Fitna by Geert Wilders

March 7th, 2008, in Opinion, by Lairedion

View the original article here.

Tags: Cartoons, Danish, Denmark, Dutch, Films, Fitna, Freedom, Freedoms, Geert Wilders, Indonesians, Iran, Islam, Islamization, Movies, Muslim, Muslims, Netherlands, Pakistan, Protests, Quran, Religion, Religions, Western, Westerners

282 Comments on “Fitna by Geert Wilders”

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Deng Xiao Phing Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 9:28 am
We are the largest democratic muslim country in the world, we should show our maturity to accept diversity in belief, religions, races. We should not condemn or react negatively to Geert Wilders on his ‘Fitna’ as the similar to we do not react & just watching the our veryown muslim youths doing ‘amok’ vandalism to the churches during the last week Easter celebration.

Sudah jelas bung ?
Deng Xiao Phing Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 9:41 am
Aluang Anak Bayang I really agree with you we too in west want to live in peace. I’ll make a deal with you stay in your islamic countries and we will stay in the west and enjoy our free speech. So yes we are corrupt we are not moral we have porno ,we are non believers, so please don’t come to the west just leave us to live in peace as we have before. we really don’t want fanatics here we don’t like your way of looking at life you contribute nothing but strife to our society we will never believe in your god or your koran. It is not for us we like living with the devil he is an ok guy when you get to know him so again I ask you to spread the word to your fellow moslem brothers don’t come to the west anyways we never asked moslems to come over here you guys made the voyage yourselves very simple solution to all of this stay in your moslim countries for the sake of peace Why would you want to live among us anyways.
thank you
Rupert

ONE HUNDRED PERCENT AGREE !
IF MOSLEM NEVER MIGRATED INTO EUROPE & USA, THERE WILL BE NO 9/11, JUST STAY WITHIN YOUR DOMAIN ZONE, TREAT THE WESTERN SIMPLY AS NON-HALAL ZONE BECAUSE THEY EAT THE VERY DELICIOUS PORK SAUSAGE WHICH I ALSO LIKE IT ! hm … very delicious … hm frankfurt pork sausage … bring them here more … I want to eat them all
Cukurungan Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 9:49 am
Dear Rupert,

Why you don’t make the same recommendations to your infidels brother to leave all muslim teritory and don’t make business with any muslim and let us riding back Camel and horse.. Why ? or is it because all the infidels born as cheater and liar.

I tell you that our countries was a beautiful countries until the infidels christian came to our land and killing our people and stealing our wealth don’t talked too big with us because in every bricks and crown in the infidels kingdom, there was always the wealth stolen from our countries and there’s also blood stained of our brother.

It is goods ideas if the Dutch want to deport and expell all muslim from there but Dutch also should not forget to return back the multi billion $ had been stolen from here and paid compensation to hundred thousands our countrymen had been killed by them during
350years of the Christian Dutch criminal time in here.

Is that clear Sir?
Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Dear Rupert,

Aluang Anak Bayang I really agree with you we too in west want to live in peace. I’ll make a deal with you stay in your islamic countries and we will stay in the west and enjoy our free speech….

I am bewildered you can’t see anything wrong with your own statement. You must have been fed too many Christianity craps. How ungrateful. Allah swt made the world and all the creatures in it. We are all citizen of the world and slaves to Allah swt.

So yes we are corrupt we are not moral we have porno ,we are non believers,

You said it yourself.

so please don’t come to the west just leave us to live in peace as we have before. we really don’t want fanatics here we don’t like your way of looking at life you contribute nothing but strife to our society we will never believe in your god or your koran.

The only fanatics are the non-believers living a less spiritual lives in the expenses of Allah swt and the Muslims. If you are not an agent of Satan and the Jews, you have nothing to fear from us. If there is something wrong about the quran, it would not be the fastest growing religion in the world.

It is not for us we like living with the devil he is an ok guy when you get to know him so again I ask you to spread the word to your fellow moslem brothers don’t come to the west anyways we never asked moslems to come over here you guys made the voyage yourselves very simple solution to all of this stay in your moslim countries for the sake of peace Why would you want to live among us anyways.
thank you
Rupert

I do really pity you. The devil did not create this world. He is the impersonation of all things evil. You say he is an ok guy? Did Christianity’s concept of trinity taught you that?

