Ahmadiyya

Jan 16th, 2008, in IM Posts, by

Ahmadiyah makes changes to its beliefs and avoids being banned by the government.

Continued from Religious Intolerance and Banning Islamic Sects.

No Ban

Pakem (Pengawas Aliran Kepercayaan Masyarakat, Overseers of the Peoples' Beliefs), made up of representatives of the Attorney General's Office, police, the State Intelligence Agency and the Religious Affairs Ministry, decided on 15th January not to ban Ahmadiyya, despite a fatwa by the Indonesian Ulema Council (MUI) that had declared Ahmadiyya an heretical Islamic sect. antara

Teacher not Prophet

The decision not to ban the group was made after Ahmadiyya leaders caved into pressure and issued a 12-point statement saying they acknowledged Muhammad as the last prophet, and that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was simply a teacher.

Pakem however said it may change its decision if Ahmadiyya failed to fully implement the changes to its formal belief structure, and gave the group 3 months to do so. detik

Wisnu Subroto, the deputy attorney general of intelligence, said:

We will keep watching and evaluating their activities over the next three months. If Ahmadiyya fails to follow through on their declaration, we will discuss later what to do about it.

Jemaat Ahmadiyah Indonesia (JAI) leader Ahmad Basit said his group had the same beliefs as mainstream Islam.

Like other Muslims, Ahmadiyya followers also recite syahadat (the two sentences of faith), acknowledging Muhammad as the last prophet. Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is only our teacher.

Ahmadiyya also said they would not try to convert other Muslims to their way of thinking, but said they would instead strengthen relations with mainstream Muslims.

Wisnu asked the public to respect Ahmadiyya's goodwill and willingness to change, and accept Pakem's decision.

Still not happy

However about 1,000 Muslims staged a protest in Bandung, West Java to demand the government disband Ahmadiyya. Hedi Muhammad from the West Java Alliance of Muslims said:

The Ahmadiyah organization is as heretical as Al-Qiyadah al-Islamiyah.

And the Majelis Ulama Indonesia (MUI) leader Ma'ruf Amin said Ahmadiyya's decision to acknowledge Muhammad as the final prophet was not enough to lift the fatwa from the group. Saying that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was simply a teacher could be interpreted in various ways, worried Maruf. republika

This article in Indonesian - Ahmadiyyah.


196 Comments on “Ahmadiyya”

  1. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    FAZAL AHMEDI, DON’T YOU RUN AWAY, ANSWER THE FOLLOWING:

    Just for your kind information that “Miss Rufo Bashiruddeen” is none other than A.K.SHAIKH. This is A.K.SHAIKH’S his fake id.

    Now I believe that its common for qadianis and ghulam ahmedis to lie and cheat people with their falsehood. I am not A K Sheikh and you are a liar”¦case closed.

    Now, come to the point, and reply to us, do you believe in Mirza qadiani as a Nabi or not?

    Do you consider everyone who does not take bait of Mirza qadiani a KAFIR and out side Islam, as your khalifa sani beleves?

    ( just for those who don’t know, khalifa sani, a self appointed ‘Musleh mouood’ also known as khalifa zani for his devlish past and stories of zana.. Ms Rufo, an Italian whore, spent nights as Mirza ghulam qadianis house in Qadian with khalifa zani, which khalifa zani accepted”¦.) Mr. Fazal Ahmedi, Please tell us what excuse khalifa zani gave to you for taking her to Qadian?

    Do you believe that according to Mirza ghulam, said about Jesus Christ, “His family is also very noble and clean ( a pun). His three paternal grand mothers and maternal grandmothers were adultrous and whores, whose blood was part of his making. Probably that was one of the conditions for godhood”¦ His mingling with and company of prostitutes is probably due to his ancestarl connection, otherwise no pious
    man will let a yong hore touch his head with her impure hands and massage his head and feet with perfume bought from her earnings (as pros). Those who can understand can gauge the character of such a man. ”

    Don’t you now run away, answer these questions. Abu Khurshid, these questions are for you too.

  2. avatar Fazal Ahmadi says:

    THIS IS FOR A.K.SHAIKH AND HIS ASSOCIATES.

    FIRST ASK MR.A.K.SHAIKH TO PRESENT THE PAGE OF HAZRAT MIRZA GHULAM AHMAD QADIANI ALIHISSALAM’S BOOK WHICH HE REFERED IN HIS COMMENT THEN ONLY EXPECT ANY SORTS OF REPLY FROM MY END.

