Barry Soetoro

Nov 6th, 2008, in IM Posts, Opinion, by

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1,046 Comments on “Barry Soetoro”

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  1. avatar Andy says:
    November 2nd, 2009 at 1:45 am

    Do you really think the USA would elect a Muslim to be President? Chinese perhaps?

    Well oigs, what is the percentage of blacks in America? Last time I checked it was roughly 15 %. Now for the other 85% to vote with their hearts and minds and not on racial lines speaks volumes for their people. Don’t forget, Chinese Indonesians don’t even have the same constitutional rights as pribumis. And they have been in Indonesia longer than the blacks have been in America. The USA has come a very long way in the last 2 – 300 years regarding race relations. Indonesia haven’t even begun and don’t look like doing so anytime soon.

    On an interesting sidenote did anyone watch 60 minutes and see that Indonesian minister squirming in his seat trying to avoid questions relating to the Balibo 5? It was priceless stuff.

  2. avatar timdog says:
    November 12th, 2009 at 5:10 pm

    Andy:

    While timdog you attack the USA and Americans generally (read the aforementioned posts) the fact that the US has elected a black, part Kenyan who was educated in Indonesia for 6 years is proof of their general tolerance and freedom. This freedom has saved countries like yours timdog from your enemies.

    Now i’m waiting for the day Indonesians can elect someone other than a Javanese drone to their highest office. A Chinese or Papuan leader would make things interesting but most likely won’t happen in my lifetime or any others.

    Andy, absolutely, I think it’s marvellous that the USA has elected a “black” president, and it is, perhaps, symptomatic of their increasing maturity – though I have to toss in the somewhat uncomfortable complaint sometimes raised by some: that – whisper it! – he isn’t really all that black… That as the child of a white American and a Kenyan he owns no share in the real heritage of slavery and segregation that many choose as the defining shared experience of black America, and that his “American” part is, essentially, white. This complaint (not mine; I’m just reporting it) is followed up by the claim that America is no closer now from being led by a “real” black man, from a long-served Afro-American background, than it was 20 years ago. But that is definitely a digression…

    And wouldn’t it be wonderful if Indonesia one day elected a non-Muslim, non-Javanese leader? Hell yes, but as Oigal points out it’s unlikely ever to happen in a democracy (even the American example notwithstanding – there’s a huge difference between America where, despite the nutters barking away on this thread, political allegience to one of only two parties probably counts for more with most voters than subtle racism), especially one in a country where national identity is as dubious and as constructed as Indonesia’s (you see, it’s quite legitimate to make criticisms of Indonesia if they’re not tainted by hysteria!)…
    Wouldn’t it be nice if there was democracy in China too, and if a Tibetan or a Uighur was elected as leader there (hahahahahAHA? Wouldn’t it be nice if Israel elected an Israeli Arab (hahahaHA!)? Wouldn’t it be nice if the UK elected a Muslim, a homosexual, someone with a handicap, a black man??? Wouldn’t it be awesome if Australia elected an Aboriginie??? Yes, Andy, it would…

    But here, as usual, you reveal your fundamental derangement. By assuming (because of its partial rejection of your application for sexual refugee status, one presumes – oh, c’mon, let me have a little dig!) that Indonesia is without par the worst country in the world in every respect (which only highlights just how little you know or have seen of the world), you seem to have decided that no criticism of any other country is in any way legitimate.
    This is basically the same logic used in Israel: if you accept that the Holocaust was the worst thing to happen ever to anyone at any point in the history of the world ever – which is, to some extent, what Israel bullyingly demands the world acknowledge – then it is totally unallowed to make even the slightest complaint about any other incident of human suffering, and utterly unacceptable to declare any other episode of mass-killing a genocide… The Turkish massacre of the Armenians? Not as bad as the Holocaust so shut your mouth you anti-Semite! The sufferings of the Palestinians? Don’t be so ridiculous you filthy Nazi…

    Even if the Holocaust is the worst thing ever (best not to get into that here), this logic is absurd. And this appears to be your logic with regards Indonesia and the rest of the world…

    Likewise, the obnoxious “we saved your ass” American line (debatable anyway) in no way delegitimises other criticism (and like the Israeli line, you can’t keep it up forever) and comes down to the same thing…

    Though most of us sniggering European snobs who like to laugh at America understand (being rationale people) that it’s not all bad (it’s a f*ck-sight better than China, for example – China as dominant world power? Shudder…), and that possibly it’s even mostly good (not when it comes to healthcare though – evil barbarians!) it is still rather gratifying in this example – namely the “Obama’s a foreigner and Muslim” line of criticism of his presidency – to find irrefutable evidence that there are a number of American nutters who confirm to our grossly stereotypical image of a deranged, xenophobic, staggeringly ignorant, and almost certainly racist hick. That’s all. Let’s laugh at the nutters!

