Pribumi Business

November 2nd, 2007, in Business & Economy, by Patung

Kalla on “native” entrepreneurs as against Chinese.

Vice president Jusuf Kalla said to a meeting of ethnic Bugis businessmen in Makassar, South Sulawesi, on 27th October that the numbers of “native” Indonesian (pribumi) businessmen had to rise but that in order to bring this about the government would not actively discriminate against ethnic Chinese businessmen, who are traditionally dominant.

I’ve got lots of Chinese business friends and partners, and I don’t discriminate against them, but if things just stay the way they are the country is not balanced.

The situation was not improving, with the rate of increase among Chinese businessmen outpacing that for native businessmen, and the end result of this would be social instability, he said.

Jusuf Kalla

The government had to continue to encourage entrepreneurship, but without discriminating against anyone, he said.

The government was a partner of businessmen, because it took 30% of their profits in taxation, he said, and so it had an interest in seeing business thrive. [1] Kalla said that shortly the waiting time for business operating licenses would be reduced from 150 days to 25. [2]

He also advised those present to guard against the danger of foreign interests taking too large a share in national industries. If foreigners owned too much, then economic growth would become stagnant, he said. [3]

Tags: Bugis, Businessmen, Chinese, Jusuf Kalla, Pribumi

44 Comments on “Pribumi Business”

wongcilik Says:
November 2nd, 2007 at 1:08 pm
There is nothing wrong with Kalla’s statements, balance is indeed needed for the future prosperous Indonesia maju. However law enforcement should be inplaced to prosecute the pribumi businessman linkage to Kalla who created catasthrope like in Porong mud volcano, we want justice, we want the responsible conglomerate close to Kalla to pay damages first. Our cabinet can not approve the usage of APBN to pay for the multi bilion USD infrastructure reconstruction in Porong, it is uang rakyat, yes our taxpay money - it is not supposed to pay the damage created by a private company PT. Lapindo, at first the Lapindo and the parent companies must pay the damages to rebuild the infrastructure & declare them as ‘banckrupt companies’ to be suspended from Oil & Gas operation indefinetly and bring the ‘pribumi owners’ into court justice. Is that happening ?? Then the remaining unpaid balance with the approval from parliament, together we can justify to spend a portion of APBN for rebuild the destruction in Porong area. Talk is cheap, we want proof, actions (no NATO) that Kalla is clean, profesional & capable leader to lead Indonesia maju
Tinkerbell Says:
November 2nd, 2007 at 6:05 pm
I don’t think Kalla is capable to lead :>
wongcilik Says:
November 2nd, 2007 at 6:29 pm
Will you agree to approve using APBN to pay damages which were caused / initiated by a private PT. LAPINDO which the parent companies are linkaged to those ministers in our cabinet?
Cukurungan Says:
November 2nd, 2007 at 6:55 pm
Why we don’t agree in the past “uang rakyat” used to pay BLBI stolen by “yellow cukong” at this time we will use it to pay for a mess made by”brown cukong”…and for sure you are not wong cilik but only pretending to becomes one of them.
Anita McKay Says:
November 2nd, 2007 at 10:19 pm
I’m much more concern about Indonesian assets or companies are now owned by foreigners. Bank Danamon, Lippo Bank and BII are now belong to Singaporean. Excelcom is now Malaysian company. I’m sure there are many more similar cases now (have we bought Indosat back from Singapore?). Rather than pushing ‘pribumi’ or ‘chinese’, why don’t we think “Indonesia” as a whole.
Tuan Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 1:00 am
Indonesia needs to do what Malaysia has done (or still doing) and implement affirmative action policies for the ethnic non-Chinese of Indonesia. Granted some might say it may be unfair or whatever, but as we say in America: “You have to crack an egg to make an omelette”.