    IF A.K.SHAIKH CANNOT PRESENT; I AM 100% SURE AS I WAS BEFORE THAT A.K.SHAIKH WILL NEVER PRESENT THE SAID PAGE. REASON IS VERY SIMPLE HE IS THE GREATEST LIAR AND HE HAS LEFT MILES BEHIND TO IBLEES IN HIS LIES.

    TO KNOW AND SEE THE LIES OF A.K.SHAIKH JUST WATCH MY VIDEO

    “A.K.SHAIKH THE LIAR CALLS A PUBLICLY AVAILABLE TEXT A SECRET”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4IsxhaA1eo

  3. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    Hey Fazal Ahmedi,

    My questions are to you and I have nothing to do with A K Sheikh. Don’t run away, answer my questions given above. Or its another excuse and twist by qadianis to hide their false beliefs.

    To Authotites in Indonesia:

    I humbly request Indonesian authorities to look at their website and the press release by Ahmadiyya Jamaat at http://www.alislam.org. According to these people,

    – Mirza ghulam Ahmed is a true Nabi, a nabi whose denail makes everyone a KAFIR even if one has not heard mirzas name…

    – They don’t believe in finality of the prophethood of Muhammed pbuh. They, like a hypocrite, claim that Muhammed pbuh is khatam an nabiyyeen which is seal of the prophets. They DO NOT BELIVE MUHAMMED pbuh IS THE FINAL PROPHET OF GOD.

    – Mirza wrote worst kind of filthy language and insults against Jesus Christ. An excerpts is given above with refernce from Mirza’s book. This is directly against Allahs words of priases and respects for Jesus Christ and his Mother pbu them.

    – Ahmadiyyas are not allowed to pray with Muslims, not to have any relationship with them ( like marrying their daughters to Muslimssons) as ALL MUSLIMS ARE KAFIR AND OUTSIDE PALE OF ISLAM.

    – These details are available on their oficial website and refernce is given above on this thread.

    – All Mulsim Umma condiser them KAFIRS and outside Islam, Indonesia, should also declare them NON MUSLIMs and as such protect them as a non-Muslim minority in any Muslim country.

    – They should never be allowed to call other Muslims as KAFIR and OUTSIDE ISLAM.

  4. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    ‘Miss Rufo the zani’! Please wait for the Jewish prophet to come from the heavens gliding in the air on the backs of the angels. When he comes the Muslims will be free from all evils. Our lord the saviour will help us against his people the Jews, Christians and the Qadianis. They are the menace of society. Muslims are the chosen ones. The best of the best. The leader of the human race. All you liars, listen and be afraid for our lord Jesus Christ is coming to save Islam from all evils. Soon there will be only one religion. The religion of the Messiah, the religion of the Christ. Then you will not be allowed to do zina ‘miss rufo zani’.

  5. avatar Miss Rufo Bashiruddeen says:

    Jawad Sultan

    I know it hurts when truth is told about your deceptive beliefs and about your khalifa Basheeruddin who is known as Khalifa zani among you qadianis. Whjy don’t you tell everyone what explanation was given by khalifa zani for bringing Miss Rufo, an Italian whore, to qadian at mirza qadiani’s home? Khalifa zani gave a khutba juma about RUFO, you should know your faith more than others.

    While doing that, please answer the questions which I asked your faith brother Fazal Ahmedi, He has run away without answering them may be you are the brave one.

    Questions are:

    Do you believe that Muhammed pbuh is the LAST prophet of god and the door of prophethood is closed and sealed as per quran and ahdith?

    Do you believe in Mirza qadiani as a Nabi or not?

    Do you consider everyone who does not take bait of Mirza qadiani a KAFIR and out side Islam, as your khalifa zani beleves?

  6. avatar dewaratugedeanom says:

    Assalamualaikum Aluang

    Is this you in the gravatar? I admit Harley Davidson is written all over you. Except for the peci, unless it’s a leather one.

    Get your motor running,
    Head out on the highway,
    Looking for adventure,
    And whatever comes your way”¦

    (‘Born To Be Wild’ by Steppenwolf)

  7. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    Who’s ‘khalifa Basheeruddin’ and what’s he got to do with our lord Jesus Christ who lives in heaven with his God without fear and weaknesses bestowed upon all man. He is different from every other man for he still lives while all prophets are dead and buried in dirt. All the other prophet’s bones have turned to dust while Jesus the Saviour of Mankind still lives with his flesh and blood intact, forever young and fresh. ‘khalifa Basheeruddin’ is also dead like everyone while Jesus still lives. Why you talk about the dead when we should talk about the living? Mohammad is not the LAST prophet. Believe it or not Mohammad is dead and buried in earth. And guess who’s alive. You’re right!. The one and only Jesus Christ living in the heavens with the angels. And his message is of Love. So love brother, do not hate for he will be angry with you when he comes. Prophethood is not closed until Jesus lives.