I pray that Allah swt open your eyes to reasoning one day.

Salam.
dewaratugedeanom Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 5:23 pm
ramster

But I can’t say the same for the Koran because I’ve never read it.

Do it.
Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
@ Deng Xiao Phing

… NON-HALAL ZONE BECAUSE THEY EAT THE VERY DELICIOUS PORK SAUSAGE WHICH I ALSO LIKE IT ! hm “¦ very delicious “¦ hm frankfurt pork sausage “¦ bring them here more “¦ I want to eat them all

Was that meant to insult?

Just like Female Genital Multilation; foreigners think we have a problem because of FGM in Islamic countries. In Indonesia, FGM was rarely carried out; Just bay leaf and doa to symbolise the ritual, no cutting. The same goes with pork. I don’t see how we can be offended. Pork is haram to Overseas Muslims does not mean it is haram to us; majority don’t mind eating them. They are delicious especially the Babi guling by the Balinese and Char siow by the Tiong Hua. If you are not familiar with Indonesian Islam despite claiming to speak Javanese, I suggest you stay intelligent by acting dumb.
Sylvester Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 6:52 pm
You eat pork Aluang?
That surprises me.
At this time I have to salute you. Being a good Moslem or Christian is not about halal haram but is about how to be a good human being inside.
Robert Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
@Cukurungan

It is goods ideas if the Dutch want to deport and expel all muslim from there

Which Dutch are you referring to? Government? Politicians?
Most muslims in the Netherlands have Dutch nationality, so expelling is not possible. The roots of the majority of the Dutch Muslims are in Turkey and Morocco so there is no link with Indonesia.

Dutch also should not forget to return back the multi billion $ had been stolen from here and paid compensation to hundred thousands our countrymen had been killed by them during 350years of the Christian Dutch criminal time in here

Fully agree. The Dutch behaved in appaling manner, so compensation should be paid.
I am trying to figure out the amount of money to be be paid. The problem is to establish the going rate for compensation. Maybe I can use the rate that is being is used in Indonesia. Cukurungan, can you tell me how much money the Indonesian Government paid to the people in Aceh, West-Papua and East-Timor to compensate for the killings there?
Also I am trying to calculate the amount of money the former VOC sould pay back for the natural resources they took with them. Do you happen to know how much compensation money is being paid by companies like Newmont Mining Co. and Freeport-McMoran for robbing Indonesia? Can you shed a light on this? Thanks. I will contact Tommy Suharto about the rates concerning the spices stolen.
Cukurungan, those criminal Dutch Christians will have to pay one day, bloody infidels!
Agusto Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 7:27 pm
Dear Syvester,

Being a good Moslem or Christian is not about halal haram but is about how to be a good human being inside.

You got it all wrong, being a good muslim is someone who emulates good ol pedomoh to the very detail. And being a good christian is some one who is willing to turn the other cheek when smacked by muslims, and then pay the jizyah.
Lairedion Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 7:49 pm
Cuk, Robert,

There’s another thread running on IM dealing with Dutch Compensation

http://www.indonesiamatters.com/1516/reparations-compensation/
rupert Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 8:11 pm
Why you don’t make the same recommendations to your infidels brother to leave all muslim teritory and don’t make business with any muslim and let us riding back Camel and horse.. Why ? or is it because all the infidels born as cheater and liar.

I tell you that our countries was a beautiful countries until the infidels christian came to our land and killing our people and stealing our wealth don’t talked too big with us because in every bricks and crown in the infidels kingdom, there was always the wealth stolen from our countries and there’s also blood stained of our brother.

It is goods ideas if the Dutch want to deport and expell all muslim from there but Dutch also should not forget to return back the multi billion $ had been stolen from here and paid compensation to hundred thousands our countrymen had been killed by them during 350 years of the Christian Dutch criminal time in here.

cuk
It is that type of thinking that made you a victim in the first place , You guys are all the same you are all victims of society ohh as for the part about doing business remember all you islamic countries have is oil that is only by chance you have no other industries or anything else to offer the world but strife. I can hardly wait to hear what you have to say when we march on Iran in a couple of months maybe they will put up more of a fight than Iraq did !! so my friend maybe youtoo will have your chance at martadom
take care
rupert

Is that clear Sir?
Robert Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 8:34 pm
@Aluang Anak Bayang

Pork is haram to Overseas Muslims does not mean it is haram to us; majority don’t mind eating them

Can you tell me what kind of Qu’ran you read? Is there a special Indonesian version/translation of the Qu’ran? My Muslim friends (”Overseas” Muslims) showed me why they cannot eat pork, it was stated quite clear in the Qu’ran.

