanish: no estan bienvenidos. Why don’t you just walk away? We have better people, both from indonesia and other countries, who actually love indonesia. And you know what, one doesn’t hate to be hateful for being critical.
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And…, about the beggar-robber thing…, it’s called “analogy”. I was surprised, really, to learn (from your comment) that analogy doesn’t work in your mind. You said you are a liar? Sorry, I mean, lawyer.
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Lairedion says:
DW said:
Don’t you forget to go through the links I offer to show your DNA to prove you to be one of Chinese origin.
There are many theories about the origins of modern human beings but apart from some creationist God-freaks, the most plausible theory is that we all share a common ancestor with other great apes. By the way, did you know that in 2001 Chinese geneticists analyzed Y chromosomes in Chinese people and concluded that all Chinese samples contained a mutated gene M168G which is a marker believed to have appeared in the last 79,000 years on a number of Africans? This supports the Out-of-Africa model as opposed to the multiregional evolution model. No more need for overseas Chinese to segregate themselves in Chinatowns worldwide and reject the gweilo and pribumi. We are all Africans. 🙂
Our most accurate reference point is that Nusantara Malay are Austronesians (who themselves are rather heterogeneous), a separate group, distinct from East Asians, inhabiting South East Asia and Oceania, originating from Formosa (who displaced the local Malays there?). That makes us closer relatives to Maori or Samoans than to Chinese. What happened before (the common Mongoloid origins of East Asians and Austronesians) is so vague and still being debated among many scholars.
To cut it short, your statement is meaningless…
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TheWrathofGrapes says:
You have not been to China either.
AAB – you sleeping or what? DXP is from China – see his very first post (the second post on this thread).
Maybe you should have said “you have not been out of China either.”
😉
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Sr. AAB clearly said: “… US economy”.
Oh Oh.. Didn’t I read right or you didn’t read right or he didn’t know what he is talking about. So which is which?When I made that prediction it was all about Indonesia and not the US alone in the first place. Do you dig or are you a dick?
If I am not wrong you are always the one to jump into conclusion then start with your putdowns while attempting to insult others failing to understand the whole economic scenario and this is the result. The person who tries to insult others gets insulted. I hope my vocabulary is simple enough for both of you to understand.
I first made the predictions on Indonesia rupiahs because of the Indonesian economy caused by the Asia financial attack by Soros and that it will reach 12,500 and 13,500 due to the current inefficient Indonesian economic manoeuvre that was seen as impossible to apprehend the current situation when Liardion pops up.
I had actually be viewing a movie of the crisis and how the Hongkong Government managed to fend off such attack by money managers and Soros.
It then came the US bubble which I said will burst around 2012 but it came earlier then expected and that situation was similar to what had happened to Indonesia and then came this All About Bullshit pops up, so what does that mean?
Didn’t you understand that is the US economy was worse than expected, with such similarity to those of Indonesia, that they could no longer stand the strain and burst with such catastrophic result and eventually affecting the whole world economy because most of the commodities were based on US dollar.
And please tell me were you able to made the predictions in the first place? I came that close and I really don’t think Dicks like you are able to do so not even close. So tell who is reading wrong? He or you. I guess you know noughts or nuts.
AAB – you sleeping or what? DXP is from China – see his very first post (the second post on this thread). Maybe you should have said “you have not been out of China either.”
Did you see this? I needn’t tell you this so someone else came and tell him that he is seeing stars or eggs or he doesn’t know what he is talking about. Isn’t that a waste of time talking to people like the two of you.
Honestly, people like you, and dxp, and wandi, etc, got me thinking: why are the motives of these “people” bitching so much about indonesia, when it’s very clear they have no attachment whatsoever to Indonesia (except, maybe in your case, your-ex coolieland. you know, the place where you thought the people were easy to manipulate). Is it simply because they’re frustrated lunatics?
This should be said of you like perhaps NGACA SENDIRI DIDEPAN CERMIN.
Seriously, your rantings here proved nothing but you’re not going to be of any use for indonesian society. In spanish: no estan bienvenidos. Why don’t you just walk away? We have better people, both from indonesia and other countries, who actually love indonesia. And you know what, one doesn’t hate to be hateful for being critical.