  8. avatar Bogalakon says:

    Jawad Sultan,

    I can say nothing to you but what the Qur’an already said:

    “O People of the Book! commit no excesses in your religion: nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Al-Masih ‘Isa the son of Maryam was (no more than) A Messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Maryam, and a Spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His Messengers. Say not “Trinity”: desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is One God: glory be to Him: (far Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs.” – An-Nisaa 4:171

  9. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    So Mr. ‘Bogalakon’ are you not a Muslim? All the Muslims believe that Jesus Christ is the heavens with his God. That he is alive when all the prophets are dead. Is it not true that you Muslims believe that he is your savior? Who will save your religion from the christians and the jews. Also I never called Jesus son of God(at least not yet). I was merely proclaiming what Muslims already believe in. Don’t you believe that He is the only prophet alive and that he will come even after Mohammad is long gone? To save who’s religion? Not his but yours. Don’t you believe that he will be the Prophet for all mankind? That he will rule the world like a king and be the last prophet of God. That he is the only man ever to live for more that 2000 years and still counting. That he has gone without food and water etc. for more than 2000 years. No other man can do that. Not even Mohammad could go without food and water. Not even he could go without death. These are YOUR views that I’m quoting. This is what YOU muslims believe in. Is it not written in the Quran that Jesus could bring the dead back to life? Did your prophet ever do that? He never had such ability. Isn’t it written in you Quran that only Allah can give life? Then how could Jesus do so? I could go on forever. Your own views contradict the stupid fact that Mohammad was the last prophet or a prophet at all for that matter. I think I have proven my point quite satisfactorily for anyone having an ounce of intelligence.

  10. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    Jawad Sultan

    It does not surprise me that you tried very hard to change the topic and brought in the Essa A.S. We know your tactics too well.

    One more thing, the way you described all prophets and the tone of your posts show how arrogant you are… Just like your grand liar who used insulting language against God’s praised prophets. A Muslim will always talk about all prophets with respect and specially Jesus Christ ( Essa a.s.) who is prsised and given respect in Quran.

    But that is not the point here, I asked you some specific questions, let all the readers know what the beliefs of followers of Mirza Ghulam qadiani are?

    Do you blieve in Mirza Qadiani as nabi or not?
    Do you consider all Muslims of the world who did not accept him as nabi or did not do his bait (oath of allegiance) are KAFIR and outside Islam?

    And don’t preach us about hate, your false nabi and his son and false Khalifa Basheruddin officially told you to hate all Muslims. They declared all Muslims a KAFIRS, Children of prostitutes, they told you not to pray with Muslims, don’t give daughters to their sons, don’t pray behind them…etc.

    Mirza Qadiani established a separate religion but used Islam to promote his false beliefs.

    If you have courage to speak the truth, then say it o run away like FAZAL AHMADI.

  11. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    To ‘Miss Rufo the zani’:
    Oh miss rufo, you’re so naive. I never said I was Qadiani or for that matter a Muslim. Lol.
    I’m a follower of our lord Jesus Christ who is your lord too. That much we have in common brother. But I don’t hate you like you hate Qadianis. Because Jesus taught us to love our fellow human beings. Why would I believe in any Qadiani person when our lord is living in the heavens and he shall return soon to avenge his followers. I don’t know why your such a hostile person. Jesus told us to love our fellow humans. Why is there so much hate in you. What have these Qadianis done to you to make you so full of poison. Come on man, take a chill pill. And answer my questions regarding Jesus Christ as being the last prophet. I ask you one more time, Why are you ignoring them? I’ll quote my earlier post again so may have no trouble answering my questions and this is only because you asked.

    “All the Muslims believe that Jesus Christ is the heavens with his God. That he is alive when all the prophets are dead. Is it not true that you Muslims believe that he is your savior? Who will save your religion from the christians and the jews. Also I never called Jesus son of God(at least not yet). I was merely proclaiming what Muslims already believe in. Don’t you believe that He is the only prophet alive and that he will come even after Mohammad is long gone? To save who’s religion? Not his but yours. Don’t you believe that he will be the Prophet for all mankind? That he will rule the world like a king and be the last prophet of God. That he is the only man ever to live for more that 2000 years and still counting. That he has gone without food and water etc. for more than 2000 years. No other man can do that. Not even Mohammad could go without food and water. Not even he could go without death. These are YOUR views that I’m quoting. This is what YOU muslims believe in. Is it not written in the Quran that Jesus could bring the dead back to life? Did your prophet ever do that? He never had such ability. Isn’t it written in you Quran that only Allah can give life? Then how could Jesus do so? I could go on forever. Your own views contradict the stupid fact that Mohammad was the last prophet or a prophet at all for that matter. I think I have proven my point quite satisfactorily for anyone having an ounce of intelligence.”