  3. avatar southoc says:
    November 12th, 2009 at 8:13 pm

    Hey tim”dog” (way to show off your eurapeein’ hipness there….let’s see if I got this…mate!),

    I would like to step outside of the tired rhetoric that the lot of you have let yourself get tied up in here and point out a key fact of this thread; and that is this:

    You are most definitely one of the top five “nutters” on this thread, if not one of the top three. (but not the top two, Timmy-tims, I wouldn’t go that far)

    “Check yo’self before you wreck yo’self” a man named (insert name)dawg once said.

  4. avatar madrotter says:
    November 12th, 2009 at 8:57 pm

    ehrrr that was an ice cube track… and i actually saw tim dog perform live in holland once when he had his hit “fxck compton”, he had two pretty good albums before he fell off…

    ahem…

  5. avatar timdog says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 9:53 am

    southoc:

    a man named (insert name)dawg once said.

    madrotter:

    ehrrr that was an ice cube track

    Ah, they all look the same, don’t they?

    I regard it as a profound honour to be considered a nutter by such a person – thank you!

  6. avatar madrotter says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 6:47 pm

    well here’s a tim dog album:

    http://theessentialelements.blogspot.com/2009/08/tim-dog-do-or-die-1993.html

    i love that super romantic “silly bitch” track!

    and here’s his first album, the most romantic song ever recorded “sexual fantasies” is on this one!!! play this to your darling with some candle-light and you’re all set!!!

    http://1hiphop.blogspot.com/2007/12/1991tim-dog-penicillin-on-wax.html

  7. avatar Odinius says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 11:02 pm

    Oigal said:

    Do you really think the USA would elect a Muslim to be President? Chinese perhaps?

    The Pew issued a survey in the US, where they asked, hypothetically, would you vote for a: Protestant/Catholic/Jewish/Muslim/atheist presidential candidate?

    The first two won by large majorities. The third by a solid majority. The hypothetical Muslim candidate even got a majority, albeit a slim one.

    The atheist? A paltry 16%.

  8. avatar andy says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 2:01 am

    The atheist? A paltry 16%.

    Odinius, that is their eternal shame..See timdog, I will criticise America or anyone where I think it is necessary. However, I usually criticise Indonesia here because this website is specifically about Indonesia hence the name Indonesia Matters. I have a wide range of criticisms about many countries including my own on the appropriate websites.

  9. avatar southoc says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 2:45 am

    Timmy,

    Stop trying to turn it into a race issue. I am black, you brain dead MF! The only true biggot I have seen out here is you.

    Madrotter,

    Props to you for getting my East Coast/West Coast reference. I honestly did not think that anyone out here would pick up on it. I know I was hinting at an Ice Cube track, but it fit well enough to make my point and Dre didn’t really have anything that did.

    Now can you pick up on the REAL rip I am suggesting at with our Tim Dog poser in Afgahnistan? Here is a hint: Where is the REAL Tim Dog currently residing?

    That’s right…West Coast.

    Truth is the biggest loud mouths of protest against any certain location on this planet of ours are the ones who wish they could be there the most. I bet Timmy Tims works himself into a sweat every night throwin’ skeet over his private dreams of laying foot one on our grand nation’s soil.

  10. avatar timdog says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 10:29 am

    but southoc, the entirely apolitical “Obama’s a foreigner” attack on his presidency – as demonstarted by the nutters on this thread – is manifestly largely about race. The genuine political stuff – like “healthcare reform is communism!” – isn’t; it’s just retarded, but that’s by the by…
    I couldn’t give a toss if you’re black or not; that kind of stuff matters nothing to me, but the subject leads me on to a little prop for my friend Andy – Misterrr Andy, one thing that I genuinely do respect you for is that at least you are entirely straight about what you are and what you think – props to you for that at least…

