Dating Indonesian Girls

Apr 4th, 2006, in Society, by

Dating Indonesian women may not be for everyone.

Indonesian women, particularly on the island of Java, are exceptionally beautiful. They tend towards the very feminine side, with lovely skin, are not too tall, and have knock-out smiles. There's plenty of plus on that side of things.

If wer'e to be honest we have to recognise that many men are interested in a woman who will take care of him, do the housework without complaint, and take care of other matters similarly without much bother. Your average Indonesian girl often fits the bill in this respect, certainly more than your average western woman, the less said about them the better.

On the other hand going out with Indonesian women in a romantic way can have many mysterious pitfalls.

Some women here are clearly only interested in money. Some men are unbothered by this. Others of the female variety, can, once we get to know them very well, come across as practically insane, hysterically emotional, scheming, over-possessive, inclined to, usually fake, attempts at self-harm in order to get their way. As I said, not for the faint-hearted.

There are a few Indonesia dating websites although the area is not nearly as developed as that in nearby Phillipines or Thailand. To begin your online journey on the Indonesian dating scene our very own "Meet" section has many a lady eager for company.


4,898 Comments on “Dating Indonesian Girls”

  1. avatar Idris says:

    David,

    What do you means by AYAM, you are treating this girls as though they are animals?

  2. avatar Harry says:

    I don’t agree that Indonesian girls like just any white guy. I been in Indonesia many years and even though i have (in my opinion) a good job and a comfortable income/lifestyle i never managed to hook an indo girl. I’m actually not the type of guy looking for fun only. I have always been seriously looking for a girlfriend. Maybe that is the reason and the girls pick up on it. Most Indonesian girls just wanna have short time fun with as many tall white guys as tehy can get. They are not interested in serious relationship with a nice white guy, I’m talking about he middle class girls here. Most if not each of my white friends date different Indonesian girls each day, and they always end up sleeping wih their dates immediately.

  3. avatar Avi says:

    Harry,

    It seems that regardless of whether you are bule or not, in Indonesia or otherwise, you are the sort of guy that just doesn’t get laid, or chooses not to get laid. Either you’re a closet homosexual or someone who’s really not that horny, possibly even a hypochondriac??. That’s cool. I guess. Also, just so you know, I think most people just get freaked out by people looking for serious relationships….they’re supposed to just happen. People shouldn’t go around looking for them, that’s just weird. Weird. And nice guys are boring….soooo boring. In fact, the word nice is just sh*t. Possibly the worst adjective in the English language. So Harry, you gotta decide….is that you….boring and nice….if so…I think you’ll be a perfect match for people who are into classifieds and online dating and all that stuff. But dude, that’s just weird. Your other choice is get a hair cut, sh*t…die your hair, get some cool jeans, slick shirts, new pair a sneakers and go get yourself some play….the ladies in many jakarta hot spots are sluts/easy so avoid blok m, dragonfly and the rest of those places and go to Bali. The cool Jakarta chicks hang out in Bali. The cool Jakarta chicks in Jakarta hang out at house parties. Hey dude….maybe you should check out stadders

    whatever, ignore my advice. You nice guy. Go to the village, turn Muslim and find yourself a nice girl.

    ah

  4. avatar Harry says:

    Yes avi I’m the sort of guy that just doesn’t get laid regardless where he is and regardless of the fact how easy or hard the women in that particular place are (Indo. is considered the easiest place to pick up on earth). I’m never saying I want a serious relationship but also would like to have fun when possible, i was just meaning it is in the back of my mind to ever have a gf.

    I been to all the places you mentioned but alas no luck, especially not with the cool chicks cos they are obviously a lot harder (for me) to get then the chicks or ayam that hang out in the night spots like blok M. But even the chicks in Blok M are not easy to get for me (only the way past their selling date fat girls) so i also never managed to score there.
    We have to face that most white guys in jkt are young and tall and there is no way for me to eve compete with them, i get older each year and with each year that passes my chances (if i ever had any) diminish further

  5. avatar Thanylle says:

    looking for boyfriend size average, good looking, bule, eanglish speaking and indoneasian speaking. I am thanylle, 28 years old, I am kokesian means, mom Indonesian and dad Australian.