Qu’ran 2: 173 (Yusuf Ali translation):
He hath only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and that on which any other name hath been invoked besides that of Allah. But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then is he guiltless. For Allah is Oft-forgiving Most Merciful.

I don’t read Arabic bit I have checked other translations as well, swine flesh is a no-no.

majority don’t mind eating them

Didn’t Allah mind eating pork? Otherwise he wouldn’t have put it in the Qu’ran, wouldn’t he? Personally I don’t mind Muslims eating pork, it’s just surprising you take this issue so lightly while “Overseas” Muslims take this issue quite serious. My Muslim friends don’t dare questioning the Qu’ran.
Aluang, what about alcohol? Halal or Haram? What do drink with your babi guling?

When I read the Qu’ran I never see notes that some verses don’t apply to Indonesians. But as said earlier I am only familiar with non-Indonesian Muslims , and they take the Qu’ran quite literally, so pork = haram.
Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
March 30th, 2008 at 10:25 pm
@ rupert

… all you islamic countries have is oil that is only by chance…

LOL

I can hardly wait to hear what you have to say when we march on Iran in a couple of months

Declaring war on peaceful Muslims, ehh?

@ Robert

Qu’ran 2: 173 clearly states that pork is halal if you eat them when forced by necessity in this case when one is hungry.

Of course alcohol is haram, but if one repent after consuming it, Allah is oft-forgiving Most Merciful.
Bob Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 2:14 am
400 years ago the Dutch started to move away from the crippling and debilitating influence of the Roman Catholic Church. Book printing and literacy made it possible for each individual to form opinions and not just copy those preached by the Church. Society made sure that everybody, no matter how simple, was able to express their opinions with no repercussion other than maybe ridicule. Fast forward to the 21st century and enter 1 million Muslims, that either haven’t learned to form opinions or are too afraid to express them.

The Dutch would like to know who they are sharing the table with every day, but they are only getting statements from officials, not the majority of individual Muslims. In an attempt to at last provoke a reaction this simplistic and generalizing movie was made. Please tell us: WHO ARE YOU? WHAT DO YOU THINK? WHERE ARE YOU AT? Are you with a 1400 year old book, enticing violence against non-Muslims and promoting to ignore individual rights of non-male Muslims within your own community or what? We want to hear YOUR opinion not what your Imam tells you to say or think.

No matter how crude or simplistic this video is (I’m afraid a lot of people won’t be able to get past), it is posing a valid and fundamental question that will hopefully contribute to a rise in human consciousness not only in the Netherlands.
Lairedion Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 3:28 am
Bob said:

400 years ago the Dutch started to move away from the crippling and debilitating influence of the Roman Catholic Church. Book printing and literacy made it possible for each individual to form opinions and not just copy those preached by the Church. Society made sure that everybody, no matter how simple, was able to express their opinions with no repercussion other than maybe ridicule. Fast forward to the 21st century and enter 1 million Muslims, that either haven’t learned to form opinions or are too afraid to express them.

400 years ago the Dutch started to move away from the crippling and debilitating influence of the Roman Catholic Church and based on strict Protestantism they practised colonialization and slave trading for decades to come. Not so fast to the 21st century.
rupert Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 3:45 am
Qu’ran 2: 173 clearly states that pork is halal if you eat them when forced by necessity in this case when one is hungry.

Of course alcohol is haram, but if one repent after consuming it, Allah is oft-forgiving Most Merciful.

how convient i guess killing works the same way
right Aluang Anak Bayang
god Iam happy I live in the USA where wrong is wrong not just convient
Olaf Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 7:48 am
Where is the Islamic world outrage to the countless beheadings and mutilations over the years? Where is the condemnation to all of the world atrocities being committed in the name of Islam? Where is the Islamic world outrage to human suffering? Where is it?
Islamic voices are conspicuously silent. Why? Because Geert Wilders is 100% right.
I am sick of cowering to Islamic Evil - There is no other way to discribe such a world wide cancer. Islam is Evil. We who bow down to it are cowards.