~Tuan Indoneisan-American Muslim
Dragonwall Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 3:23 am
Before the mess how about, those using BLBI’s money like in the case the Dicki Iskandardinata, Abdul Gani (Ex Bank Duta and Garuda) Titiek (Bursa Efek), Mamiek (Pekerjaan Umum), Tommy S and the whole long list The ‘brown cukong” were no lesser than the “yellow cukong” so that you know. Behind every huge business there is a “brown cukong” the worst part is that the “brown cukong” created a mess considered to be a national catastrophe.

The south side fire in San Diego was declared a state of emergency. Has Sidoardjo been declared a state of emergency. Compare the magnitude to see the difference.

Whether who bought the company if of no importance at all because otherwise they will be left to rot (continued losses).

I once said for the BI to interferre and support the rupiahs is like dumping money into a bottomless hole. How did rupiahs fare? It hit 8400 once or twice and dip towards 8800. So how these economic academians had done was just a show of without anything concrete or proper actuarial work done in meticulate.

I just failed to understand a person with no political background, except some money, is able to lead the country. He should be supporting SBY by backing him up so that he doesn’t get diversified attention.

To what I see he is actually trying t attract public attention to gain support for his future endeavor. I doubt he will succeed if Sutiyoso plays successful contention.
Sylvester Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 4:58 am
Malaysia is a bad example of economic fairness. The policy was intended to improve the social welfare of the malays however it only works for a small part of them. Most of the malay, especially in villages still live in poverty. The money is corrupted everywhere similar to Indo in 90s. That’s why islamic radicals can flourish there. Malaysia will never beat Singapore, China, Taiwan, Korea, or Japan.

If Indo follow Malaysia, the only result is the economic disaster because most of the businessmen will withdraw the investment to other countries.

Back to Kalla statement, it is obvious he says like that since he is a pribumi businessman. The policy would make him richer.
heavenlysword Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 6:46 am
Kalla, where have you been all this time? This country is so corrupted that even my 12yo nephew knows that this country isn’t balanced at all.

He seems pretty retarded to me. It’s like.. “duh, what should I say to the public for this week.. oh I know let’s dig up some super old news.. I mean people are dumb and I’m genius.. what could go wrong with that..”

I’ve never heard him saying something genius, clever and thoughtover. And boy he’s our vice president

The government had to continue to encourage entrepreneurship, but without discriminating against anyone, he said.

The key is education mr vice president. Encouraging is useless if they don’t have the skill required.
Pakmantri Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 10:31 am
Sylvester said:

Back to Kalla statement, it is obvious he says like that since he is a pribumi businessman. The policy would make him richer.

And he is almost at the end of his vice presidency, i.e. going back to business; has to protect his interest in the future when he is not “pejabat pemerintah” anymore eh ………….
wongcilik Says:
November 3rd, 2007 at 5:35 pm
hi Indonesians, when our cabinet will release APBN (state budget) money for paying the massive restructuring of Sidoarjo/Porong damages caused by PT LAPINDO’s mud-volcano catasthrope, then lets ignore & avoid to pay TAX at all ! it is non sense to nurture honesty & integrity to voluntarily pay Indonesian Taxes invoices when the elites fail to convince their profesionalism in managing ‘uang rakyat’ (our taxpayer’s money) !!!
BLBI money was a definitive amount of financial losses (caused by ORBA corrupted system) while the level of destruction in Porong is ‘un-immaginable’ & morally destruct Porong people which is uncompensable & unrecoverable and it can be indefinitely destroyed. SUDAH JELAS BEDANYA ?
iamisaid Says:
November 4th, 2007 at 7:35 pm
May God forbid that the Indonesia should consider anything similar to what Malaysia has done when their Government implemented the New Economic Policy in 1971.

The fundementals for Malaysia’s New Economic Policy is aimed at upgrading the Malaysian “Bumiputra” (akin to what is Pribumi in Indonesia). 36 years later, the Government insists that the Policy has not achieved its aims which then changes it’s name into the Never Ending Policy.

It is a forgone fact that the common Bumiputra has benefit little to improve their economic stature. In reality, the N.E.P. has been a perfect manipulative and discriminative tool for personal avarice of those in power to remain in power.