  12. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    To ‘Miss Rufo the zani’

    One more thing, the way you described all prophets and the tone of your posts show how arrogant you are”¦ Just like your grand liar who used insulting language against God’s praised prophets. A Muslim will always talk about all prophets with respect and specially Jesus Christ ( Essa a.s.) who is prsised and given respect in Quran.

    I never said anything disrespectful about Jesus. I would never do that to our lord. I have nothing but intense praise for him and his followers. If I have said anything wrong and against even your own views then tell me please?

  13. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    Jawad Sultan

    I don’t understand why you chose to side with qadianis and started calling me names. I was only exposing their falsehood, I have given refernces from their own books and their own set of beliefs that teaches them to hate all people who do not accept Mirza qadiani as a prophet.

    And in your love for qadinais, you did not condemn what Mirza said about Jesus Christ..so much of your love for Jesus Christ…….

    Did you see what he wrote about Jesus, let me quote again here:
    Mirza ghulam, said about Jesus Christ, “His family is also very noble and clean ( a pun). His three paternal grand mothers and maternal grandmothers were adultrous and whores, whose blood was part of his making. Probably that was one of the conditions for godhood”¦ His mingling with and company of prostitutes is probably due to his ancestarl connection, otherwise no pious
    man will let a yong hore touch his head with her impure hands and massage his head and feet with perfume bought from her earnings (as pros). Those who can understand can gauge the character of such a man. ”

    I will not indulge in any debate on Christ with you here as this thread is about Ahmadiyya and I will continue exposing their falsehood.

  14. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    Miss rufo the zani

    I don’t care what he or anyone else thinks about Jesus Christ. And neither does Jesus. It doesn’t matter what people say. More than half the world thinks that Mohammad was nothing but a terrorist. Does that change your conception of him.

    In any case let’s talk about Qadianis. I love a good debate. We can get to Jesus later. So the way I see it and please correct me if I’m wrong, you don’t believe Mirza Qadiani was a prophet because he wrote such bad things in his books. I haven’t read the whole thread but the gist of it has been that Mirza Qadiani is a bad person and not a prophet because he wrote bad things which a prophet could never have the courage or decency to write. So you don’t believe in the fact that most people believe in and that is Mohammad was the last prophet. Apparently you do believe that there can be more prophets but Mirza Qadiani is simply not one of them because of his writings and his actions or whatever. Why don’t you believe in the finality of Mohmmad like you fellow muslims? Why are you looking for another prophet?

  15. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    Miss rufo the zani

    Why would I feel angry at them or anyone else for that matter. Jesus Christ told me not to get angry. He taught us to love everyone including those who wish harm upon us.

    So lets talk about the Qadianis. We can get to Jesus later. Gathering from this thread it appears that you don’t believe in Mirza Qadiani as prophet because he wrote such bad thins in his books etc. The reason for your not believing is not because most Muslims believe Mohammad to be the last prophet. It means if he had written good things worthy of a prophet in your opinion you would have believed in his prophet hood. This is what your debating tactics prove. Why do you not believe in this like your other brothers and why are you looking for another prophet?

  16. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    jawad sultan

    You sound like a qadiani in guise of a Christian who just closed his eyes when Mirza qadiani called Jesus ” His three paternal grand mothers and maternal grandmothers were adulterous and whores ”

    And for my beliefs and Muslim beliefs, read the thread again ………….. like an honest critic, not like a qadiani, that’s what you seem to me.

    I did not hate them because they hate Jesus Christ, I do not agree with them on many beliefs that’s why I ask them following.

    Questions :

    Do you believe that Muhammed pbuh is the LAST prophet of God and the door of prophethood is closed and sealed as per quran and ahdith?

    Do you believe in Mirza qadiani as a Nabi or not?

    Do you consider everyone who does not take bait of Mirza qadiani a KAFIR and out side Islam, as your khalifa zani beleves?

    Jawad Sultan, if you are NOT a follower of Mirza qadiani, you don’t have to answer the questions. These questions are for Qadianis.