    Now, Misterrr southoc, you seem to have taken issue with my name. Funny that; Barry Prima (where did he go?) once accused me of being a “wigga”. Nothing to do with “European hippness”, buddy, and nothing to do with rap music either – just a much sanitised version of a name of the kind that once upon a time a bunch of scruffy Cornish surfer kids gave each other between finding more stupid stuff to do. Nothing remotely hip about us, self-conciously or otherwise – we were all 49cc mopeds, cider and magic mushrooms for f*cksake…
    And I know nothing and care nothing about rap music – punk rock me, which, as people who care about such stuff have pointed out is “overwhelmingly white and middle class” (though the Bollweevils were one of my very, very many “favourite punk bands ever” – you see, I love America!)…

    As for your pomposity about me “dreaming of setting foot on your nation’s soil”, wierd thing to say, pal. I’m a European citizen; setting foot on American soil ain’t no problem for me; I’ve set foot on American soil already (and by the way, why don’t you step back and read the last paragraph of my post just before you leapt in?).
    As far as I’m conncerned there’s nothing better to be in the world than a citizen of the European Union (though I wouldn’t really mind which individual country), but I’d certainly prefer to be a citizen of the USA than, say, a citizen of China or indeed heaps of other countries, almost certainly including Indonesia. But daft crowing about “you wish you was American, man” just makes you look like, well, a nutter… And I don’t anyway, not because I “hate America” but because I already have a passport which I think confers more benefits…

    Andy:

    See timdog, I will criticise America or anyone where I think it is necessary

    But Andy, it’s just that so often – as on this thread, or as when an Indonesian (or pretend Indonesian) criticises the lot of Aboriginies or something, you leap up shrieking – “you can’t say that! Indonesia’s worse so any non-related critcism of another place is illegitimate!” which, as I went through above, is not a legitimate line. And when you say things like “Indonesia, one of the poorest, least developed countries in the world” you do, as I’m sorry to keep repeating, only highlight how little you’ve seen or know…

  11. avatar madrotter says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 1:32 pm

    like the bad brains too tim?

  12. avatar timdog says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 5:07 pm

    actually not all that much, madrotter, not really sure why – maybe I’m racist or something. I know they were “important” and all that, but I’ve always thought that feeling compelled to like a band because they were “important” is silly – in punk it’s beyond silly… But I suppose in terms of black people “important” in punk Don Letts should get a mention, but as a lover of America my leanings have always been mostly to punk from the other side of the pond.

  13. avatar Oigal says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 5:16 pm

    Don’t feel so bad Tim Dog…apparently according to at least one of the nutters, I am Saudi now which comes as a complete surprise to those close to me. Although to be fair, along with the “Patricks”, they serve a very valuable purpose on this site as it all too easy to think the madcap, loony Imams are the only ones with a firm grip on ignorant, oppressive rants n raves.

    Although they do give conservatives a bad name..

  14. avatar madrotter says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 5:24 pm

    hey, that’s ok tim dog, i still love that first skrewdriver album, just mentioning them can raise a lot of peoples hairs… never was much into the brains myself i liked their buddies from blag flag a lot more… donn letts is a very interesting fellow indeedy

  15. avatar timdog says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 6:05 pm

    Oigal:

    I am very pleased for you on being outed as a Saudi – I’ve never managed anything better than a Muslim, a Pakistani, a homosexual or an Indonesian (not all at the same time mind, you – that would have been an accusation to be proud of!)

    Although they do give conservatives a bad name..

    Don’t worry at all about that – we’ve more than a few equivalents on this side too, as I’m sure you know…

    madrotter – oh Black Flag absolutely, love ‘em, though Rollins is a d*ckhead…

  16. avatar Odinius says:
    November 14th, 2009 at 10:30 pm

    Oigal said:

    Although to be fair, along with the “Patricks”, they serve a very valuable purpose on this site as it all too easy to think the madcap, loony Imams are the only ones with a firm grip on ignorant, oppressive rants n raves.

    In a lot of ways, the US and Indonesia are quite similar, from a sociological perspective. Seems odd to say it, but it’s true. The nutters are really fairly similar, only the US ones are constrained by stable political and social institutions, which Indonesia lacks.

  17. avatar Patrick says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 2:15 am

    The fatal flaw of Indonesia Matters is that one person, through a host of characters, attempts to control all thought and legitimate expressions of free thought on this site. And if that person cannot successfully repel rivals through sound academic arguments then they, through many characters, turns IM into a mud slinging free-for-all. If that route proves unsuccessful then there is always the reliable censoring of free thought and thus effectively barring that person from posting, even if they do not use any obcenities, or engage in personal insults. SHAME!!!!