Economic progress is achieved by being industrious. It is not achieved through Government hand-outs and discrimatory policies.
Tuan Says:
November 4th, 2007 at 10:53 pm
Malaysia is a bad example of economic fairness. The policy was intended to improve the social welfare of the malays however it only works for a small part of them. Most of the malay, especially in villages still live in poverty. The money is corrupted everywhere similar to Indo in 90s. That’s why islamic radicals can flourish there. Malaysia will never beat Singapore, China, Taiwan, Korea, or Japan.

No one said anything in life is fair. Like I said..sometimes you need to crack an egg to make omlette. Anyhow where is your source that the money is corrupted? while Malaysia will never beat Singapore, China, Taiwan, Korea, or Japan.. IT WILL DEFINITELY BEAT INDONESIA. As I recall, some have mentioned that some companies in Indonesia are owned by Malaysia.

~Tuan - Indonesian American Muslim
Dragonwall Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 2:52 am
So Indonesian American stands for someone who is Indonesian and living in America?

Lets see how good you are with this.

Are you able to name a source on Indonesian corrupt money? If you say you know then you new absolutely nothing about corruption, mass manipulation and siphoning of funds.

Everyone knows that when someone starts a fire, all other starts pouring gasoline with no one to put out the fire. Then fingers starts pointing to every direction without any proof. Gradually it dies a natural cause.

I suppose you lack the knowledge by saying that.

Anyhow where is your source that the money is corrupted?

Do you know who approve the project Genting Casino Resort? And with whose blessing? Do you know why was it approve? Do you know who gets the cut of the pie? And do you know why Anwar was sent to the slammer?

If you could then you would have the answer right before your eyes. And if you can’t, then don’t speculate on the fact. Because Mahatir is one of the dirtiest politician I have seen so far if you were to review what he had done then you will be able to find out how it started and ended with his croonies.

Would you dare to challenge Mahatir into disclosing his personal assets? And many many other Malaysian politicians who were tied to UMNO.

One more thing

No one said anything in life is fair

When you run a country the policy have to be fair and has nothing to do with a person’s life.
Dragonwall Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 3:08 am
What JK is trying to do is something quite similar to what Mahatir had done. Following his footsteps all the way.

There were may entities that have been established to benefits the pris in Indonesia since the ORBA and it is no news anymore. It is the failure to appreciate that cause the misuse linking organizations like Yayasan Trikora, Dwikora, Supersemar to fail badly. But he is also following the sootsteps of Adi Sasono with his failed projects causing substantial and unaccountable loss to the country.

SO THAT YOU KNOW THE TRICK. THIS IS HOW YOU STRIP THE STATE COFFER BONE DRY…..
Tuan Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 3:28 am
So Indonesian American stands for someone who is Indonesian and living in America?

???? I take it that English is not your first language. I am an American who is of Indonesian heritage. Is that what you are trying to say?

Do you know who approve the project Genting Casino Resort? And with whose blessing? Do you know why was it approve? Do you know who gets the cut of the pie? And do you know why Anwar was sent to the slammer?

If you could then you would have the answer right before your eyes. And if you can’t, then don’t speculate on the fact. Because Mahatir is one of the dirtiest politician I have seen so far if you were to review what he had done then you will be able to find out how it started and ended with his croonies.

Would you dare to challenge Mahatir into disclosing his personal assets? And many many other Malaysian politicians who were tied to UMNO.

As I said before.. sometimes you have to crack an egg to make an omlette, and the ends justify means and the end result is Malaysia surpassing Indonesia economically.

~Tuan Indonesian-American Muslim
Idam H. Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 7:25 am
I am a pribumi, working with the government and has many pribumi and chinese businessmen. What I know, our government discriminates against the Indonesian-Chinese. It is hard for them, in general, to work in public sector. Therefore, for their survival, they have to concentrate to work in private sector. There are cases where Indonesian-Chinese can be bureaucrats but they are extraordinary cases.