  17. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    Miss rufo the zani

    No problem buddy. Just for you I just accepted Qadianism. I am a follower of the Qadianistic philosophy. So lets see the questions that are tingling your spine. Ok listen up and this time I watn to answer my questions. Don’t make me repeat the same thing over and over.

    Do you believe that Muhammed pbuh is the LAST prophet of God and the door of prophethood is closed and sealed as per quran and ahdith?

    Do you believe in Mirza qadiani as a Nabi or not?

    Obviously if Qadainis believe that Mirza Qadiani was a prophet(which they do) then Mohammad was not the last prophet. Just like Muslims believe that Jesus is the last prophet and will return to save Mohammad’s religion from extinction Qadianis believe that savior is Mirza Qadiani. How can the coming savior not be a Nabi? Muslims believe that Jesus Christ , the only living prophet at this moment in the universe, living in the heavens on the right hand side of God, will return as the prophet for all mankind and therefore be the last prophet to grace this world. He will bring hidayat for Muslims that they don’t have. He will save Mohammad’s religion from the jaws of the ever powerful Christians and Jews. The great Mohammad’s Ummah will be so pathetic and weak that according to one Hadith they would have turned into pigs and monkeys. In the whole world will be no body in the Muslim Ummah will have the power to stop Islam from the extinction and depression. Jesus will come as the final prophet of all mankind. Quran will be taught to him by God and Gabriel the angel of revelation just like it was taught to Mohammad. But there will be one difference. Mohammad’s knowledge and teaching of Quran led to Muslims conflict and their separation into 73 sects but Jesus’s revelation will combine them all into one sect and on one hand. Therefore Jesus’s revelation and divinity and therefore status will be greater than Mohammad. Because after Jesus there will be no conflict and no sects will be formed. This is what Muslims believe in.

    Do you consider everyone who does not take bait of Mirza qadiani a KAFIR and out side Islam, as your khalifa zani beleves?

    As a new born Qadiani(Lol) I only believe about you what you believe about me. Although as I have pointed out earlier if Jesus as the last prophet of all mankind from the heavens then those who oppose him will logically be considered outside the pale of Islam and will be hell bound in a hurry. You people are just impostors. You believe in the finality of prophethood as much as Qadianis do.

    Now its your turn to answer my questions.
    I’ll repeat the questions I put earlier. Gathering from this thread it appears that you don’t believe in Mirza Qadiani as prophet because he wrote such bad thins in his books etc. The reason for your not believing is not because most Muslims believe Mohammad to be the last prophet. It means if he had written good things worthy of a prophet in your opinion you would have believed in his prophet hood. This is what your debating tactics prove. Why do you not believe in this like your other brothers and why are you looking for another prophet?

  18. avatar Bogalakon says:

    So Mr. ‘Bogalakon’ are you not a Muslim?

    I can say proudly that I am a Muslim.

    All the Muslims believe that Jesus Christ is the heavens with his God. That he is alive when all the prophets are dead

    Some of Muslims believe it, some of them not, and personally I don’t believe it. In fact, believing that Jesus Christ is still alive and live in heaven with God is not the core of Islamic teaching. No explicit statement about that in Qur’an. So it’s not a big deal if we believe it or not.

    Is it not true that you Muslims believe that he is your savior? Who will save your religion from the christians and the jews.

    No, It’s not true. Muslims is not supposed to believe that Jesus is our savior, neither Muhammad, neither Ustadz, neither anyone. Every Muslim is responsible to his/her own deeds, and if they hope for protection. Nothing can protect them but God. Like it’s said on the Qur’an

    “Knowest thou not that to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth? And besides Him ye have neither patron nor helper.” Al-baqarah 2:107

    Also I never called Jesus son of God(at least not yet).

    Alhamdulillah. Praise be to God. So we have more in common. (uppss.. don’t say “at least not yet”. I wish you wouldn’t change your mind)

    That he has gone without food and water etc.

    No, From what I believe, Jesus eats food like all mankind does. I know it from Qur’an

    “Al-Masih, the son of Maryam, was no more than a Messenger; many were the Messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how Allah doth make His Signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth!” Al-Maidah 5:75

    and for your convenience, I also quote a verse from Gospel

    “And they gave him (Jesus) a piece of broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And he (Jesus) took it, and did eat before them.” – Luke 24:42-43

    This is what YOU muslims believe in. Is it not written in the Quran that Jesus could bring the dead back to life? Did your prophet ever do that? He never had such ability. Isn’t it written in you Quran that only Allah can give life?