  6. avatar ruud says:

    Thanylle, what kind of friend?
    If you’ve read these articles about those relationships what do you think?

  7. avatar Harry says:

    I speak english and Indonesian but I’m not goodlooking so I don’t qualify.

  8. avatar Peter says:

    Very interesting comments here. I’m a freshman in college in the U.S., and I plan to study for a year in Perth, Australia in 2 years from now. I will take Indonesian language classes while there, and maybe (if I can afford it) visit Indonesia. It is a very interesting and dynamic country that I hope to learn more about. I am not interested in “sex tourism” , but the thought of possibly dating an Indonesian girl has come to mind. I have a few questions about Indonesian women, which may be naive, so I apologize in advance.

    Where is a good place to meet nice, intelligent girls who are not materialistic?

    I am American, but am not “white”. In fact I’m “mixed”, and could maybe pass for Mid-Eastern or Indian (people tell me). What do Indonesian girls think of this complexion? do they only seek European-looking men?

    Thanks you for this valuable information!

    Selamat malam

  9. avatar Thanylle says:

    Ruud

    I think that they just want to speak up what they thing and they feel in they mine, nothing wrong with that, that what this website for right?
    But another thing. I don’t really understand is people come to Indonesia to get the experient about about country, I think they should accept the differences, not complain about it, if they want to have indo girl gf they should be ready for the difference and don’t get upset about it but if you do have problem you have to fix it for good (for long relationship) and I don’t think is good for both side to talk about own problem in the public like this web site that showing how weak you are. Remember is not easy to change the habit, but if you try to understand each other the relationship will work up better. By the way are you dutch?

    ——-

    harry

    I think you not really confident about yourself. I dont event know how you look, how old are, your personality, only me who can say good looking or not good looking because that person is for me not for himself, Harry every body is handsome and beautiful, you don’t make your self, you come out from your mother as your are, so accept it darling.

  10. avatar joe says:

    I want meet the Indonesian girl who want understand me..
    and make a serious relationship…

  11. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:

    Peter said:

    Where is a good place to meet nice, intelligent girls who are not materialistic?

    University Quran Recital perhaps?

    But seriously, nice, intelligent, non materialistic girls can be found anywhere, just approach them and talk to them. Most Indonesian girls, and boys come to that like the opportunity to talk to foreigners, try the street, tourist attractions, shopping malls, coffee shops, university kampus, there will be lots and lots of boys and girls who will approach you to practice their English and to just ask questions about you and get to know you, and it would be a perfect opportunity to practice your Bahasa Indonesia. Don’t be put off by their questions, they are not being nosey, they are just interested in you!

    Now the not so good part, Indonesian culture seems to equate pale skin with beauty, you only need to look at our cinetron actors and actresses and general advertising to realise that, that is not to say that darker skinned people are considered ugly, it is just that paler is considered more beautiful.

    Indonesian girls do not I believe seek out any particular race or type of man, but rather a man who loves and cares for them, who can respect them and share all aspects of their lives with them. They are looking for commitment and devotion!

    Harry,

    You obviously have a serious hangup about your height, if your conversations face to face with people are the same as your comments her, I am not suprised that the girls are put off. I would suggest that you see a therapist and get some resolution on you height issues and then try again.

  12. avatar Peter says:

    Thanks for the response. It is interesting to consider the differences in expectations about relationships in Indonesia & “the West”. From what I’ve read, Indonesian girls seem rather quick (by U.S. standards) to consider marriage. In the U.S., marriage is seen almost as a dangerous risk by most young people these days. Perhaps the fact that – in Islam marriage is considered a blessing and pactically a duty – has influenced these trends in Indonesia.

    Relationship dynamics also seem to be different in the U.S.. Here, couples are seen as sort of a team that splits everything 50/50, where in Indonesia there seems to be more responsibility placed on the male to provide for the female, while the woman is responsible for domestic duties. Both of these views have their pros and cons.

    Do these issues tend to cause the most problems between foreigner/Indo couples?