At the same time, we, as pribumi, love to work with the government. Most of the smart pribumi would work for the corrupt government leaving only for less-educated pribumi doing business.

The quality of the people will determine their domination in a sector. No wonder Indonesian-Chinese control the economy.

Give every people from any ethnicity the same opportunity in any sector, the problem will diminish over time.

Another thing, Indonesian-Chinese also Indonesian people. Why do we always make a differentiation between Chinese and pribumi. Historically, just as Chinese-Indonesians, pribumi are not indegenous people of Indonesia and most probably our ancestors are also Chinese (Yunan). So, Chinese and pribumi distinction is just the root of hate crimes in the name of economy.

Worldly, the ends justify the means, but Godly, the means and the ends should be justified.
Cukurungan Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 8:31 am
BLBI money was a definitive amount of financial losses (caused by ORBA corrupted system) while the level of destruction in Porong is ‘un-immaginable’ & morally destruct Porong people which is uncompensable & unrecoverable and it can be indefinitely destroyed. SUDAH JELAS BEDANYA ?

Your statement is correct if we see the matter with a satellite imaging but with our naked eye, I can clearly see that there are still many “Yellow Cukong” on the run with their stolen money.

In this real life some time we have only a limited option between bad and worst…yes our “brown cukong” is bad but unlike “yellow cukong”…they will never leave us to migrate either to Hongkong or Singapure and using their stolen money to stab in our economy from behind (notice that most Singapore take over on Indo Companies were using those stolen money) and the impact is very huge and Indo Economy will be bleeding forever.

…” JELAS BEDANYA” You are not “Wong Cilik” and sorry we have to upset you because we prefer to give privilege to “brown cukong” than “yellow cukong” to keep and collect easy money from the oil and gas business”¦..but “kami tidak pelit” …we still give “Mafia Singapore and Yellow Cukong” chance to play with Pertamina on our Crude Oil Import

At the same time, we, as pribumi, love to work with the government. Most of the smart pribumi would work for the corrupt government leaving only for less-educated pribumi doing business.

This is most ridicules statement, how dare you claim your self and most government employer are a smart person….if you and other government employer are the smart one, we will never becoming play grown for “yellow cukong” and Singaporean.

Sorry “¦you are correct”¦.that you are smart in manipulating “Uang rakyat”
Idam H. Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 9:23 am
This is most ridicules statement, how dare you claim your self and most government employer are a smart person”¦.if you and other government employer are the smart one, we will never becoming play grown for “yellow cukong” and Singaporean.

Well, smart does not mean that they don’t like dirty money. Do you think smart people are more ethical than stupid people? You are wrong my friend. They are human being, who love more money and develop schemes to make them hard to be vindicted as corrupted officials. I am inside the government. For what I see, government officials are very clever in taking people’s money for themselves. Money talks. Kwik Kian Gie is right when he talked about a rampant corruption in the government but it is hard for him to prove it because most evidences of corruption have been eliminated by the corruptors. Those “cukong”, whether they are yellow or brown, are also smart people. They work together, with cukongs inside the government, to develop flows of money to themselves and to police, justice, and even KPK. The term “korupsi berjamaah” is actually the right term of corruption in our country.

Are more ethical people doing nothing with this situation? No, they are not. It is difficult to develop a tracking system of money flow to enable them to show where the corrupt money would go. For example, it has been six years for some good Tax officers to develop a national identity number to enable them to track people’s money (of course mostly for tax purpose but it can be used for other investigation purpose). Their proposal cannot go through as many high-ranking officers and parliamentary members successfully stopped the proposal in their hand.

Let me tell you one fact from inside the goverment. Based on the research done by government auditors, almost 98% of government employees involve in legally structured but corrupted money. So, if you have relatives who are working for government and they ever gave you money, you have a great chance to consume corrupted money. The most corrupted organization is sadly not Finance Department or the Police or even the Court. The first rank is for Religious Affairs Department. The second rank is Education Department. But again, those good auditors cannot do anything because they use the same scheme as Soeharto did, develop the regulation for the legally take corrupted money and use the money in activities that leave almost no traces of evidences.