    Right, Jesus brought the dead back to life and Muhammad pbuh never did that, he never had such ability, and it’s written in Qur’an that only Allah can give life

    “And (appoint him – Jesus) a Messenger to the Children of Israel, (with this message): “I have come to you, with a Sign from your Lord, in that I make for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah’s leave: and I heal those born blind, and the lepers, and I quicken the dead, by Allah’s leave; and I declare to you what ye eat, and what ye store in your houses. Surely therein is a Sign for you if ye did believe” Al-i-imran 3:49

    Then how could Jesus do so?

    You don’t read it, do you?
    See, I don’t have to make an extra effort to type the argument. I just copy and paste verses in the Qur’an, then you can find the answer there.

    Your own views contradict the stupid fact that Mohammad was the last prophet or a prophet at all for that matter

    My own views doesn’t contradict at all with my faith that Muhammad pbuh is the last prophet. Once again this is only based on the Qur’an

    “Mohammed is not the father of any of your men; yes He is the Messenger of Allah and the last one among all the prophets. And Allah knows all things.” Al-Ahzab 33:40

    After bombarded with so many questions, I can only ask one question for you,

    If you already know that Muslims believe in Jesus, believe in all his miracles, believe that he is a Christ. So why do a Christian missionary like you waste your time converting us to Christianity? Didn’t we already believed what you want us to believe?

  19. avatar Abu khurshid says:

    Miracles of Jesus:
    Miracles ! What miracles ? All the Prophet of God did the same miracles. They gave life to dead. It means they gave life to the dead, Spiritually dead. They spiritually healed. They cured the blind spiritually. Only God the Almighty has the power to create and give life. Others cannot give life or create. This is against Allah’s SUBHAN. This is his rule and law of nature. Whereever you read about men giving life means it is spiritual. One should read and understand the Holy Quran in MUHKAMATH and MUTHASHABIHATH way means direct meaning and metaphorical meaning. No direct meaning is applicable when compared with God. He is the Creator.

    If anyone gives the same meaning as to Jesus means he is doing Shirk. This is against His Purity and Righteousness. All the muslims give the same meaning and give superiority to Hazrath Easa (AS). This is a shirk. This is against the SUBHAN of Allah.

    People who give meaning to Jesus gave life to the death and created clay birds should read this passage in Sura Luqman Allah challenges ( Ch31: V 12- ‘ Now show me what others besides Him have created’). It is a clear challenge given by Allah the Almighty.

    Pray for Dajjal’s Donkey:
    When we invite people to pray, brother Jawad Sultan says not to listen. Strange! why not you pray. Hope you are all praying. He says prayers are futile. The prayers are answered. At Gethsemene Jesus prayed the whole night and his prayers were answered. He was saved from the accursed death and did not die on the cross. He was miraculously saved from the accursed death. He returned to Galileo and ate with his followers in his physical form. Thus he fulfilled the prophecy of Jonah. So prayers are needed and dont say it is futile. Prayers bring victory.

    Eliminating Ahmadiyyas:
    No one has the guts to take the Ahmadiyyas in this world. Govts experimented many times and the results are known to the world. Because we pray and our prayers are always answered.

    Insha Allah I shall come on what Hazrat Ahmad (AS) told about Jesus’s family.

    Abu Khurshid

  20. avatar Aluang Anak Bayang says:

    dewaratugedeanom Says:

    February 5th, 2008 at 12:52 pm
    Assalamualaikum Aluang

    Is this you in the gravatar? I admit Harley Davidson is written all over you. Except for the peci, unless it’s a leather one.

    Thanks for the idea. I will get a leather one made. Haven’t been around on my bikes for months as it was raining cats and dogs. I am expecting delivery of a Hummer by May.

    Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani, please email a picture of yourself and your profile to me. I am amazed by your intelligence and is interested to know you better. Insyallah we can be more than friend.

    aluanganakbayang@hotmail.com

  21. avatar Aluang Anak Bayang says:

    @ Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani,

    Don’t let this Ahmaddiyah and Mohammadan followers bother you. I am on your side.

    Wasalam.

  22. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    So Mr. ‘Bogalakon’, you are a muslim. Good for you.

    Now let’s see what you have written. Actually alomst all Muslims believe that Jesus is in the heavens with his God. In fact those who don’t believe it are Qadianis and are declared non-muslims so we can’t count them. And yes, it is definitely a big deal. What about the hundreds of Hadiths that prophesies the arrival of Jesus Christ Son of Maryam? How can you deny those. No real muslim can deny those prophecies contained in all those hadith which clearly state the arrival of Jesus to save the Muslims from extinction. Thats the whole reason for believing that he is alive. If you don’t believe in it then you are denying your own Prophet’s sayings and you are a heretic and should be declared kafir by your brothers. Mohammad himself said that Jesus would come and he would prophet for all mankind just like Mohammad. Quran would be given to him Jibril just like it was given to Mohammad. You are denying you own prophet’s countless hadiths? If Jesus is not the savior then why did Mohammad say that he would come and bring Iman back into Muslims and save them? Are you implying that your own prophet was lying? What kind of a Muslim are you that says that his prophet is a liar?