Well I wonder if you really understand those words that came out of your mouth like doesn’t hate to be hateful for being critical.
But anyway Si Amigo, Aqui no Esta Bienvenido and one more thing the last word does not come with an “s” because Spanish does not spelt it that way or perhaps “arsehole” like you likes to be an “ass”. Don’t try my language.
And…, about the beggar-robber thing…, it’s called “analogy”. I was surprised, really, to learn (from your comment) that analogy doesn’t work in your mind. You said you are a liar? Sorry, I mean, lawyer.
To you it is all about anal logic you know like “anus”.
There are many theories about the origins of modern human beings but apart from some creationist God-freaks, the most plausible theory is that we all share a common ancestor with other great apes. By the way, did you know that in 2001 Chinese geneticists analyzed Y chromosomes in Chinese people and concluded that all Chinese samples contained a mutated gene M168G which is a marker believed to have appeared in the last 79,000 years on a number of Africans? This supports the Out-of-Africa model as opposed to the multiregional evolution model. No more need for overseas Chinese to segregate themselves in Chinatowns worldwide and reject the gweilo and pribumi. We are all Africans
Now you are speaking my language.
Then doesn’t that make you or the so called Superior Javanese Culture or your Manadonese Culture to be part of that?
Then tell me why the ranting, discriminations and hatred on the Chinese and Indonesian Chinese? Weren’t you all part of the same ancestry and the possibility of you being from the same Chinese or African ancestry?
Our most accurate reference point is that Nusantara Malay are Austronesians (who themselves are rather heterogeneous), a separate group, distinct from East Asians, inhabiting South East Asia and Oceania, originating from Formosa (who displaced the local Malays there?). That makes us closer relatives to Maori or Samoans than to Chinese. What happened before (the common Mongoloid origins of East Asians and Austronesians) is so vague and still being debated among many scholars.
I hate to paste links but continue to take a closer look and cross reference on Formosa – Taiwan (they are Chinese) before you continue to say your own statement to be meaningless after all.
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But anyway Si Amigo, Aqui no Esta Bienvenido and one more thing the last word does not come with an “s” because Spanish does not spelt it that way or perhaps “arsehole” like you likes to be an “ass”. Don’t try my language.
Uuu… wow… ha ha ha. All I can say to you: be a little less “sok tau” please.
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sputjam says:
when dragonwall was in indonesia, the indonesian economy collapsed.
Now that he is in the states, the Us economy implodes.
Next, he wished to be in china, a country where trouble makers are executed. better not. -
@ Dragonball,
You see that as a person banished and exploiting the Indonesians? No wonder someone would say,
AAB.. You are such a dick!
The response was expected when a Javanese stand up to his conviction. Would a lick-splitting chinese dare tell a bule off?
However, it had nothing to do with our debates. You tried to capitalize on the Oigal’s rebuff to make it looks like ang mo (bule) is barracking with Chinese. Have you no shame at all?
I wrote: Lick splitting with the Dutch, and helping the Dutch kill thousands of Javanese was not an honourable thing to do, or was it?
Dragonball reply: You said the Chinese help the Dutch kill thousands of Javanese? Consider if that is true and lets swap position, then what will be your comment?
Can you elaborate further? Can’t understand your singlish.
Did Deng Xiao Ping said that? He is not a Hakka but your half past six utter hakka nonsense shows that you are a chu now and did Deng Xiao Ping said that malai ngin tong thon ngin hay chi kar ngin? Fat dream.
My parents’ business relationship with one of Deng’s daughter goes back 3 decades. She is considered a family friend and had paid a few cordial visits and taken my family around whenever we visited China. My apartment in Bristol was bought off her. She spoke hakka and had maintained her dad, DXP, is a hakka ethnic unlike most officials who are mandarin speaker. I have no reason to doubt her.
I was in Brunei, I was in Sibu, I was in Sarawak. The reason I didn’t stay behind is I am clastophobic and I need space. When I was working with financial institutions in the 70’s I traveled there consulting finance with my clienteles there. Do I need to stay there?. Is there anything worth for me to stay? With timber and logs?