    Of course these are broad generalizations, and are more or less true depending on what part of the country one is in.

    Many of the accounts I’ve read about Indonesian women seem to be written by tourists, and I suspect that the girls in these accounts are not typical of “normal” Indonesian urban women.

    Do “normal” (i.e. not loose and promiscuous) Indonesian girls even date? If so, what do they expect from a boyfriend (i.e. paying for things, making decisions)?

    Basically what I am looking for is an intelligent (and attractive) girl with strong character who is willing to develop a certain level of intimacy (not necessarily in the physical sense, but emotionally/spiritually), but at the same time is not trashy/easy.

    I begin to get the impression from these accounts that Indonesian girls are either

    a) opposed to any relationship before marriage

    or

    b) trendy, partying all the time, with loose sexual habits

    Are there many girls that fall in between these two categories (i.e. open to relationships and getting to know and love somebody, but still keeping their dignity and integrity)?

  13. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:

    Hi Peter,

    I will attempt to answer some of your questions in as much as my personal experience allows. My wife and I know a few mixed couples so have some exposure to the situation.

    Your first question:

    Perhaps the fact that – in Islam marriage is considered a blessing and pactically a duty – has influenced these trends in Indonesia.

    This is not purely an Islamic thing, in Indonesia, most people are quite religious although it may not always appear so from the media. I would say that all religions do they not, value the institution of marriage and consider it a sacred duty? Most families would expect their offspring to be married by their early twenties, in rural area’s before this age!

    Second question:

    Relationship dynamics also seem to be different in the U.S.. Here, couples are seen as sort of a team that splits everything 50/50, where in Indonesia there seems to be more responsibility placed on the male to provide for the female, while the woman is responsible for domestic duties.

    Traditionally in rural areas this is the case, but this seems to be breaking down slowly in urban areas, where it may be easier for the woman to find a wage earning job, although this does lead to some marital breakdowns as the man feels that he is losing face by being provided for. The other choice in this case is when both couples work and use part of the extra income to employ a maid to look after the house and children while the parents are at work.

    For all of the mixed couples that I know the traditional male provider and female responsible for the running of the home etc. system seems to be the case. Most of my foreign male friends seem to like this arrangement and to be honest most of their wives are happy with it as well.

    Third:

    Do these issues tend to cause the most problems between foreigner/Indo couples?

    From what I have seen, an emphatic no would be the answer. Exluding the problems which befall all marriages anywhere in the world, debt and monetary problems, infidelity and incompatability. I would say that the biggest problems are caused by family. Here in Indonesia family is very important, and families are generally quite extended, the more affluent members of the family are expected to assist the less fortunate members of the family and all members of the family are expected to contribute to family life and gather at family gatherings, weddings, funerals, family get togethers, etc. This does seems to cause stress to some of the foreign partners who are not used this.

    This starts from the beginning of any relationship, and when you ‘marry the girl’ you ‘marry the family’!

    Fourth:

    Do “normal” (i.e. not loose and promiscuous) Indonesian girls even date? If so, what do they expect from a boyfriend (i.e. paying for things, making decisions)?

    Yes of course they date, do you think we are living in the dark ages 😉 . Yes I think it would be safe to assume that you would end up covering any monetary costs, cinema tickets, entry tickets, food, taxi’s etc. possibly for her sister or a friend if they brought them along as well, don’t forget how important family is, and a sister of friend would normally be expected to accompany you until you had attended a couple of family gatherings, and family approval of the friendship had been obtained. As far as making decisions is concerned, Indonesian girls like their menfolk to make decisions for them as it makes them feel cared for, however if you make the wrong decision most of them will have no hesitation in letting you know!

    Lastly:

    Basically what I am looking for is an intelligent (and attractive) girl with strong character who is willing to develop a certain level of intimacy (not necessarily in the physical sense, but emotionally/spiritually), but at the same time is not trashy/easy.

    I begin to get the impression from these accounts that Indonesian girls are either

    a) opposed to any relationship before marriage

    or

    b) trendy, partying all the time, with loose sexual habits

    Are there many girls that fall in between these two categories (i.e. open to relationships and getting to know and love somebody, but still keeping their dignity and integrity)?