  23. avatar Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani says:

    Jawad Sultan

    Gathering from this thread it appears that you don’t believe in Mirza Qadiani as prophet because he wrote such bad thins in his books etc. The reason for your not believing is not because most Muslims believe Mohammad to be the last prophet. It means if he had written good things worthy of a prophet in your opinion you would have believed in his prophet hood

    .

    Thanks for clearing up any doubts about your beliefs.

    As far your above comment, Let me very clearly put it

    – We don’t believe Mirza qadiani as prophet because Allah Tala tells us i Quran that Muhammed pbuh is the seal of prophets. Ahadith also confirm his status as seal of the prophets and final prophet. There is a clear saying of Muhammed pbuh that there is no prophet after him but there will be false prophets.

    So, even if Mirza qadiani had written very nice books, we would not have accepted him or anyonme else for that matter, as NABI.

    – When we talk about bad / filthy language used by Mirza, we try to point out that how such a person can even be a Muslim who goes against Quaranic commands. An ordinary Muslim will not write such blasphemies which Mirza, who claimed prophethood, wrote. Therefore, he cannot be a gentleman, nevermind a nabi.

    To Alaung Anak

    Mohammadan followers bother you

    Muslims never call themselves ” Muhammadans”, Its a title given by Non- Muslims like they gave to followers of Christ as CHRISTIANS.

    If you are a Muslim, then you need to learn a lot. If yo are pretending to be one, then you are not doing a good job. All your posts stink and an evidence that you are trying to spread false impression about Muslims.

  24. avatar Aluang anak Bayang says:

    @ Miss Rufo Basheeruddin Khalifa zani

    Muslims never call themselves ” Muhammadans”, Its a title given by Non- Muslims like they gave to followers of Christ as CHRISTIANS.

    You do need to loosen your jilbab. You can’t even spelt my name correctly. I call myself a Javanese Muslim, but those brown curry eaters posing as Muslims on this board ‘Mohammadans’.

    If you are a Muslim, then you need to learn a lot. If yo are pretending to be one, then you are not doing a good job. All your posts stink and an evidence that you are trying to spread false impression about Muslims.

    I will give you dangdut lesson in exchange for your dodgy misinterpretation of the holy quran. Tell me why Indonesia Islam stank when we are the only Muslim who do not deflower pre-teen girls and murder daughters in the name of Allah swt? The only ‘stank’ you smelled were oozing out of your armpit.

    I pray Allah swt have mercy on your soul.

    Wasalam.

  25. avatar Lairedion says:

    Mas Aluang,

    Apa yang kau lakukan? Now we can forget about curry recipes. 🙁

  26. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    Miss rufo the zani

    If you believe that there can never be a prophet after Mohammad then why do you even bother reading some false nabi’s books. And why do you ask the Qadianis for answers to these questions and allegations when you yourself say that it doesn’t matter what they say and it doesn’t matter what Mirza Qadiani said, you would never accept them. All you want to do is spread conflict. You are not really asking for answers from Qadianis? Are you? No, you already know the answer. And that is that you will never accept any prophet after Mohammad. So basically your allegations serve no purpose whatsoever. And answering those allegations by any Qadiani would also serve no purpose because you have already made up your mind.

    Now, what do you have to say about Jesus who is living in the heavens with his lord. Is he not a nabi? Isn’t Mohammad dead and buried? Isn’t Jesus the only living prophet at this moment in time. Won’t he come as a savior of Islam and Muslims? And when he comes won’t he be a nabi. If there is no prophets after Mohammad then why did he himself say countless times that there will be prophet after him and his name will be Jesus. And this prophet will have the same status as Mohammad. Jesus will be the prophet for all mankind and Quran will be revealed to him by God through Jibril. The last prophet that the world will see will be none other than Jesus who will do what Mohammad was not able to do and i.e. to make the whole world Muslim. He will succeed at the things Mohammad failed at.