In Brunei, the Melayus, unlike the Javanese, are fiercely anti-chinese. Semuanya mata sepet stateless. Also back in the 70s, singaporeans are not highly regarded in Brunei. So not easy to make money laa. Teh lee berrr laa.
In Sibu, the hock chiews are clanish. They dislike singaporean. Also not easy to do business laa.
Every singapore underachievers were heading toward Indonesia and I see no reason why you didn’t follow the trend. Our Javanese government pampered and fattened our Chinese population. Short cut to richess if you could impregnant an Indon-chinese. gum bor?
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DW,
Unlike others here I do not hold grudge against Chinese or Chinese-Indonesians. I don’t have Chinese relatives, friends or acquaintances but they do not bother me. I identify myself as Manadonese but I don’t feel superior towards any other race or “suku bangsa”.
I just think you’re pathetic and laughable. You claim to have knowledge of business, debating, DNA and others issues but what you constantly fail to grasp here is that you’re the laughing stock of IM and many here are throwing baits and poking fun of you.
By all means, do stay here, every community needs its idiot to bash around.
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Uuu… wow… ha ha ha. All I can say to you: be a little less “sok tau” please.
Well I suppose this is what you’ve got, like being a fake Latino!
when dragonwall was in indonesia, the indonesian economy collapsed.
Now that he is in the states, the Us economy implodes.
Next, he wished to be in china, a country where trouble makers are executed. better not.When I was in Indonesia in 1987 what was the situation then! The Indo economy collapsed in 1996. I came to the US after the riot in 2000 their economy collapsed in 2008.
Well going to China will have something to do with my business so I guess you are quite right when “trouble makers” (you know who I am referring to like the fake Latino and All About Bullshit) will definitely get executed and not gassed. And one more thing the Chinese government will even make them pay for the bullet spent. So no free meal not even Deng Xiaoping, is around, will help save his day.
The response was expected when a Javanese stand up to his conviction. Would a lick-splitting chinese dare tell a bule off?
Honestly speaking, unless a person get offended, why not?
However, it had nothing to do with our debates. You tried to capitalize on the Oigal’s rebuff to make it looks like ang mo (bule) is barracking with Chinese. Have you no shame at all?
The most likely person that should feel ashamed must be you. Why? You are a coward and a traitor and always strayed into another subject when confronted and it is people like you that couldn’t answer directly to a question. As to Oigal’s comment I am just giving you some refreshment just in case you forget that there are numerous people in these blogs that dislike the way comments were full of rubbish and most of all you have them without using a brain. Oh one thing I forgot that you are a Chu Now. Well I guess that said all.
Dragonball reply: You said the Chinese help the Dutch kill thousands of Javanese? Consider if that is true and lets swap position, then what will be your comment? Can you elaborate further? Can’t understand your singlish.
I could only tell you this and that is that if you can’t understand the word “swap” then that also says that you are a “Otak Dengkul”.
Well since you need elaboration, that’s fine.
Swap meant = If the Javanese were in the position as the Chinese during the Dutch colonial rules then what will you comments be. Would you bhe saying that the Javanese helped the Dutch killed thousands of Javanese? And don’t forget that in fact there were many of the Javanese involved that they were forced to provide information to the Dutch enabling them to carry out the massacre. Is that clear enough?
My parents’ business relationship with one of Deng’s daughter goes back 3 decades. She is considered a family friend and had paid a few cordial visits and taken my family around whenever we visited China. My apartment in Bristol was bought off her. She spoke hakka and had maintained her dad, DXP, is a hakka ethnic unlike most officials who are mandarin speaker. I have no reason to doubt her.
Ha ha ha I wonder if she had see this comment what will she say? Relatives of such high ranking officials to be doing business with you or your parent’s? This could only mean one thing and that is you must be a Chinese. They do not do business with foreigners. Why? Figure that out yourself.
In Brunei, the Melayus, unlike the Javanese, are fiercely anti-chinese. Semuanya mata sepet stateless. Also back in the 70s, singaporeans are not highly regarded in Brunei. So not easy to make money laa. Teh lee berrr laa.