Why I say pribumi working in government are smarter because I have the result of a study that during Soeharto’s regime the the students ranked among the highest in their high school class would either living abroad (because they had a chance to go abroad when they got scholarships) or working with the government via government-funded (kedinasan) schools.

And again, you must be unable to believe that almost all government employees doing some schemes of corruption. This is because, I would say, we are smarter than the rest of the society.

Here is an example why only smart people can catch smart corrupt government (but only the most stupid one in the government). The story of KPU highlights this. The KPU officer handling the money, the BPK auditor who is forced to trap this officer, and the head of KPK team arranging this trap come from the same Kedinasan school (the officer graduated from the earlier kedinasan school). Mulyana Kusumah, who are the professor of criminology, is caught in the middle of this corrupted scheme. Isn’t that ironic, the one who supposed to be the expert in criminal thing ended up become the victim of white-collar crime.
Cukurungan Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 10:16 am
Idam H. Said:

And again, you must be unable to believe that almost all government employees doing some schemes of corruption. This is because, I would say, we are smarter than the rest of the society.

Cukurungan :

I would say “Urat Malu Anda” already broken because to manipulate uang rakyat don’t need to becomes a genius what you need to do just cut your “urat malu”…very….very easy…. in Indonesia …..there’s a million easy way to manipulate uang rakyat..you just name it…. SPJ, Uang Dinas, Study Banding, Fake Tender, Uang Siluman for Vendors Invoices, Tender, Permit Letters, Inspection ..Fake Project ….certification …etc..etc..endless list.

Most our Rakyat are not less smart than you but they don’t have a chances as your.
wongcilik Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 10:18 am
Cuk seems have suffer in an accute suspicious syndrome against ‘orang Cina Keturunan & maybe all World wide chinese people’. To me it is not relevant Cuk, my point to Jusuf Kalla was remain the same, he must act & let public aware that he is a profesional leader. At his high senior officer rank, he must show a national character without taking a side to any races in economy benefits. That’s all, so your negative tendency toward chinese are not a relevant matter to me, I am sorry
Idam H. Says:
November 5th, 2007 at 11:13 am
To Cukurungan:

Yes it a sad true. I am ashamed of myself being a government official. I am forced by the system to take the money but I am able to limit the “haram” money at the minimum amount possible. You must think that I should leave my position then to let other people take the chance. If I can I will do that but I cannot. I have a mandatory work since I am funded by the government for my education.

I tell you the real thing does not mean that I am willingly to do those corrupt things. Everybody in my office is doing some schemes of corruption. Nobody never receive corrupted money. In the rank of sin: some acknowledge it and try to minimize it, some acknowledge it and try to maximize it, and the biggest sin is some who don’t acknowledge it (believe that it is legal) and of course they try to maximize it. I acknowledge that it is corrupted money and if I have the authority I would minimize it. Some small types of corruptions I cannot avoid, such as having free lunch, receiving a small gift as THR, late to work, do nothing at the office. For this ’small’ sins I cannot be proud of myself although I can prevent some of my bosses getting easy money from the projects I administered. Since I do not want to cooperate, my boss always put my in the research and education duty. But again I am no saint, at least I tell the reality and acknowledge my wrongdoings.

My point with this discussion is that you cannot blame yellow cukong for their corrupt business. They do that because pribumi in the government also do that. They are complement to each other. Those yellow cukongs only got a jackpot in billions or even trillions of rupiahs after several years of doing corrupt business but our brown bureaucrats got a steady flow of corrupted money in billions every year. One thing you should know, those yellow cukongs do not take all the money to themselves, they also distribute the money to bureaucrats, to their brown managers who are smart enough to develop the corrupted scheme of business.
Andrew Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 12:15 am
As I said before.. sometimes you have to crack an egg to make an omlette, and the ends justify means and the end result is Malaysia surpassing Indonesia economically.

