74 Comments on “Best Rated Universities”
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Adrian Vickers Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 8:46 pmOK, I’ll confess I have a vested interest here (and please read the list closely, my University, Sydney, is there, even passed Melbourne this time), but of course these lists are pretty meaningless, and yes, those of us who speak English benefit (even in the lists put out by Jiao Tong University in Shanghai, it’s still the English-language universities that do well).
The main equation is that the more money you put into the system, the higher you are on the lists, so US universities have lots of philanthropy plus government funding, they are the richest so they are at the top. Australia does well because we also put a lot of money into universities, mainly from the government and your student fees (not so much philanthropy, so thanks). Indonesia doesn’t pay its academic staff very well so they have to do two or three jobs (which is why they are never there to give the lectures they are supposed to), they can’t afford to do research, and the libraries do not have many books (or when they do get books the books quickly disappear).
If the Indonesian govenment followed its constitution and put 20% of the national budget into education (sorry Purba, that means taking money away from the military), then UI, UGM and the other institutions would quickly rise–they have lots of talented researchers and teachers (despite the system, not because of it). How about the Indonesian rich also donating some of their wealth to the university system, then you could have an Indonesian Stanford or Cornell?
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timdog Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 10:00 pmNice to have you around Mr Vickers… You’re that rare beast amongst academic historians - one who can actually write. In that respect I admire you very much. I also think you may prove an excellent adversary for our beloved Purba Negoro…
A flaw in this list - besides the previously mentioned bias towards English-speaking institutions - is that it is attempting to focus on the “best” universities. The “best” are only a tiny fraction of a much larger sector, and they may well have very little relevance to the standards of the rest of higher education in a given country.
Oxford and Cambridge, for example, offer absolutely no reflection whatsoever on the rest of the scene in Britain (which, arguably, has some far more vibrant educational institutions that the Big Two, and which unquestionably also has some dreadful tin-pot universities too)…
I’m not arguing for moment that once you step a rung down the ladder from the ITBs and so on you’ll find a world of mid-range quality in Indonesia’s lesser universities - far from it; I’m just saying that this list isn’t a reflection on quality across the board…
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raden Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 10:30 pmIf the Indonesian govenment followed its constitution and put 20% of the national budget into education
This is almost impossible things in the largest muslim country like Indonesia, muslim like to pray not study and have complex syairah rules to remember & to comply daily. We better sit down be quiet and do not protest so much, education is never be Indonesia’s top priority, we even ignore the Porong mud disaster victims which are more urgent than univ education. Next to it, we still have plenty of public hospitals which are under budget & primitive medicals facility, etc etc …
In Indonesia, the most important matter is ‘dana pemilu / kampanye’ , nha itu enak !
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Enigmatic Says:
October 17th, 2008 at 12:09 amTheWrathOfGrapes Says:
October 15th, 2008 at 10:18 pm
Especially Cambridge and Oxford. It’s 1 yr shorter so I get to work more soon. Oh well.Enigmatic - try to go up to Cambridge - you will love it there…
Well that’s provided I can even get in there… not with my current exam results though. Fortunately the A Levels are in Nov 2009.
Andy Says:October 16th, 2008 at 11:48 am
Well there you have it. The people of this forum have a clear choice. They can believe the rankings of the Times Higher Education and QS World University Ranking or the rantings of our good mate Purba. I’m with the former. He says UI is better than Monash. I don’t know as I only downloaded the top 100 which no Indonesian university made. I found Melbourne uni amongst that list plus National uni in Canberra. But that is not the point. Again, for those who either can’t read or choose to disect my blogs line for line while not addressing my main point Indonesian unis lack something or they would be in higher up the list. I don’t wish to have a go at them but wouldn’t Indonesians rather spend their government budgets trying to keep the rich from studying overseas? Makes economic sense to me. Spin and BS only gets people so far.I’ll go with the former. Unless of course, we’re talking about Indonesian Language as a university subject.
sputjam Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 11:37 am
Maybe it makes more sense to hire the best lecturers and researchers into Indonesia, and make the students pay say 50% of what it would cost to study overseas, then to drain the country of its vital cash, by sending students abroad.