Check that out with the census board and re confirm it yourself to see if they are stateless.
Well in the 70’s was up and coming so to no surprise with Bruneians because they don’t pay tax and the country has oil to subsidized them But how about taking a look into today situation and make a comparison?
To you yah it must have been Teh lee berrr laa. But for us money managers at that time it never seems to have a problem at all. You are such a Dick.
In Sibu, the hock chiews are clanish. They dislike singaporean. Also not easy to do business laa.
Oh ya I know because most of our clients were Fuqing (Hok chia) like the family of Eddy Tansil.
And one thing wrong about your statements is that the Hokian, Hokcew, Fuqing,
Henghwa they all come from Fujian Province and they are quite well knitted in the Singapore community. To me you display your sheer ignorance in understanding those from the same province but were located in Sibu and Singapore.Every singapore underachievers were heading toward Indonesia and I see no reason why you didn’t follow the trend.
Tell you this much. A family friend owns the Mazda distributorship in Singapore and had expanded into Indonesia. After the confrontation he was the first person to return to Indonesia with a 0001 visa. Check that out with your government who this person is. Later Liem soe Liong elbow him out of the distributorship. So why must we jump into Indonesia when Indonesians themselves were coming into Singapore. We manage all the business from Batam, Riau, Tanjong Pinang, Bintan and Medan. All those ships from Indonesia that enters Singapore will come to us to make purchase on a weekly basis. Can you imagine the amount of money we loaned the Indonesians. The rupiahs was somewhere between 25 to 75 to a SGD. Want to use a calculator to figure how much that was.
Eager to know who they were? How about Andes, Tampomas I and II as well as those coming out from outlying islands before the ferry and hovercraft service started.
So can you give me a reason why should I jump into Indonesia because you think that the Indonesians are rich and others are not.Not forgetting at that time we also manage shipping and oil rig business.
You also want to know right? Ring a bell? Find that out yourself.
You don’t know who we were. Anyway who is Liem soe Liong at that time? Nothing to us, let alone your later born rob, corrupt and get rich Javanese
Our Javanese government pampered and fattened our Chinese population. Short cut to richess if you could impregnant an Indon-chinese. gum bor?
Yah that is what you said because of your jealousy and envying their success. The truth is quite unlike what your grey stuff in the otak dengkul can spill. And the only thing you could think of is to impregnate and Indon-Chinese to get rich. Well like what you said it is always the gum bor to do such a thing and have a teenage girl rubbing on your lap.
So how about your Indglish (sorry I mean Indonesian English)“impregnant”
Unlike others here I do not hold grudge against Chinese or Chinese-Indonesians. I don’t have Chinese relatives, friends or acquaintances but they do not bother me. I identify myself as Manadonese but I don’t feel superior towards any other race or “suku bangsa”.
Well me too. But how about you leaving Indonesia and embarking onto the Dutch soil all these while and now instigating others to sue the Dutch? Is that a grudge or what, and who becomes the pathetic and laughable person, well please tell us.
You claim to have knowledge of business,
Yes I am very versatile with this.
For debating, that is my main line of business.
DNA is all about links from websites even a kid could do that and others issues is all about personal knowledge that you only know how to write but fails to introspect by having cross references before posting.
Well you know clearly who you are and what position you are standing and when you made that posting earlier what you fail to grasp here is that you’re beginning to make yourself a laughing stock of IM and of course people who are not loyal to their own country should be thrown baits and poking fun of.
You are right, at then end of the day it is those idiots to be bash around because every community needs it to be more humorous and be humiliated, right!
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Oh dragie,
Even direct, crystal clear, explicit words from Lairedion can’t help opening your eyes. Sin salvaciòn.
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Sputjam said: when dragonwall was in indonesia, the indonesian economy collapsed. Now that he is in the states, the Us economy implodes. Next, he wished to be in china, a country where trouble makers are executed. better not.
When I was in Indonesia in 1987 what was the situation then! The Indo economy collapsed in 1996. I came to the US after the riot in 2000 their economy collapsed in 2008.