    The vast majority of the girls fall between those two extremes, with many, many shades in between. This beautiful country is full of variety and diversity!

    Of course I am biased but I would say that there is nothing that a man could want which he could not find in an Indonesian girl, if you are prepared to search for the right one, to respect them and treat them like the Jewels which they are, they are the greatest companions in all of Gods creation.

  14. avatar 1ndra says:

    Good answers brother…

  15. avatar Peter says:

    Thanks for the feedback, and thanks for being patient with my sometimes ignorant questions.

    Most Americans cannot even point out Indonesia on a map – let alone comment on its culture and customs. It is really baffling to me that the 4th most populated country in the world that also has the largest Muslim population is relatively unknown in my country.

    (Are Americans unpopular in Indonesia (are we viewed with resentment or hostility) because of our government’s foolish foreign policy?)

    What little coverage our media does give to Indonesia usually focuses on sensationalized accounts of Muslim extremists. (The headline “Millions of normal people living in Indonesia” would not attract very much attention here..) I hope Indonesians can keep the balance between Islam and adat.

    Indonesia is so interesting to me because of its dynamism, diversity, and natural beauty. Almost any topic of interest is contained in Indonesia – environmental issues (deforestation), gender/urbanization issues, economic development, balancing religion and government, managing ethnic/religious/linguistic diversity, vibrant art, balancing culture & customs with tourism and globalization, etc.

    And of course I would be lying if I was not impressed with Indonesia’s wealth of beautiful women!

  16. avatar 1ndra says:

    No, I’m not into hostility with American people, we are just neighbours, but sometimes some governments make bad images to us…check…governmet…not the people

  17. avatar ruud says:

    Thanylle,
    I have to agree in a way with you, however i think most expats end up in countries which they never knew before. For them and me it is an adventure and challenge to visit and being part of a new culture, meeting different people; it is a learning cycle. As it was and still is for me.
    And as Mohammed put so nicely, we are suddenly confronted with the Jewels of Asia. So different from the girls back home, so yes we have to addapt, but not only us. I still has to come both ways

    Ooh and yeah i am a Dutchy

    Mohammed:loved you comment, learned a lot!!

  18. avatar Peter says:

    Do Indonesian women generally expect to have children right away after marriage? How many children do they desire? (Personally, I agree that “two is enough”)

    When ex-pats come to Indonesia, does everybody assume that we’re bursting with money? I personally have no problem covering things like dinners, movies, taxis, etc., but it would certainly be difficult to deal with a woman who always expected me to buy her anything she wanted.

    Also, is it necessary to be “Muslim” in order for an Indonesian girl to truly accept you or consider dating you? If so, what does this condition of being “Muslim” actually mean?

    Haha this is a funny one: Do Indonesian women like facial hair?

    Please let me know if there is a book out there on the social norms of modern Indonesian women..

    hehehe, every time one question is answered I think of 5 new ones!

    Aside from addressing my (sometimes silly) questions, what advice would you give any ex-pat about dating Indo girls?

    I almost feel bad asking so many questions, but this is after all a great way to learn. If anyone has any questions about stuff like this in the U.S., I will be happy to answer your questions!

    Peace

  19. avatar Jo says:

    Hi, don’t know whether it’s relevant to what you guys are talking about. But I just had a good talk with my stepson yesterday after finding out that he is dating a married indo woman (who apparently just got married 3 months ago with an aussie and moved to Sydney) and apparently her married indo friends are just the same like her, sleeping around with all different guys.

    I am Indonesian myself and I feel angry and embarrased with these kind of attitudes. Those women would give a bad impression of what general people think of indo women. I would certainly think what sort of life these women had before they moved to this country.

    So, good advice for you guys who wants to date indo women, just make sure don’t pick them up from the bar or probably I am wrong who knows??. Get to know their background, education, their family and simply their personalities before having a further relationship with them (including having their blood test taken for STI’s, am I too extreme or what?).