  18. avatar andy says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 2:25 am

    And when you say things like “Indonesia, one of the poorest, least developed countries in the world” you do, as I’m sorry to keep repeating, only highlight how little you’ve seen or know…

    My god timdog, you seem to be collecting every quote I ever made on this forum. You don’t by chance happen to have a man crush on me do you? Some of my posts may be emotive yes and I doubt i’ve been to as many countries as you have. Have you ever had a real job in your life? I’ve had holidays in several but only lived in Indonesia and Australia. Why am I critical of Indonesia? Well my friend this may surprise you but it is due to my destiny my second home. My wife is from there and my son born there so a part of me is there if you like. I am very critical of my own country too at times but the nonsense you have said about us is plain wrong and needs correcting. If I have any complaints about my own I post on other forums like our daly newspapers etc. You can find me there with a quick search. I chose this forum to discuss Indonesian matters because lo and behold this is an Indonesian forum. My comment which you mentioned, Indonesia is not THE poorest but it fares pretty badly in Asia, all of the west, most of South America but fares well against Africa. Their human rights record is particularly poor but if someone listened to you they would imagine Australia and the US was worse. Absolute nonsense. If you don’t believe me look up the facts. Indonesia’s human development ranking is low and corruption continues to plague it. I truly hope for the sake of my friends and family in Indonesia things improve and it becomes a pace setter in Asia. It would benefit me too. If things do significantly improve then I might even invest some of my hard earned capital there.

  19. avatar Odinius says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 2:35 am

    The fatal flaw of Indonesia Matters is that one person, through a host of characters, attempts to control all thought and legitimate expressions of free thought on this site. And if that person cannot successfully repel rivals through sound academic arguments then they, through many characters, turns IM into a mud slinging free-for-all. If that route proves unsuccessful then there is always the reliable censoring of free thought and thus effectively barring that person from posting, even if they do not use any obcenities, or engage in personal insults. SHAME!!!!

    Sir, please step away from the conspiracy generator! It has not yet been safety tested.

    (Seriously, mas, what on earth are you on about?)

  20. avatar David says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 5:27 am

    Ugh, Patrick, here you go again….

  21. avatar Rob Baiton says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 7:56 am

    @ Patrick…

    Are you one of those characters?

  22. avatar timdog says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 11:09 am

    Oh my god, Patung! All these people are really you? The idea had never occured to me… Is Ross actually you? Andy??? Achmad??? Mr Patung, please come clean – am I you too?

    Andy:

    Have you ever had a real job in your life?

    It would probably surprise some people here to know that as well as dabbling in several other things I also have a proper, time-served, filthy-dirty-practical trade (in the very real sense) – one that because of its nature, and because of my mercinary nature (and pretty immaculate CV in the trade in question) I’ve always been able to drop in and out of for six months at a time, before going off to the nether regions of the earth to spend all the money I earnt. I’m done with it for good now though, I hope…

    but it [Indonesia] fares pretty badly in Asia

    But that’s just it, Andy – it doesn’t. On basic development indicators like life expectancy, child mortality and literacy Indonesia actually does reasonably well – and all the more so when you consider its history and geographical nature. No one would put it on a par with Singapore or Japan, obviously, but it compares very favourably to somewhere that people are always crowing about as a totem of rising Asia – India. Indonesia has literacy levels edging towards 100%; India’s are not far above 50%, and are virtually 0 in vast rural swathes of the country (Indonesia also has basically none of India’s monstrous male-female disparity). Life expectancy and infant mortality throughout the Subcontinent are also waaaay worse than Indonesia’s.
    Even within ASEAN Indonesia towers over Laos, Cambodia and Myanmar, and is very much on a par with the other big “mid-rankers” Thailand and Vietnam (which again have fewer challenges from size, geography or scale). It has respectable ecconomic growth indicators too – even at the moment – and is also currently politically stable and has – think about it – probably the best democratic credentials in all of ASEAN.

    Now that might all sound like an unrerved pro-Indo rant; it’s not; it just highlights that when you say stuff like that what you are saying is based on basically nothing whatsoever besides the fact that Indonesia doesn’t look – to you – quite as good as suburban Melbourne…
    Same applies on human rights, corruption etc. Now I would have thought it would be pretty obvious that I’m the kind of person with serious concerns about human rights – in Indonesia as much as anywhere, and things are certainly far from perfect in the archipelago. But you could sadly probably count the places in Asia that are better on once hand.
    None of that means for a moment that we shouldn’t be levelling vigorous criticism at Indonesia; it’s not that Indonesia is “good”; it’s just that you are crippled by a laughably narrow perspective and a transparently obvious personal issue with the place…

    Now, back to Barack Obama – Patung, these nutters, I think I get it now – they’re all you too, right?