I found this not inconsistent with what sputjam said. Anyway, dragie, what sputjam said is a joke, you should know that. So, don’t sweat on it. We know you’re nothing; you can’t make any impact (for the good or bad), less single-handedly.
AAB said:My parents’ business relationship with one of Deng’s daughter goes back 3 decades. She is considered a family friend and had paid a few cordial visits and taken my family around whenever we visited China. My apartment in Bristol was bought off her. She spoke hakka and had maintained her dad, DXP, is a hakka ethnic unlike most officials who are mandarin speaker. I have no reason to doubt her.
Ha ha ha I wonder if she had see this comment what will she say? Relatives of such high ranking officials to be doing business with you or your parent’s?
Why? Envy? Or simply can’t accept the fact brownmen do business with (mainland) chinese?
This could only mean one thing and that is you must be a Chinese. They do not do business with foreigners. Why? Figure that out yourself.
Don’t apply / generalize the attitude you and your circle are having to the rest of chinese. Less the mainland chinese. Don’t pretend you’re speaking for them.
In Sibu, the hock chiews are clanish. They dislike singaporean. Also not easy to do business laa.
Oh ya I know because most of our clients were Fuqing (Hok chia) like the family of Eddy Tansil.
Interesting. I remember Eddy Tansil. I was in junior high-school when the news about him came up. I saw his face / photos in TVRI as buron (wanted person) for the money he had stolen. Ugly, in and out. So, you have (or had) tie with him? Oh, right, _now_ I can understand why you have such an attitude.
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I pity those papuans.
they are stuck between two superpowers – Mojo’s (mojopohit) and hongky tonks.(china).
I don’t really understand what the fuss is aboiut being indonesian. Some like wandi has abandoned indonesia for her own reasons. but there are many who have quit being singaporeans as well.
So is DW, in Goh Chok Tong’s own words, a stayer or a quitter? -
casey says:
Chinese is the cause of disunity. Think about it, even in USA, where all people, from different races, different origins have the single common thing called the “American Dream” that unites them, one race remains dis-united from the rest of the nation. And they are called *drum roll in the back* the “American Born Chinese”. Wow, they even have their own nickname, ABC. Why oh why, why can’t they simply be “American Born”? Why the “American Born… Chinese”? Ha! So, Chinese you have lots things to think about. Why oh why, no matter where Chinese are in this world, they remain, forever and ever and ever dis-united from the rest? Why oh why? Why not the Indians, for example. They are smoothly integrated into the rest of the society, while the Chinese remains separate and forever still affiliated to their “mainland”.
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@ Dragonball,
…. . As to Oigal’s comment I am just giving you some refreshment just in case you forget that there are numerous people in these blogs that dislike the way comments were full of rubbish and most of all you have them without using a brain…..
If you practise what you preach, then you should at least reflect on comments directed to you from other posters like ‘Your argument have no sustance’, ‘Youre running on empty tank’ etc.
Swap meant = If the Javanese were in the position ….. And don’t forget that in fact there were many of the Javanese involved that they were forced to provide information to the Dutch enabling them to carry out the massacre. Is that clear enough?
Exactly. When we got rid of the Dutch, the local traitors and the chinese rats were rounded up by the angry mobs and many killed. So what is your complaint?
To rescue the remaining Indon-chinese from total annihilation, something had to be done by the ruling Javanese to placate the fury of pribumis wronged by chinese. However the restrictions and bans were nothing compared to what neighbouring Melayus imposed on their chinese population.
Many Indon-chinese has not been to Malaysia, much less Brunei. A tamer and less whinging chinese population does not mean all is dandy onboard. Take it from eye witness accounts. Indonesia has chinese problem because the chinese are spoilt rotten here.
Ha ha ha I wonder if she had see this comment what will she say? Relatives of such high ranking officials to be doing business with you or your parent’s? This could only mean one thing and that is you must be a Chinese.
She will think you are a clueless loud-mouthed singaporean. This is the 3rd time you mentioned that I am chinese. These are 2 possibilities why you think so:
1) This is a skay leee huan na. He even corrected my chinese mistranslation on 2 occasions.
2) anh kham lor . He is able to delve into embarrasing areas a parasitic chinese would not reveal.They do not do business with foreigners. Why? Figure that out yourself.