  27. avatar Abu khurshid says:

    What did Ahmad (AS) mention about family of Jesus:

    The entire passage to which Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s critics have alluded in their allegation against the founder of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community was infact written in response to a filthy letter written by a certain Christian padre, one Fateh Masih in which the Christian priest uttered vile abuse against our beloved Holy Prophet ( SAL) and charged with God forbid, such offences as adultery. When the level of false fabricated accusations went beyond the limit against his master Holy Prophet (SAL), he wrote against the biblical messiah referred from the bible how he was represented in the bible and everything stopped.

    In his response to this contemptuos abuse directed against the Holy Prophet ( SAL), Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad invited the attention of the Christian padre towards reality of the fictitious deity of his creed claimed to have been seen as a propitiation of mankind’s transgression to atone for its sin through his precious blood.

    It is ironic that while the critics of the Ahmadiyya misrepresent Hazrat Ahmad’s statements to insiniuate that he God forbid, insulted the piety of Jesus’s ancestors, they conceal the fact that these statements to which they take exception actually refer, not to the Quranic Messiah, Jesus son Mary but to the fictitious Christian deity, personified by the Church as either, God forbid, God Almighty or His Parter in Trinity or else His only begotten son. They also conveniently conceal the fact that these inferences are borrowed from Christian scriptures and commentaries, a fact clearly stated in the body of the supplement attached to Anjam-i-Atham from which these references are misquoted.

    Infact, within the contents of this particular book which appears to have become a subject of cruel subreption, Hazrat Ahmad (AS) states that he has no concern with the Jesus of Christian missionaries nor is he concerned with his conduct since ” God Almighty has made no mention of this Jesus in the Holy Quran as to who he was but Christian missionaries believe that their Jesus claimed to be God and called Moses a thief and a robber and he not only denied the anticipated event of the Holy Prophet (SAL) but also stated that he ( Jesus) would be followed by false prophets”.

    The founder of the Ahmadiyya then proceeded to state in relation to this fictitious Jesus ” we cannot accept such a vile and arrogant person and an enemy of the righteous as a decent human being let alone that we should accept him as a prophet. These foolish missionaries would be well advised to abandon this method of abuse lest God’s jealousy be aroused”

    Abu Khurshid

  28. avatar Jawad Sultan says:

    @Abu Khurshid.

    Why do you not believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ when all other Muslims do so. Is it not written in the Quran that Jesus was taken to the heavens with his body to save him from crucification at the hands of the Jews? Why do you deny this fact that is integral to your faith as a Muslim.

  29. avatar Abu khurshid says:

    To Jawad Sultan:
    The Holy Quran clearly says that Hazrat Jesus (AS) is dead. It says : ” And Muhammed is only a Messenger, Verily all Messengers have passed away before him “(Ch3: V144). There is another verse which says : ” The Messiah, son of Mary, was only a Messenger; surely, Messengers like unto him had passed away before him” (Ch5: V75). Not only these verses there are many verses which says that Jesus is dead. There are verses that human beings cannot go to heaven physically. People who believe that he is in heaven in his physical form are doing shirk. What to do this is their fate. We dont see in Holy Quran about other prophets death. Whereas Hazrat Jesus (AS) is concerned, it is very loud and clear. So we are not denying. There is no denial here. This the understanding. Others are denying this fact and changing the true meaning of the Holy Quran. They say that we are changing its meaning. Let them examine it by word by word and let them understand it. There is no necessity to take Jesus to heaven bodily. All the prophets of Allah suffered similar fete in their life time and they all were all saved by Allah the Almighty. If you read the life history of our beloved Prophet ( SAL), he was saved by cobweb in the cave along with his close companian when he left Makkah to Madina. The Holy Quran clearly says that “Jesus was neither crucified nor killed and was made to appear to his enemies”.

    Divinity:
    His alleged divinity is that he was born of woman. Being born of a human being, he could not be divine. Moreover, a child is known to inherit some of the prominent traits of the physical and moral make-up of its parent. Jesus being born of a woman, must have inherited her nature and her qualities and so he could not be God.

    Again, being human he was like other human beings, subject to the natural laws of hunger and of satisfying it by taking food and he was subject also to the natural phenomena that ensue.

    Finally, Jesus, who is looked upon as God, had no power to do either harm or good to any person. He could not, rather cannot, hear prayers nor does he know the needs of men that he may satisfy them; for it is Allah alone Who is All hearing, All knowing.

    Abu Khurshid.

    To Jawad Sultan:

    Why did the Jews reject Jesus at his time?

  30. avatar Tariq says:

    I think all these things should be ended after this clear statement on this situation in today’s like shining Sun on mid day and decisive Friday’s Sermon by His Holiness Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad Khalifa Masih the 5th.

Comment on “Ahmadiyya”.

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