That way, the best creative and young talent gets to implement their know how locally, subject to the govenrment department accepting their new ideas.Where’s the money gonna come from? Also he foreign universities are all long established in terms of their history and academic standards. Hence it’s harder to persuade the students to pay less to study here than to pay full fees to study abroad.
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PrimaryDrive Says:
October 17th, 2008 at 6:24 pmYou all should give more credits to our (Indonesian) lecturers. They do what they can with their tragically underrated salary. They work their butts off so that other people know a bit of finance maths, or programming, or whatever. These people latter enjoy good life while our lecturers still toil with their pretty basic life.
We can: spend less money for fancy cars, and instead redirecting the money for paying the lecturers decently. We can damn well deliver the quality of NUS.
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hary Says:
October 18th, 2008 at 7:25 pmThe fundamental problem is the inability of universities here to attract good faculty. If we paid well [like Singapore] or offered a lifestyle [ like Sydney], we will attract international class lecturers, tutors and researchers. Published papers in English would be read, and our Universities would be placed on the map of academia. Instead, the private Unis are too worried about the bottom line and public unis too caught up in the politicking and votes for who gets to be the big dog on campus this year. We should not gripe about our dismal position if we are not willing to pay our lecturers even USD 1000 per month!!! Get real.
If students here are offered more rigorous curricular and better lectures, many may be persuaded not to go overseas, even if they could afford it.
Personally, I was shocked that some examinations at Uni level still had multiple choice questions. Bizzare, but true. -
Marisa Says:
October 18th, 2008 at 10:51 pmHighly recommended:
Ateneo de Manila University, Philippines - 254th
Hasn’t been as flashy as NUS or Monash, but predictably it’s going to be one of the rising stars in Asia-Pacific academic league. From what I’ve heard, numbers of Indonesian students studying there are inclining. Seems like Ateneo de Manila is aiming for the local market that originally targets American/European universities, but also economically affordable higher education. But don’t take it from me, this is just a personal opinion. Met several Ateneo de Manila interns over at ASEAN some time ago, they show a quite objective balance between West politics and global Asia-Pacific involvements in their approach and analysis which I’ve took noticed of.
@ Rob
Interesting that Universitas Pelita Harapan was not assessed.
If the Globe Asia survey of early this year is to be believed then UPH is the second best university in Indonesia. If this is true then it would be ranked above ITB and UGM.
Rob, if we’re going to mention private universities then I’m not going to point out UPH if I were you. Bina Nusantara would be the best option out there, especially in technology field. Atmajaya falls second, for just about everything.
(Atmajaya’s Psychology once-a-student here. Voluntarily resigned before I got myself dropped out, then packed my bags to Yogya.)
@ sputjam
Maybe it makes more sense to hire the best lecturers and researchers into Indonesia, and make the students pay say 50% of what it would cost to study overseas, then to drain the country of its vital cash, by sending students abroad.
Sounds like double-degree programs. There’s a double-degree program over at UI Salemba, but I forgot what overseas universities they cooperate with.
@ Adrian Vickers
If the Indonesian govenment followed its constitution and put 20% of the national budget into education (sorry Purba, that means taking money away from the military), then UI, UGM and the other institutions would quickly rise–they have lots of talented researchers and teachers (despite the system, not because of it). How about the Indonesian rich also donating some of their wealth to the university system, then you could have an Indonesian Stanford or Cornell?
Agreed. Your suggestion reminds me of how South Korea established its policy on education, if I’m not mistaken, they put around 40% of their budget. But how about not only 20% of the budget, the Indonesian government also put 100% more of their dedication into making a better nation out of this country? And of its scholars?