The problem with that statement is one: oversimplification. Malaysia has a different set of issues, which are far less in magnitude than Indonesia’s. And you think that policy alone will solve most of Indonesia’s problems?

Talking about cracking eggs, why don’t YOU crack YOUR eggs, if you have any…
Arema Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 9:48 am
Idam, I just want to thank you for your posts in this forum, especially in this thread. They have been an eye-opener, uplifting, and definitely make my day. They have been a blessing, really.

I thank God that there is still someone like you in the government. Please continue to be a good influence among your colleagues, so through you, probably things can get better, at least in your department. I pray that you stay strong in your struggle to resist the huge wave of temptation to corrupt in a “supportive environment”.

Back to topic,

Another thing, Indonesian-Chinese also Indonesian people. Why do we always make a differentiation between Chinese and pribumi. Historically, just as Chinese-Indonesians, pribumi are not indegenous people of Indonesia and most probably our ancestors are also Chinese (Yunnan). So, Chinese and pribumi distinction is just the root of hate crimes in the name of economy.

Exactly. My body Chinese-Indonesian (sorry I can’t choose to have a different body) but my heart is 100% Indonesian. I am sad to be regarded as not-so-Indonesian by the “earlier inhabitants” although most probably we both came from the same land, China.

And as a vice-president, it is a shameful comment by Jusuf Kalla. He may have a point, but it is such a disgrace that his point does not matter anymore.
Tuan Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 10:08 am
The problem with that statement is one: oversimplification. Malaysia has a different set of issues, which are far less in magnitude than Indonesia’s. And you think that policy alone will solve most of Indonesia’s problems?

Talking about cracking eggs, why don’t YOU crack YOUR eggs, if you have any”¦

How civilized ..personal attacks :). Save those when you are losing an argument, my man. In any case, desperate times call for desperate measures, or forever relegate your country as third rate subordinate behind powerhouses such as Korea, Singapore, or Malaysia.

~Tuan - Indonesian-American Muslim
Arema Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 10:33 am
In any case, desperate times call for desperate measures, or forever relegate your country as third rate subordinate behind powerhouses such as Korea, Singapore, or Malaysia.

Man… you surely know little about Malaysia. They do looks good from external point of view, but actually the internal problems are mounting. It is good that a fairly good leader is leading the country now. They do seem to be a lot better than Indonesia, but to say that they are one of those powerhouses, especially at this moment, is an extreme overstatement.
Tuan Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 10:56 am
They may not be a powerhouse but they are definitely doing better than Indonesia.

~Tuan - Indonesian-American Muslim
Pena Budaya Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 1:22 pm
From Idam H.: Yes it a sad true. I am ashamed of myself being a government official. I am forced by the system to take the money but I am able to limit the “haram” money at the minimum amount possible. You must think that I should leave my position then to let other people take the chance. If I can I will do that but I cannot. I have a mandatory work since I am funded by the government for my education.

I tell you the real thing does not mean that I am willingly to do those corrupt things. Everybody in my office is doing some schemes of corruption. Nobody never receive corrupted money.

I am sorry to say that this is still unacceptable. You are, perhaps, one of those officials who easily received overseas scholarship on behalf of the state and Indonesian people (I know many young Indonesians who were studying very hard to get overseas scholarship but unable to get any due to quotas applied for state officials) who ended in corruption circle. Yes, it is shameful.

Like Mahatma Gandhi says, “Be the change you want to see in the world.” If you want your office to change then start with yourself. Let’s see how many will follow you.