Who are we? Who are we? Are we free men, or cowards? Wake up people - Islam, together with our weakness, equals death.
Cukurungan Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 11:19 am
cuk
It is that type of thinking that made you a victim in the first place , You guys are all the same you are all victims of society ohh as for the part about doing business remember all you islamic countries have is oil that is only by chance you have no other industries or anything else to offer the world but strife.

I am not victim of anything I just want to teach you how to see something from the wider picture because the problem is not only the Muslim who make living in the infidel countries but there is also the infidels who seek benefit from the dumbness of the Muslim countries.

Speaking about the oil business, I feel jealousy on your tone we asked to God to give us a business that allow us more time to pray, song Qasidah and practice martial arts just in case. But it is your own dumbness to depend on our oil so blame your self not us.

I can hardly wait to hear what you have to say when we march on Iran in a couple of months maybe they will put up more of a fight than Iraq did !! so my friend maybe youtoo will have your chance at martadom
take care

Ha..ha..ha the infidels would only dare to attack a bankrupt and very weak countries like Iraq, Somalia and Afghanistan and the infidels army only capable to defeat the stone age warrior like the red Indian and Aboriginal warrior but they can do nothing to eliminate a few hundred al-Qaeda fighter even the infidels has been using more than hundred thousand modern army equipped with the multi billion dollar weaponry .. sad”¦ sad.

As I said before that your nuke and weaponry might be working to frighten Japanese Samurai and Nazi German”¦.but..not for our warrior like Mas Aluang Anak Bayang and Bli Dewagederatuanom.

Now, I can sleep well because Mas Aluang and Bli Dewa will take care the front line against the infidels while my self just get ready behind the front line to take care their widow in case those two gentlemen are death in the battle field.
rupert Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 7:52 pm
Ha..ha..ha the infidels would only dare to attack a bankrupt and very weak countries like Iraq, Somalia and Afghanistan and the infidels army only capable to defeat the stone age warrior like the red Indian and Aboriginal warrior but they can do nothing to eliminate a few hundred al-Qaeda fighter even the infidels has been using more than hundred thousand modern army equipped with the multi billion dollar weaponry .. sad”¦ sad.

As I said before that your nuke and weaponry might be working to frighten Japanese Samurai and Nazi German”¦.but..not for our warrior like Mas Aluang Anak Bayang and Bli Dewagederatuanom.

Now, I can sleep well because Mas Aluang and Bli Dewa will take care the front line against the infidels while my self just get ready behind the front line to take care their widow in case those two gentlemen are death in the battle field.

CUK

hey thanks man i needed a good laugh to day when we went to afghanistan the taliban ran like rats to hide in caves. Your great hero Osama was hiding with them also and is still running like a rat , coward that he is as for Iraq you should get your facts straight Iraq HAD the 3rd largest army in the world it took us the infidels 2 weeks to destroy it . Cuk we have faced evil in the past and we won all the conflicts Islam is not evil just the fanatics that want blood are the one that preech Jihad are. as for Alqueda they are cowards they hide behind women and children . If they werent they would put on a soldiers uniform and meet us like men on the battlefield. but of course that would take the hearth of a warrior cowards dont have that in them what a shame for arabs around the world to have there religion governed by cowards
good luck Cuk god bless
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Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 10:55 pm
@ Sheikh Cuk

Now, I can sleep well because Mas Aluang and Bli Dewa will take care the front line against the infidels while my self just get ready behind the front line to take care their widow in case those two gentlemen are death in the battle field.