Perhaps we should remind ourselves that most corruptors in this country are graduated from state universities, so what’s missing from their education?@ topic
Anyways some say, UI is now becoming more privatized? UI’s tuition is getting more expensive for sure, this might be every UI student’s major complaint, knowing that UI/ITB/UGM/alike has always been a stepping ground for students from rural areas which expect more stable and affordable tuition. ITB is getting either more Islamic or nationalistic, considering that Middle Eastern corporates are now targeting for their alumnis, just in a way Germany and the Netherlands have always welcomed ITB alumnis with open arms for decades long. They’re also willing to offer outlandishly high salaries, even higher than ones offered in Indonesia or in Western countries.
True though that graduating from prestigious universities would get you more profitable career options, but that depends on what type of industry one refers to. Industries that expects more skills, creativity, and are capitalizing more on right-brain power generally have more complex set of requirements. The ideal candidate employee is one that indicates the capability to pursuit both practical, intellectual goals also dynamic, visionary thinking, to be invested in the corporate establishment — I hope.
Just a note to inflate the ego:
My family is fanatically a universitas negeri-minded kind. All members of my family, except me, are graduated from state universities, and so are most of the members in my extended family. Bachelor to Master to Doctoral. Yep, with the We-Are-The-Yellow-Jackets stickers and all. Just figured that I should spoil the tradition by graduating from a mediocre one, mweheh..And still be considered as dedicated learner, that is. Has been a challenge of its own.
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Patrick Says:
October 19th, 2008 at 5:55 am@ PN Just wanted to mention “Little “Ireland” again trounces “Big Indonesia” by placing 3 schools ahead of Indonesia best ranking. In fact the Irish had 7 schools in the top 500 and we could say they would be in the top 400 as well! Good year for the Irish producing more medals than the Indonesians in the Olympics and out classing Indonesia in the top 500 school rankings! All this from a country with a population little more than 4 million. Tsk! Tsk! Tsk!
And let’s not forget to mention those silly, undereducated, stupid Americans! The USA with 14 schools in the top 25. It’s remarkable achievement for such a barbaric country.
Little side note - I know of one Indonesian woman who was (is) a professor at Washington University of St. Louis (somewhere in the top 60 or so if I recall) so it certainly not that Indonesia cannot produce world class professors, but more likely they cannot keep them. Poor pay and entitlements equals to mass exodus to better futures in other countries. I am sure there are possibly hundreds if not thousands of academically qualified Indonesian professors just like her. Andy has made his point well about this so don’t begrudge him the respect he is due on this matter from you! In fact, if you well heeled Javanese politicians, businessmen and military elite (good patriots you brag that you are!) followed the constitution of your country instead of lining your own pockets, you would have had by now several universities in the top 200 at the very least. Cheers!
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Rob Says:
October 19th, 2008 at 6:59 pmMarisa…
The reason I point UPH out is that the Globe Asia survey ranks it higher than Bina Nusantara and higher than Atma Jaya by considerable margins in just about all categories. Have you read the survey?
Or is it that you are telling me as an Indonesian who obviously knows more about Indonesian universities and Indonesian education than this here foreigner as evidenced in the following
Rob, if we’re going to mention private universities then I’m not going to point out UPH if I were you.
I am not offended by the way. The logic of your arguments is the logic that I use when people ask me what unis they should study at in Australia. My first response is, “depends on what you want to stydy and whether you have a preferred specialization”.
However, that said my point referred specifically to the Globe Asia survey and to the fact that UPH is second to UI on just about all counts and in front on some like facilities and staff, if I recall correctly. I wrote about it in my blog. Some self promotion
The relationship between corruption and education is interesting as there a few overseas educated Indonesians that have been pinged for corruption. So, perhaps if the logic is true there is also something missing in foreign education too. Indonesia will never eradicate corruption. No country has. The idea needs to be preventing it and keeping it an absolute minimum. For example, Hong Kong, even after 30+ years of ICAC there is still some corruption. Corruption happens because people think they can outsmart the law. Education might play a minor role, but the issue is really one of right and wrong. Education therefore might illuminate what is legally right and wrong but then the person is ultimately responsible for their own actions.