Yes, tell me why. You have been saying ‘figure that out yourself’ one too many times.
I wrote: In Brunei, the Melayus, unlike the Javanese, are fiercely anti-chinese. Semuanya mata sepet stateless. Also back in the 70s, singaporeans are not highly regarded in Brunei. So not easy to make money laa. Teh lee berrr laa.
Dragonball replies: Check that out with the census board and re confirm it yourself to see if they are stateless.
Dragonball, you told me to check census board!! Are you backing up my statement, or are you refuting it?
I thought things must have improved for the chinese population in Brunei and I could be wrong for once. Check them out yourself.
I will continue with the rest when I next log on as I prefer brevity.
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@ AAB..
I will continue with the rest when I next log on as I prefer brevity.
What does this actually mean for those of us that speak English??
And when are you going to stop digging up history and get with today’s world? I’m sick of hearing you whine about what happened years ago, at this rate the British should sue the the Italians for the times the Romans colonized England yea?
You obviously hate the Chinese why I don’t know, but I think it’s because they WORK for a living and you don’t, so get off your lazy arse and go to work, and maybe in about a hundred years Indonesia wont be considered as a third world country. -
@ Dragonball,
Guess what I found when I typed in Deng China.
Deng Xiansheng (simplified Chinese: ???; traditional Chinese: ???) Deng Xiaoping, the former paramount leader of China, was born into a Hakka family in Guang An county in Sichuan province[1][2]. Deng’s ancestors could be traced back to Meixian.
And here was what you wrote:
Did Deng Xiao Ping said that? He is not a Hakka but your half past …
You are talking out of your rear.
Tell you this much. A family friend owns the Mazda distributorship in Singapore and had expanded into Indonesia…..
Yes, continue on with the Mazda distributorship. Let’s see how far your lie can go before youre caught with your pant down. FYI, you are talking about a family I know and they are Javanese, not Indon-chinese.
You are talking out of your rear yet again.
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@ schmerly
Having an Indon wife do not make you one of us. Indonesian are still wary of bule as many are amber-alert risk. You need to understand Pancasila first, okay?
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@ AAB.. BTW At what point in history are going to stop blaming, A: The Dutch, B: The Chinese, C: The USA, D: The UK, and everybody else in the world for your problems?? Your not a colony of anybody any more, so why can’t you stop being so envious and get to work and make Indonesia great, or is WORK a dirty word in your language??
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@ AAB..
Having an Indon wife do not make you one of us. Indonesian are still wary of bule as many are amber-alert risk. You need to understand Pancasila first, okay?
I don’t consider myself as “one of us” because I have an Indonesian wife, and I see your harping back to your sad little bencong friend, i.e. read the Pancasila! do you understand what Pancasila means?? I don’t think so.
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@ schmerly
@ AAB.. BTW At what point in history are going to stop blaming, A: The Dutch, B: The Chinese, C: The USA, D: The UK, and everybody else in the world for your problems?? Your not a colony of anybody any more, so why can’t you stop being so envious and get to work and make Indonesia great, or is WORK a dirty word in your language??
Ahhh .. I see where your problem is now. How should Brown men get compo from the Dutch if they don’t speak up? Maybe you have a better idea.
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@ schmerly
Reading and understanding are 2 different things altogether. No wonder you are as bule as you step foot onto our shore, nothing change.
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@ AAB.. Do try and give me a proper answer, instead of waffling on about the brown man. once again:
@ AAB.. BTW At what point in history are going to stop blaming, A: The Dutch, B: The Chinese, C: The USA, D: The UK, and everybody else in the world for your problems?? Your not a colony of anybody any more, so why can’t you stop being so envious and get to work and make Indonesia great, or is WORK a dirty word in your language??
And once again:
I don’t consider myself as “one of us” because I have an Indonesian wife, and I see your harping back to your sad little bencong friend, i.e. read the Pancasila! do you understand what Pancasila means?? I don’t think so.
Do try and answer, SENSIBLY!!.
Comment on “Causes of Disunity”.
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@ dxp
Can you focus on my previous statements and response to them?