    Cheers, Jo

  20. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:

    Peter,

    You asked:

    Do Indonesian women generally expect to have children right away after marriage? How many children do they desire? (Personally, I agree that “two is enough”)

    I think this depends completely on the woman involved, again there will be a difference between women from rural areas and women from urban areas, generally the better educated women, or those with jobs or careers, will want to wait.

    The women from rural areas however still consider marriage and children as their destiny, and would not hesitate to start a family straight away. There are also financial considerations in this, as the children will be the financial providers and support for the parents in their old age. As I said in an earlier comment family is very important for support in all sectors of society!

    As far as the girls parents and family are concerned, they will expect her to fall pregnant as soon as the wedding ceremony is completed and will not stop asking about pregnancy and children until that condition is fulfilled!

    As to the number of children, the families in rural areas are generally larger than those in urban areas, because of the financial support issues mentioned earlier. Many families in urban areas where the education is better are having smaller families as they realise that providing a better education for a smaller number of children is a logical alternative to the older way.

    When ex-pats come to Indonesia, does everybody assume that we’re bursting with money? I personally have no problem covering things like dinners, movies, taxis, etc., but it would certainly be difficult to deal with a woman who always expected me to buy her anything she wanted.

    The answer to the first part of this is yes, there is a general misconception that all expats are rich, although I know many who are not, and are paid Rupiah salaries, however they are in the minority. The vast majority of expats here enjoy salaries way above their Indonesian counterparts. However even if you are not wealthy you would still be able to enjoy yourself here as the cost of living is still relatively low as long as you are willing to immerse yourself in the local lifestyle, don’t forget that by the standards of a lot of Indonesians you are still very well off.

    The second part of your question, well that will depend on your choice of partner. The vast majority of women here are not overly materialistic, although some undoubtedly are, the majority are not, and would be as happy that you bought them a small gift as a large one, the fact that you have shown them that you are thinking about them is what they are concerned about.
    If you choose a girl who expects you to buy everything she asks for, you have made a poor choice considering that she will be in the minority!

    Also, is it necessary to be “Muslim” in order for an Indonesian girl to truly accept you or consider dating you? If so, what does this condition of being “Muslim” actually mean?

    No, we also have other religions, Catholic, Protestant, Hindu, Buddhist. If by dating you mean socialising as a couple I don’t think many girls would have a problem with others of a different religion. If however you mean courtship in pursuit of a long term relationship, I think that would be a different matter. I can only give you the viewpoint from a Muslim perspective, but if you were dating a Muslim girl she would likely bring up the issue of religion even from the first date and would in a subtle way start to ask you about your beliefs and checking about your willingness to convert to Islam. I know very few cases where a Muslimah has left her religion for a man of a different faith.

    As to what being a Muslim really means, I may not be the best person to give you an answer to that as my ideas about Islam are not really mainstream, I have travelled a great deal, asked many questions, and learned too much to follow the mainsteam tenents of Islam.

    According to Al Quran ” Any that believe in God, believe in the ‘Day of Judgement’ and do good deeds have nothing to fear from God” for me it is as simple as that! Although you will find many here who cannot accept the simplicity of such a statement.

    Do Indonesian women like facial hair?

    You would have to ask them, difficult for me to answer that one! Why don’t you get on an Indonesian Chatroom on the Internet? I am sure you would learn a lot more about Indonesia and Indonesians from that, than you can here.

    Aside from addressing my (sometimes silly) questions, what advice would you give any ex-pat about dating Indo girls?

    Be genuine, sincere, honest and respectful.

  21. avatar PerempuanRantau says:

    Wow it is definitely a hot debate 🙂 Actually love to read it coz you see so many perspectives…and after some good closing from Pak Khafi, I would like just to add your answer on Peter’s question with example of being genuine, sincere, honest and respectful.

    I am Indonesia woman – loves going out- (but not to have loose sex)-used to be live in rural but because of education opportunity spent seven years studied and later worked in Jakarta.