Adrian…
Vested interest or not, the points made are valid. Lecturer salaries are pitiful and to make ends meet most lecturers are working additional jobs. I know this for a fact and know lecturers that burn off their classes to do private consulting work.
The access to books and libraries is also a good point. My personal library is as extensive and in some instances more extensive than some law schools here. I often find myself inundated with email requests to borrow books (if I have them). Some unis are subscribers to online materials. However, these are in the minority.
On the 20% to the education budget. depends on how much of this 20% the government allows to get burned up in administrative costs.
All…
It seems that the thread is moving to bragging rights with “who has the most institutions in the list and where they are in the list”.
I have had associations with a couple of law firms here (they will remain anonymous) where just about all (if not all) associates were graduates of a particular university. So, I guess ranking and the status that brings is important on graduation.
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October 19th, 2008 at 8:58 pmRob. Haven’t read the survey myself, I actually thought you were pointing it out for your children’s future education or something. If that’s the case, I’d recommend Bina Nusantara or Atmajaya, even though, according to the Globe Asia survey, UPH ranks higher than those two now. Things have indeed changed. In my days, it has always been either Bina Nusantara, Atmajaya, or Trisakti. Grats to UPH!
Pardon my impoliteness if this would also sound like I’m being an Indonesian who obviously knows more about Indonesian universities and Indonesian education, but is it true that Globe Asia is owned by the same person that owns UPH, James T. Riady? Both established under the wings of Lippo Group?
Anyways,
Education might play a minor role, but the issue is really one of right and wrong. Education therefore might illuminate what is legally right and wrong but then the person is ultimately responsible for their own actions.
If you’re the type of foreigner that assumes one’s education might play a minor role in one’s future action, then yes, there’s no way you could help us eradicate corruption in Indonesia. Because, by that notion, you’re basically saying that education is an insignificant factor in building the pupils’ character, integrity and civic responsibilities. Hey, what’s the point, you go to school, you get a degree, then you’re out of here, something like that perhaps.
I do agree to what you’ve said: The idea needs to be preventing it and keeping it an absolute minimum. True, but as a professional in an academic institution yourself, why would you (give the assumption that you) doubt education as one of the most effective methods in preventing corruption, or at least the permissive culture that allows it, from the bottom-up also for long-term results? Don’t you think that there is a relevancy between the mindset indoctrinated in state universities and the kind of mindset applied in government establishments? If any?
As an example, Paramadina University has Anti-Corruption compulsory class and research tasks for its students. Why would they take such approach, if education merely illuminates the right and wrong, and not exactly intending to educate such civic responsibility? And why would on year 1998 thousands of university students march together and demonstrate against New Order regime, some even wiling to die for it? If, yet again, education itself might play a minor role.
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October 19th, 2008 at 10:02 pmtimdog,
Nice to have you around Mr Vickers… You’re that rare beast amongst academic historians - one who can actually write.
That’s Adrian Vickers, the writer? The person himself? Not a pseudonym?
Oh crap.
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October 19th, 2008 at 11:38 pmMarisa…
The point is not who owns Globe Asia and who established UPH. I make the point in my analysis of both the survey and the conflict of interest in the posts on my blog about this. The obvious conflict of interest aside, if UPH ranks so highly it is interesting that it was not considered. That was my only point.
In terms of civics. For education to play a significant role in the understanding of corruption then this must start way before university. Perhaps “civics” needs to start in primary school and run through junior and senior high school and through university as well.
What I enjoy most about reading your posts is how patronizing you are about people in general and particularly with people you know nothing about. But, to each their own! As Uncle Ned use to say, “such is life!”
Nah, I think the ideas as the relate to character and integrity are your words not mine. But feel free to twist my words and add to them as you like. It is after all a free and open forum. I think though that I said education would play a minor role in eradicating corruption and particularly so if the civics education to which you refer starts at the university level.