Like Margaret Mead (and my favorite quote) said: “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever does”
falcon Says:
November 6th, 2007 at 4:04 pm
If every single person stands equal in front of the law and the regulation, the racial divide would not be as apparent. If the VP was a Chinese, the Pribumis would applaud him for his remarks. Not all Chinese are business people, they are also excellent workers not more and not less than the Pribumi but they unlikely become PNS. Many of the Chinese are business people because the limited choice available and this has been going on for hundred of years. Many Chinese Business People were poor just a few decades ago and some became conglomerates and many just regular business people. The Indonesian Chinese business are engaged in manufacturing and trading. Trading is done with the Chinese Singaporean, most likely as the Sole agent holders for Asia. Chinese Singaporean will unlikely deal with Pribumis, the probability is one to a million unless they are dealing with powerful government officials. The Chinese Indonesia would like to be called Tionghoa which means the OLD COUNTRY. Every where around the world the Chinese are called Chinese even if they are from Taiwan, Singapore or Hongkong. For example if a Chinese in the US its called “a person from the old country”, she or he most likely would be insulted. Here in Indonesia they have to be called people from the old country, is it not Indonesia their country. Nothing is wrong with name “orang china” is their human rights being violated. Now every Chinese are taking mandarin lesson because they would like to do business with the Chinese abroad and how about Pribumis, may be they also need to learn Mandarin. Do we all think that the main land Chinese think differently of the Chinese Indonesia, most likely they loved our money and business opportunity and because we are warm hearted and do not have harsh life like they once had. So it is politically correct for Vice President J. Kalla to air this issue and instead letting the issue stand still like a time bomb which has to be avoided at any cost.
Dragonwall Says:
November 7th, 2007 at 6:50 am
I see that Idam H to be rational in admitting what must be done and what he had done. Because it will better put us on better talking term.

As to

???? I take it that English is not your first language. I am an American who is of Indonesian heritage. Is that what you are trying to say?

Simply by looking at this will tell me that you english needs more polishing.

I asked

So Indonesian American stands for someone who is Indonesian and living in America?

What has your heritage got to do with me! I didn’t ask for the heritage. This is to ascertain you know what you are talking.

As I said before.. sometimes you have to crack an egg to make an omlette, and the ends justify means and the end result is Malaysia surpassing Indonesia economically.

Of course a small kid also knows that you need to crack an egg to make an omelette and not just sometimes. Or perhaps you don’t, like having the chicken to lay the egg omelette ready! Like David copperfield!

So you understand the whole meaning instead of bringing words upside down.

WHAT I AM TRYING TO SAY IS THAT THE MALAYSIAN MALAY POLITICIANS ARE EVEN MORE CORRUPT.

we will never becoming play grown for “yellow cukong” and Singaporean

You should get the Indonesian government to shut off all foreign investments rather than to say others using Indonesia as their playground. This is the thinking of a pea brain.

Oh. One more thing don’t forget that you admitted that you stole from your company because you followed what those foreigners did, remember what you said! and that disqualify you from commenting things about corruption or anything tht is haram.
Cukurungan Says:
November 8th, 2007 at 7:55 am
Exactly. My body Chinese-Indonesian (sorry I can’t choose to have a different body) but my heart is 100% Indonesian. I am sad to be regarded as not-so-Indonesian by the “earlier inhabitants” although most probably we both came from the same land, China.

Do not too exaggerate last month I visited my parent in “Gunung Kawi” everything is intact like before….Mosque and Kelentheng are still stand together while brown men, yellow men, brown women and yellow women are mingle and doing business and ritual together on their own style as usual”¦and if I am not mistaken one of our ancestor buried there also married with “Chinese Lady”

You should get the Indonesian government to shut off all foreign investments rather than to say others using Indonesia as their playground. This is the thinking of a pea brain.

Desperate response from a disparate man

You can not deny a facts that illegal logging, crude oil smuggling, corruption money, pasir laut smuggling are always being cleaned in Singapore but I also agree that it is not totally their fault because they can not do that if Brown Man in our government is smart.
Our brown man in Goverment is only “Pencuri Kelas Kampung” what they can do just steal “Uang Rakyat Sendiri” they has no capability to launch “Transnational Corruption” or take the money from other country.