    I’ve been happily married for one year now with my “sort of expat (used to be locally hired)”-short (1.74m)-smart-not nerd- boyfriend. We married after five years steady relationship. Our love grew as we talked and discussed Indonesia and world matter and later found that despite of our different race and gender (hehehe) we have quite same opinion on lots of topics. However still we need these five years to settle our culture and background difference. And we still learn to understand each other until now. The learning process never end. I personally love it because every day we have different arguments 🙂 and we grow together to be two strong personality that complement each other.

    Oh from these five years, we need at least three years to convince my parents that it is a sensible choice to do. I mean sensible choice of mine to have relationship with the guy and later to marry him. My parents were not rich but still they found it hard to think to have a son-in-law that talks different or looks different. So please make mental note: that not every parents just find it great to have a bule/expat husband because of money. Some are still concern and worry about the culture difference!

    So the question then…for Peter, how to date Indonesia woman, basically depends on your needs and the other counterpart’s needs. I would say if you want to have serious relationship well then take it the whole package. See whether both of you are compatible when you are talking to each other. See whether you and your date willing to learn from each other differences. See how far you and the other part willing to consider to accept new perspective and vice versa. Well I personally will say don’t jump to bed too fast 😉 It kills the sexpectation hehehe

    For example, our first conversation topic (hehehe not yet a date mind you; it is just an initial conversation of foreigner that doesn’t understand why everybody at Indo should have religion) was about religion!! Haiyaaaa …. what a topic!!!
    At that time we discussed about what I found important in religion and later I listen on his perspective on religion. It is not about the outcome of discussion but during the discussion I have a strong feeling that this person regards me as an equal in intellectual conversation. Further, he really sincere about learning the way Indonesia do and think without judging (I think it is now and then an usual behaviour of every homo sapiens in new country).

    About the date itself. Ohmmmas Pak Khafi mentioned I might be fall to the category whoever at that moment has the money pay 🙂 So then if he paid for the movie I would paid for the pop-corn. I regarded this is as a normal behaviour. When I went out with my Indonesia’s date, so with him I did the same.
    I meant yes he had more money than me at that time but I feel proud of at least able to contribute on our date (hehehe). However once in a while he took me to a seriously expensive place (those five star hotel) then well he paid the bill.
    And later I took him out for Nasi Uduk experience and I took the bill. So in a way it is quite a fair trade (not material but from the culture experience hehehe).

    About gift…I always asked for one but never get one hehehehehe kidding. I wouldn’t know much about getting Jewellry or car or even monthly allowance before being wife (as now we live abroad and currently I’m doing my second degree). I was not custom to be give a gift without an achievement or in special times. So…I think it is normal things to give a gift on birthday or Christmas. Most expensive he gave was Swarovski necklace which then I lost it (hehehe) so he gave up on giving me any Jewellry. Later I got more trip gifts (which I treasured a lot!! Backpacking yeaah)
    Hemmm..as well as we getting serious to each other he paid my ticket to his home country, as there’s a possibility we have to live there when we got married. So it is more like a visit where I was introduced to his parents and family. More important to see whether I think I can live in his country. Otherwise we have to discuss other option and see how these options’s effect on his career and mine.

    So no Peter not every Indonesia women needs to have a car, house or penthouse (hehehe might be I’m just “rare” one?) , some opted for a good trips and a man that able to cook and clean the house hehehe

    Therefore I think it is really important for you to determine what is you are looking for in a woman (not GIRL) in general despite she is from Indonesia or another part of the world. If you are serious to have a real relationship then treat the relationship as a take and give relationship. Personally I think what David did to his GF is good!! You should give her an explanation on why you think it is important for her to be independent. Especially if she has lots of potential. Be gentle but firm. Because once you decided to bring your partner to Europe hehehe it is a tough life without “mbak” housemaid.

    About where that you should look…hemm…I couldn’t say where is the best place. My husband and I met through youth organisation. But some others meet via chatroom. Some meet at bar. But I guess it is not about where you meet but more to how both of you grow in that process of relationship.

    Hope it helps.

  22. avatar Harry says:

    don’t worry peter, as u r a tall and goodlooking guy u will have no problems picking up as many gorgeous and high class indo girls as you like. U can easily pick up 100 each day and even more if u like.