Paramadina’s efforts are to be commended. Nevertheless, some subjects you take and you go through the motions get your grade and then it is done. I recall that to graduate from the University of Wollongong that you had to be computer literate. This required that you do a computer subject. I learned all this stuff but purely by going through the motions and doing the assignments. The cold hard reality was if I wanted to graduate I had to do it. Similarly, if students at Paramadina have to do an anti-corruption course to graduate they will. The fact that it is compulsory does not guarantee that the graduates will be any less corrupt than they might have been. They might be more aware but if they are prone to be sticking their hand in the cookie jar then they will.
My point was a cultural shift required in the fight against corruption is going to require much more than just education. If you agree or disagree is up to you. But I guess, I am not the type of foreigner that is going to provide any assistance on this front. You pegged me in one. Congratulations. It does seem though that the one making assumptions here is you.
I am not sure that 1998 fits into the argument but nonetheless those willing to fight against the establishment are still dying for their commitment to the cause. Did you march in 1998?
Yes, Marisa, that is Adrian Vickers, the professor. Currently, at Sydney Uni if I am not mistaken. Another assumption on your part, I presume!
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October 20th, 2008 at 12:31 amWhat I enjoy most about reading your posts is how patronizing you are about people in general and particularly with people you know nothing about.
Patronizing? Who are these people you’re referring to exactly, Rob?
Educated people?Uhm, nevermind. This is my country anyways, not yours.
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Lairedion Says:
October 20th, 2008 at 12:49 amMarisa said:
Patronizing? Who are these people you’re referring to exactly, Rob?
Educated people?That can be no other than me, a real intellectual (as confirmed by others here on IM) with no college or uni education at all. Or am I just assuming this?
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October 20th, 2008 at 12:55 amMarisa…
Oh, schucks, gee, bugger me. I would have expected better from you but then again, when the going gets tough the tough revert to childish temper tantrums like this:
Uhm, nevermind. This is my country anyways, not yours.
Your country how? Do you own it or have some greater vested interest than me? Oh that’s right I am a foreigner and you already know everything there is to know about me because you are Marisa from Indonesia.
Oh well, I will be sure to tell my Indonesian son that Daddy cannot say anything about Indonesia or have an opinion or a view about Indonesia because Marisa said so!
Hope you enjoyed your weekend.
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October 20th, 2008 at 12:59 amLairedion…
Not sure that Marisa can say this to you, can she?
Uhm, nevermind. This is my country anyways, not yours.
So, I am guessing it will have to be back to the intellectual stuff
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October 20th, 2008 at 1:29 am@ Marisa - It’s a very nice thing that at least some students are being exposed to anti-corruption classes or what we in the West would call ethics classes. Rob is absolutely correct to question the value of compulsory anti-corruption courses at the University level when they been exposed directly or indirectly for their entire lives. Proper ethics starts in the home and is supported by the community (primary schools) at large and of course one would hope that religious leaders would make that a priority.
The problem in Indonesia is that wages are too low and so it allows corruption to become the expected method used to live a lifestyle that one seems fitting to their level of education and current position. The higher the decision maker the higher the amount expected to get the business. This is what Indonesia is really up against in its fight against corruption and until wages rise enough, in my opinion, its an impossible mission!
@ Rob - After 15 years in Indonesia you still get no respect or feeling of being truly welcomed, do you? That is just wrong!
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October 20th, 2008 at 1:34 amYour country how? Do you own it or have some greater vested interest than me?
..speechless. Utterly speechless.
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October 20th, 2008 at 1:43 amPatrick…
Mate. it is not really about the respect. To each their own. It is more about the assumptions and the stereotypes and the generalizations. I understand the value of stereotypes and generalizations however if your argument is sum total stereotypes and generalizations and you then get called on those, I would have expected a little more than,
Uhm, nevermind. This is my country anyways, not yours.
but sometimes we hope for and expect too much.
I still think my points are valid re education in Indonesia and corruption. The points I have made about the ranking system are also valid. This seems to be the way in IM, when you get called on your arguments you revert to insults, or become patronizing, or suggest that as a foreigner your opinion is not valid because you are a foreigner.
Once again, such is life! I am sure I will recover after the shellacking I have suffered at the hands of Marisa.
