‘Ilusi Negara Islam’

May 21st, 2009, in News & Issues, by Patung

View the original article here.

40 Comments on “‘Ilusi Negara Islam’”

Pages: « 1 [2]

Odinius Says:
May 27th, 2009 at 11:38 pm
ET said:

PKS and a lot of other Islamists are indeed affiliated with the Muslim Brotherhood but they are not directly involved with the emergence of the conservative, exclusivist madrasas of a new type.

Yeah, I was just trying to point out that, for a lot of people, all Islamism is “wahhabism,” and thus ignore that many fundamentalist groups have conflicting agenda, and pose different challenges to Indonesia’s pluralist order.
Odinius Says:
May 27th, 2009 at 11:45 pm
Cuk said:

Yes no question that PKS is still playing within the rules of game but they are playing for the lose because the current democracy game is contradict with many guidance on the Islamic teaching itself and more over, PKS seemed to me try to blend the water with the oil that the process will never work.

That depends on what Islamic teachings you follow. Obviously which hadiths you decide are more important than which others would make the difference, from a theological point of view, as would taking a metaphorical vs. literalist approach to the Quran. There are plenty of variants of Islamic theology that fit snugly with democracy, just as there are variants of Christianity, Judaism, or Hinduism that do not (they all have notions of divine kingship, pyramidal power structures, etc. built into scriptures).

As I see it, usually the people who say “Islam and democracy are not compatible” are either Islamophobes or Muslims who seek to benefit from a non-democratic order.
Patung Says:
May 28th, 2009 at 5:23 am
Ross said

I notice in the press there is some talk of retailers not selling the new book due to threats from intimidatory ‘goaties’ on the prowl.

Well I did mention a bit of that in the post but … Ahmad Suaedy from Wahid Institute says that bookstores generally don’t stock it because ‘maybe they’re afraid’. detik
adin Says:
May 30th, 2009 at 1:48 pm
this book is garbage
djoko Says:
May 30th, 2009 at 3:56 pm
Interesting how no one has made mention that several of the researchers who were ostensibly involved in the book itself are rejecting it as being nothing more than a political exercise, as opposed to having any real worth:

http://www.republika.co.id/berita/52460/Pernyataan_Sikap_atas_Buku_Ilusi_Negara_Islam

Just for those interested too, those researchers aren’t hardliners who decided that the book was being used for ‘evil liberal purposes’ or anything like that. At least one of them is a member of JIMM, the Muhammadiyah equivalent of JIL (every bule’s favourite bunch of Muslims).

Gus Dur and WI in some ways are a bit like the mirror reflection of HTI. Never let the truth get in the way of a good ideological axe to grind.
Abdul Khalid al Jumhuri Says:
May 30th, 2009 at 5:51 pm
I have my first-hand experiences with some prominent PKS cadres who are now holding power here and there. I knew them since 1987, 11 years before the fall of Suharto. My take? I could not trust any of those dudes. Firstly, they have the right to deny the Al-Haramain money that they received, which is wahabbian fund. Secondly, they will conveniently change sides to the highest bidders for so long as it benefit them – it is only politics. Thirdly, they are desperate for power and very jealous to those have it. Lastly, when they win in any contest, they hogged-down all available cakes for themselves and never for the betterment of Indonesia. I have never seen any Indonesian political party so insiduous as this one.
Mohamad Sofyan Says:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:20 pm
If the book is right and objective, Indonesia will be jeopardized, like in Iraq, Palestine, Pakistan, Sudan…But I am still optimistic that there are still a lot of moslems who are intelligent and moderate….
Norm Chumpsky Says:
June 5th, 2009 at 2:46 pm
Sylvester, dejavu, ET: You’re pretty much right no the money.

Cukurangan, Odinius: Cuk, I think Odi is right in this instance. You make a great point, looking at the history of similar efforts, but the PKS/Indonesia case is truly unique… and troubling. PKS do not need to win it all. They just need to win enough. After all, they won more in this year’s legislative election than PD/SBY won in the 2004 leg. election. And may just get the four dream ministries they have been aiming for (at this stage of the game).
Albert Nichow Says:
June 5th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
The Best Book in this year over the world
saptukelono Says:
June 19th, 2009 at 12:33 am
What so interesting is the fact that the mentioned organizations hardly made a peep as if they affirmed the allegations written in the book.