I am surprised you decided to join our rank? What happened? Darn, so you are not leaving your wife to us while you seek Jihad matyrdom. This is very unIslamic, brother. I suggest you rethink your position. Planning and directing had always been for smart Javanese Muslims like me.
J Generic Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 11:40 pm
Everything that was presented in Fitna actually happened. So I contened it’s the truth in this documentary that has caused such an “uproar”. I for one am glad to be an “infidel”. I want no part of this blatant intolerance. There’s no room on this planet in this day and age for a group that believes they have the right and duty to kill others based solely on their religious beliefs.
Mohamed F Says:
March 31st, 2008 at 11:49 pm
2 weeks ago on a protestmarch against Wilders in Amsterdam 1 guy was arested for discrimination.
He was carrying sings with quotes of Wilders, but has replaced the word “Muslims” with “jews“…………………………..
Teng Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 12:13 am
2 weeks ago on a protestmarch against Wilders in Amsterdam 1 guy was arested for discrimination.
He was carrying sings with quotes of Wilders, but has replaced the word “Muslims” with “jews”"¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦”¦..

Yeah, that was absolutely ridiculous. I don’t think he actually got charged though… but still.
Lairedion Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 2:34 am
Well, SBY officially banned the movie and Wilders is barred from access to Indonesia.

From Metro TV Online:

Metrotvnews.com, Jakarta: Presiden Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono secara resmi melarang penayangan film Fitna di Indonesia. Presiden juga memerintahkan Kementerian Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia untuk mencekal Geert Wilders, politisi Belanda yang juga pembuat film tersebut apabila berkunjung ke Indonesia. Demikian disampaikan Presiden Yudhoyono di Kantor Kepresidenan, Jakarta, Senin (31/3).

Meski demikian, kepada masyarakat Indonesia, Presiden Yudhoyono meminta tidak melakukan cara-cara kekerasan dan aksi-aksi sweeping terhadap warga Belanda di Indonesia. Fitna adalah sebuah film yang berisi pandangan negatif terhadap kitab suci Al-Qur’an.

Sementara itu Wakil Jaksa Agung Mochtar Arifin menyatakan pemerintah dan aparat penegak hukum akan mengambil langlah-langkah untuk mencegah masuknya film Fitna. Hal itu dilakukan dengan membatasi peredaran film itu di dalam negeri melalui jaringan internet.(BEY)
Andrew Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 3:26 am
Presiden juga memerintahkan Kementerian Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia untuk mencekal Geert Wilders, politisi Belanda yang juga pembuat film tersebut apabila berkunjung ke Indonesia

Poor Geert Wilders, now he can’t visit the beautiful and peaceful country of Indonesia. He will regret it for the rest of his life. LOL.
Tommy Ray Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 4:05 am
“400 years ago the Dutch started to move away from the crippling and debilitating influence of the Roman Catholic Church and based on strict Protestantism they practised colonialization and slave trading for decades to come. Not so fast to the 21st century.”

There was slavery across the world. European people were the first to stop its practice.
Cukurungan Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 9:57 am
Dear Rupert,

Rats are much better than the infidels who shooting un-armed a backward people such as a Red Indian and aboriginal just for fun and take over their land.
And my hero is not Osama Bin Laden but Aluang Anak Bayang, you can see by your self on his gravatar even only his moustache could make the infidels self orgasm.

Iraq at that time was only bankrupt country with very low quality army after 10 years embargo and even during the Iraq Golden Time (I meant when Saddam was still under payroll CIA), their army could not defeat the bankrupt Iran after revolution where you get the Iraq the third largest army. You may too much watching Rambo Movie.

No one believe your fabrication story that the infidels army hesitate to kill children and women anyone can see in Hadittha case and numerous case that involved the infidels
deliberately kill and f**k boy and woman for fun. The bottom line is your trillion dollar army is worth nothing against few hundred gangsters.

Btw, I would like to inform you that Al-qaeda and Ahmadinejad was very grateful with American People who already spent trillion dollars and sacrificing life of the poor American people to give Al-qaeda the best breeding center and give the Iraq Oil to the Iran control for free.

Regard,

Your Beloved Friend
Andy Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 12:04 pm
If muslims want the world to be sympathetic towards them they have to see things from both points of view. For example how many of those outraged Indonesian muslims felt anything negative towards Abu Bakar Bashir when he delivered a hate speech to young muslims in East Java and incited violence recently. It seems they want things all their way.
susan Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 5:13 pm
This is a good chance for all Muslims to prove that they are not as bad as Wilders understands, that Islam is a peaceful religion, that mostly Muslims are mature in their faith.
Violently protesting and anarchically judging or attacking whoever and whatever christian alike will only prove Wilders gets his point.