Marisa…
Speechless, I am not surprised!
It is almost time for the traditional parting shot and then a statement suggesting you have nothing further to say on the matter.
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October 20th, 2008 at 2:05 amHey, mister!
1. Who asked you to comment on my statements regarding corruption in the first place anyways? No one. It’s okay, but..
2. Who mentioned the term foreigner first? You. You referred YOURSELF as one.
3. Who are you referring to by this statement?What I enjoy most about reading your posts is how patronizing you are about people in general and particularly with people you know nothing about.
Chances are you’re referring to educated people because you stated it after:
In terms of civics. For education to play a significant role in the understanding of corruption then this must start way before university. Perhaps “civics” needs to start in primary school and run through junior and senior high school and through university as well.
Well then, my being an Indonesian perhaps doesn’t fully justify my right to voice an opinion on my own country, for the reason that you assume I don’t know anything about educated people — perhaps, such as you are,
Knowing so, then I’m going to say it one more time, and thousands times more.
This is my country, not yours.And until the death, sir. Until the bloody death of me, this is my country.
15 years? Try hundreds of centuries first. Study the f*cking Sumatra while you’re at it. -
October 20th, 2008 at 2:08 amStill can’t believe he just asked how this is my country. Oh my God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is so sickening, I’m out of this site.
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October 20th, 2008 at 2:26 amRob said:
It is almost time for the traditional parting shot and then a statement suggesting you have nothing further to say on the matter.
Exactly as you said but with a rather big bang.
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October 20th, 2008 at 2:27 amOh, and I believe it’s you that’s having childish tantrum, Rob:
Oh well, I will be sure to tell my Indonesian son that Daddy cannot say anything about Indonesia or have an opinion or a view about Indonesia because Marisa said so!
Better call home. Your mother, your father, your own ancestors.
Tell them that you’ve betrayed them. -
Ally Says:
October 20th, 2008 at 2:56 amOh my……. :))
Talking about university…
Based on stories I’ve heard and my own experience, students at universities in the Netherlands are not even innocent. Some of them use stuffs from books or internet for their school work and claim it as their own work. I was surprised at first… but… ah ya… bakat maling ada di mana2… meskipun pendidikan kelas tinggi tetep aja jadi maling… -
Andy Says:
October 20th, 2008 at 2:57 amRob and I may not always agree but Marisa cmon, yes you can voice an opinion about your country as much as you like but so can those who were not born there okay. We live in this much bigger place called the WORLD and travel frequently between many different borders so can’t help but make comments about the places we see.
You and others who discourage foreigners from making critical opinions do your country harm not good so please let Rob and others here have their say without resoting to childish ‘its my country not yours’ comments.
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October 20th, 2008 at 3:25 am@ Marisa - After your last comments to Rob I had to go back and read Genesis and nope just could not find anywhere where God said to “Go forth and multiply only with your own countrymen or race etc.,”. Doesn’t recent DNA studies show that we humans are more closely related to each other than we dared imagined. The newspapers here even said that Barrack Obama and Brad Pitt were related. How weird is that? Anyway, you on your blog call for “..world peace, like totally”. Seems to me seeing each other as fellow human beings is a step in that direction because when we start excluding based or race, nationality, creed or whatever…then all the trouble starts!
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October 20th, 2008 at 3:45 am@ Lairedion and Andy
Ha. Yes, thanks for brightening up our days again.
Never did say he shouldn’t voice an opinion on this country, but what’s with the deal of saying that I patronize people and not knowing anything about educated people all of the sudden? Then questioning on how this country is mine?Traditional parting shot? Oh hell no, this is serious stuff. This isn’t just a typical Indonesia Matters kind of argument. Given the chance, I’d sue this guy. Then again, plenty of Indonesians out there would be willing to hear how a Western or whatever they call it these days would arrogantly question a native’s nationality, just because a local is trying to voice an opinion on corruption — just about everyone’s major issue.
Read more articles on the subject.
Here.
Here.