  23. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:

    Harry,

    Get an appointment with a psychotherapist, and get it quickly, you are sounding more and more disturbed every comment you make. This thread is about dating Indonesian girls not about your personal problems, why don’t you take your problems to somebody who can help you instead of just complaining here?

    Seriously Harry you need help!

  24. avatar Peter says:

    PerempuanRantau:

    Thank you very much for your valuable comments!

    By the way, I used the word “girl” most of the time because as I am only 19 years old, I still do not consider myself fully matured yet. Although I am much more mature than most other people my age, I still see that I have much to learn, and I feel that right now I am just beginning a new stage in life and the transition into adulthood (I just started college this year).

    Mohammad Khafi:

    Can you post the links of some good Indonesian online chatrooms?

    Thank you also for your helpful comments!

    Harry:

    You sound very bitter about your romantic situation. It sounds like maybe there are other things missing in your life as well that are not making you happy. I have found that my religion helps me get through very tough and depressing times, and maybe you could benefit from this also.

    I suggest that you read things from different faiths and see which teachings you feel most drawn to. Having a friend beside you who is beyond all the drama of this world is invaluable and can do wonders to help you stay positive and keep up hope.

    Being bitter and putting yourself down is counterproductive! Women want their man to be confident in himself, and when they see you so depressed they will think: if you appear not to care for yourself properly- how will you care for them?

    Don’t overdo it and be arrogant, but you must have confidence in yourself!

    Think of all the good things you have in life, and be thankful for them. There are many people who will never have the things you take for granted.

    Also, one way to help yourself is to help others. Doing (“doing”, not “giving”) charity for people in need is a very upleifting experience that will stay with you forever. Some of my most treasured, inspiring experiences have been the gratitude people expressed to me after I helped them. Service will seem tiring at first, but after it is over you will have opened your heart a little bit more, and you’ll go to sleep with a satisfied smile.

    And service does not always have to be a big, planned project, either. Simply holding doors for people, giving them smiles, and things like that are actually more important than just doing a project and then going back to being cold toward people.

    The more you focus on the needs of others instead of yourself, the more positive you will become, and the more people will be drawn to you.

    Being bitter and putting yourself (and Indonesian women) down is not improving your situation. Stop this nonsense and try something better!

  25. avatar Dewi says:

    I’ve just seen this forum & I interested in it. I have two opinion regarding western man who looking for Indonesia woman. First, if the has just arrived in Indonesia & sonner looking for the woman, it means they only looking for fun (specially sex), but if they already long time & they already learn Indonesia culture usually they have another reason such as love.

    Don’t blame western man if they only want to have fun with the woman, that is a part of their culture & they bring the culture to our country. What we have to do is to protect or keep stand with our culture. Please don’t get influence with western culure.
    For example, if you really want have relationship with western man, just do the same such as you have relationship with Indonesia man.
    If you never/ don’t want to having a sex with Indonesia man before married, you should do the same rule to “bule”. But if you do sex with Indonesian man before married, then you do “it” as well with “Bule”, so don’t blame them want to have fun, trhrow you away after that.

    Will be better if both side (western man & Indonesia woman) understand their position.
    Western man, please respect Indonesia culture/woman. For Indonesia woman, don’t get infulence with new things (western culture), please respect your self then the other people (western man) will respect you too.

  26. avatar PerempuanRantau says:

    Peter:
    Understand now why you use girl 🙂 My excuse then for making it such a bold statement.
    Oh don’t believe Harry’s statement. That kind of statement usually comes from those that think can buy love or relationship with money

    Harry:
    Same like Kahfi and Peter..go get a shrink. Your problem is not your height but perhaps your attitude (have you already check your breathe?)

    Dewi:
    It’s not about blaming the western guy or western female (I mean there’s also relationship happen between Indonesia male and western female). But more to the basic assumption on dating different culture and (sometimes) wrong prejudice. Such as all Indonesia women are easy and golddigger! or all westerner in Indonesia are rich. Or just like your own prejudice that every influence from the Western Man must be a bad influence (always want to have a pre-marital sexual relationship after one date).