  23. avatar David says:
    November 15th, 2009 at 6:22 pm

    Yes well the thing about me creating all these characters, I mean I must be one interesting person to have all the knowledge and experiences that people have here, or have one hell of an imagination. But…whenever the conversation goes in the direction of approval for atheism, or possible approval of it, or even neutrality towards it, the screw that is loose in Patrick’s head goes POP! And out that screw comes. Oigal’s jibing doesn’t help matters either. But, trying to be fair, we may all have a looseish screw there, and it just takes different things to pop it. Testing to see whether Patrick has two now….I have been accused of creating the Achmad character, which isn’t true, but there was one I did create – ‘Marisa Duma’ – so all those lovey-duvey emails you sent her Patrick…..

  24. avatar madrotter says:
    November 16th, 2009 at 1:41 am

    ouch!!!:)

  25. avatar Oigal says:
    November 16th, 2009 at 8:36 am

    Oigal’s jibing doesn’t help matters either.

    Awww…Now if I am boring youse guys, happy to desist..(No Patrick you vote doesn’t count)

    Besides…If am Patung then none of this is my fault..I am shall we say possessed..

  26. avatar bittbear says:
    December 21st, 2009 at 6:17 am

    obama sworn with his hand on christian bible…..
    it is not against muslim creed to say you are a christian of any other faith if you are engaging in producing a stronger muslim state. unlike christians who know the can not denounce their faith, under any circumstances…so far as unto death. Tell me why he has quoted what the koran says about this and athe “holy koran says”–(several occasions.) Christian would not every quote it this way, especially as the holy. He is a liar, and a fraud. Everything he says is actually opposite. so much that representatives cant help blurting out “liar” cause he says change, but the only change he wants is for American to quit being America. Oh he loves America, just one he has in his dreams, and my nighmares. This is why you want only natural americans citizens for president, to keep them from bringing America down. OUr founding fathers knew that this was the worst scenario, electing a president that cares less for preserving American, than he does to furthering his own career as world leader, ect. Bad news ahead for Americans if we continue to follow such corrupting dreams of how American should be, or could be. Let us stand for America instead of any other countries’ ways. Unfortunately there is no more land to run to for America, as was previously done and fought for many years ago. This is not the rest of the worlds land, it is ours, with our constituion and our dead soldiers who gave all for this Nation which is still a republic nation under god . Being your own god is not the solution. Study and serve, hopefully both god and country, but at least choose one of em, and quit trying to make this country like the other losers out there!!!!

    sighjay…..ok you say so what he won. I say you think we are democracy. that is wrong. we are still a Republic under constitution, that is under God. That is why they gave us the Pledge of Allegiance so we would remember. Instead of voting on your feelings, vote the constitution and stand up for that republic. All people with your attitude should find another country with your feel good laws, and there are many others to choose from. I know you wont, cause you like our milk and honey but refuse to stand and support what makes us so different and stronger than other nations. Study your constitution (if you can find one since your kind has helped make that very difficult, to keep people sensless) The constitution of The United States was drafted by men of Knowing!!! They had seen all these various Unions in other countries and knew what to draft up to keep the infiltration of the world. IF you break your arm should you deal with it casue it happened or try to fix it~ don’t be so blind!

  27. avatar EddieJ128 says:
    February 6th, 2010 at 2:17 am

    Barry is a liar and a fraud! He is not a U.S. citizen and he will be exposed for the fake that he is. I pray this will happen before he does any further damage to this great country.

  28. avatar Michelle says:
    February 23rd, 2010 at 1:48 am

    Well his mother seems like a true air head. A completely lost and baseless person. Really to meet his first father in a Russian language class in 1960 says it all. What American went out of their way to learn Russian in 1960 but a lost commie lover. Hopelessly lost in the delusion of a perfect communist society. Much has yet to be unlocked from this rather weird family… and it seems Obama is every bit the airhead his mother was.

  29. avatar Arthur says:
    March 8th, 2010 at 3:38 am

    Barack Obama is illegally, President. All laws signed by him are void. Major crisis follows!

  30. avatar Oigal says:
    March 8th, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Oh joy, the Birthers are back to provide us with a laugh…

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