Here.
Tons of it.And I wonder why a certain UPH’s staff would be stating publicly that:
Nah, I think the ideas as the relate to character and integrity are your words not mine.
.. which implies that the idea of (UPH) higher education has nothing to do with educating such human values. This is a bit ironic because I learned those terms also from James T. Riady himself during an educational seminar, aside from my own references.
Too late, Lairedion and Andy. This is serious matter.
I’m writing a formal letter to UPH. -
October 20th, 2008 at 3:48 amAnd Patrick too. Sorry.
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October 20th, 2008 at 4:47 amMarisa…
I think you need to go back and read my comments. The comments on civics and patronizing are in different paragraphs. Simply, I am not saying that you are patronizing educated people. Once again, those are your interpretations.
Marisa, IM is a public forum where people voice their opinions. If you do not want people to comment on what you write or call you on your arguments, then do not put them into a public forum. Once they are here then anyone who wishes to comment may do so. You, yourself regularly comment on the opinions of others and in a lot of instances in particularly negative ways. Seems like a case of being able to give but not take.
I am making no assumptions about what or who you know. Once again, the patronizing comment relates to your conduct and does not presuppose that you patronize educated people. That said, I am educated and you have patronized me in the past.
Nah…I did not say you could not have an opinion, to the contrary I would encourage you to have an opinion. However, if you go back and read your comments then I think you will find that many commentators would think that the idea of, anyways this is my country and not yours, is not only a little patronizing but it is arrogant and suggests that those who are not Indonesian cannot understand what it is to be Indonesian and therefore should not comment as it is not their country.
The stupidity of your response is that you throw stuff in about betrayal. I wonder how I have betrayed my parents, my family, or my country. You need to grown up and act a little more like an adult. The comment about telling my Son that I am unqualified to comment on education and corruption and the like in Indonesia fits within the context of what you have said to me.
What should I study on Sumatra or of Sumatra? Just as a matter of interest.
I actually asked how it is your country and whether you own it and whether you have a greater vested interest by virtue of your birth, perhaps. My son will be born here and as such have the same interest as you in fact it will be his country just like it is yours, anyways.
Mine is hardly a temper tantrum. My responses are measured and address your questions and comments. My comments do not resort to swearing or jumping up and down on the spot saying it’s mine, it’s mine, it’s mine, it will never be yours!
Once again, I have not said you do not know anything about educated people. Go back and read my comments and you will see this.
Sue me for what? Calling you patronizing? It is hardly defamation. I have not threatened you. I have not suggested that I am going to call your employer. I have not suggested that I am going to find out who you are.
You on the other hand are going to write a letter to UPH and complain about one of their staff members. Unfortunately, for you, I am not on the staff there. I do teach and work with the odd group, but I am not employed by UPH. Furthermore, I do not really see any link between what I have said in this thread that might even be remotely offensive to the people of UPH. Yet, if you need names and addresses, then I would be more than happy to supply them.
I am not questioning your nationality. You really need to take a breath and read what I have written. I asked you a question in terms of characterizing how Indonesia was yours. The idea being that you were keen to prevent any non-Indonesians from commenting on “your” country. I was actually taking the piss as much as anything else. You obviously missed that.
Corruption is one of many “major” issues facing Indonesia. If it is your major issue, then good for you. It is easy enough to cite 3, 4, 5, or 10 links that highlight corruption as being the most important issue. I do not know that any of my comments can be construed as saying that corruption was not an important issue. My concern was that an exclusive reliance on education to solve the corruption problem is not enough.
Once again, I did not say that education did not play a role in educating values. Read my posts / comments and you will see that.
As you can see, I am shaking in my boots at the thought of you contacting UPH.
Also once again, it is interesting that when someone engages you in a debate you decide to personalize it, swear, and then threaten retribution.
Yep, I think it is me that is having the childish moment.
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October 20th, 2008 at 4:48 amNow that everyone has had their little moment can we get back on topic which is ranking educational institutions?
Comment on “Best Rated Universities”.
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