    I will simply suggest…Read Kahfi’s idea on dating Indonesia girl to Peter!!! That’s I think the best and not-prejudice advices that I read so far.

  27. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:

    PerempuanRantau,

    I agree with everything you have said. I think like me, you have been exposed to Western Culture and found out for yourself that what we are told about Western Culture is not all true, the same applies to the foreigners who come here, what they have been told about Indonesian Culture is not necessarily all true.

    To be able to understand another culture you either have to have experienced it or have it explained to you by somebody who has impartial and fair views of what it involves.

    Dewi,

    From your comments am I to understand that you have never been to the West? Your views would seem to suggest that, If you are genuinely interested in learning about Western Culture may I suggest that you start to find information on the Internet and maybe visit somewhere like the British Council, if you live in Jakarta that is. You will find that Britain is a good example of interacial and intercommunity harmony, largely so at any rate.

    Having travelled extensively I have found that all cultures have good and bad elements, and have no problems with adding to my Cultural Identity the good elements of whatever culture I have been exposed to.

    I hope that my children will grow up proud of their Indonesian Heritage and Culture, but able to integrate into that the Internation Culture which I have been exposed to.

    Proud to be Indonesian, but citizens of the world, honest, intelligent, tolerant, loving and caring.

    In fact to be totally honest that is what I wish for Indonesia as well, although with the behaviour of our political and religious leaders, our military, police and judiciary and our big businessmen, I fear that those days are still a long way off.

  28. avatar Polar Bear says:

    “I hope that my children will grow up proud of their Indonesian Heritage”

    I hope so too Mohammed.

    A very sensible and reasoned post.

    Everyone should be proud of their culture, of their heritage. They should strive to hold on to it, whilst understanding and accepting other cultures and backgrounds. We are all citizens of the world. We all love our children, we all feel pleasure and pain, we all experience happiness and sadness. We are all human beings.

  29. avatar Tini says:

    Khafi

    please advice me right now me and my husband have realy bad fight ,I just dont understand about way his think every litle think he always complain and make it problem biger and when he angry the way he talk is realy hearting and that make me want to live him but I can do that cause we have kid but if i keep stay I just heart myself more ,and this is not first time fight we been mariage almost 6 year and we have 5 year old child , I try to talk with him but doesnt work and he just geting worst he like to talk back to me .actualy he did mention about money wise he want me to work on the bussines again try to make more money,so every fight he always mention about money wise event that not the reason we fight.he blame me in lot of think event not my mistake. example he forget where he hut his GPS,CD program and he think that I remove it but actualy his the one who forget to put think.
    why his like that i the only person who take care of him more?
    why the way his think is always money?
    whay he dont think that his hearting some one who love and take care of him?
    yes their is some situation with our fainans because we send our chidl to British internation school in phuket thailad (and actualy we live in phuket thailand )and we have to paid more than14,000 us$ every year, and she only in year one , but is not because of that we don’t have money we still have money to spand on daily expanses and holiday expenses and we still can save money in the bank acount but ofcours not a lot as before.
    before we have child i am working too I have my own bussines but I stop cause the baby no one looking after her and I dont thrus maid handling my baby.
    I use to bring money home more than him.manythink is just change he fell that is not balance anymore in the family cause he have to work and I am not .but actualy I just try make new bussines with hotel but i cant just make money in 1 hour it will take time to open bussines name and to market and operate but he dont think like that he think that I taking easy,huuh i feel realy stress because i still love him too and plus we have child .by the way i am indo women and my husband is italian Australian .
    looking forward to your advice thank you

  30. avatar ruud says:

    Hi Tini

    Just taking the liberty to respond on your comment.
    Just wondering if your husband was always like this since you met him.
    If not it seems to me that something is bothering him which left unspoken.
    Eventhough there is never an excuse for bad behaviour, it could explain something.
    My suggestion, wait until the situation cooled down, and than talk about it. Try to figger out what the real problem is and tell him that you want to be a part of the solution instead of the problem.
    Ask him to be honest with you, you deserve that, your relation/marriage deserves that and above all your child

    cheer up

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