Oh. One more thing don’t forget that you admitted that you stole from your company because you followed what those foreigners did, remember what you said! and that disqualify you from commenting things about corruption or anything tht is haram.

Many thank Gentleman that you admitted “Cukurungan Wonderful” I amazed that you never forget …dot & koma..what I said….yes once upon time, I stole the money from the company but this is not “APBN” or “Uang Rakyat”…If I did not take those money, it will go to overseas anyway. I just stole the money from the hijacker (according fraud theory “a corruptor has to make their own justification to justify “their corrupt action”)

And remember I am qualified and has rights to say anything because I am only the one in this world holder a title of “Dukun Engineer”.

WHAT I AM TRYING TO SAY IS THAT THE MALAYSIAN MALAY POLITICIANS ARE EVEN MORE CORRUPT.

Again thank you for the crystal clear evidence to what I said “Pribumi corruption is dangerous but Yellow Cukong Betrayal is even worst”¦as you said Malay Politicians is more ..more corrupt than Indo but the Malay economic was performing better than us because their money is not going anywhere and the Malay corrupted money was still driving Malay Economy, in other hand our economy was cripple so quickly because the money has gone to Singapore and Fukian”¦and thing get even worst because those money has been used by them to further tap-in into the artery line of our economy.
Dragonwall Says:
November 9th, 2007 at 4:11 am
This is the obssession of self proclaimed dukun engineer of banana land saying

Yellow Cukong Betrayal

and that your ancestors were once married to a Chinese girl?

And also I suppose the Islamic Religion that says that if you stole, whether from who it or where it is, it does not matter, You had committed a sin and that is haram?

Munafik.
Sputjam Says:
November 13th, 2007 at 11:16 pm
I cannot understand why a malaysian gambling giant company “genting” has to be dragged into this discussion. The founder of genting was born in china. he started the gambling company in his fifties and proposed to the then PM of Malaysia Tun abdul razak, his ideas.
His board meetings are conducted in malay, out of respect, although the majority are non-malay. When star cruise was formed (listed on hong kong stock exchange) he sailed on one of his cruise liners back to his “kampung’ in fujian province in china. genting employs thousands at their resort, bumi and non-bumi alike. most are from the rural areas in pahang state.
Genting, like many well managed malaysian companies, have expanded overseas, including UK, and australia, singapore and they are still trying to get on board in macau. All these was done with minimum government assistance. Unfortunately for genting, their workers at the gambling table are pinched by competitors in macau and soon singapore, due to higher pay offered, and the ability for non-bumi malaysian to speak in three languages and two chinese (sometimes three) dialects. Non-bumi malaysian have become global by accident, while their bumi counterpart recently complained that learning science and mathematics in english should be reversed. in other words, the malays in malaysia have become pampered and cannot even comprehend a single language, never mind two. the worst part is, due to NEP, the government is simply lowering the level of education for the malays in order for them to obtain higher education.
My personal opinion is that NEP is a failure because it made malays dependent on the government. Upon finishing their studies, they get jobs in govenrment departments or listed covenrment companies such a Tenaga or telkom. And these companies are bloated with these scholars as the government have no other place to dump them. So a job that can be done in days by two people, takes months by several committees.
the ruling party knows that the malays are dependent on their assistance and the malays are “addicted” to the assistance. Hence power abuse and corrupt practices are ignored as long as the malays get their little assistance in the form of underperforming schools and scholarships and higher education for their children.

Unfortunately, there is too much malays getting questionable degrees from universities and are not able to get a job. Since they are taught in the malay language, they are more or less useless for the task in the private sector which uses either english or mandarin.

In this case, the malays are now dragging the economy of malaysia down, whilst their non-malay counterpart finds jobs easily in the global market place. due to NEP, foreign investors are wary of sharing 30% of their compnay to bumiputras and invest elsewhere. same can be said of local non-bumi companies. hence the KLSE is a shadow of its glory years and is having a tough time attracting interests as even locals find it easier listing in London, hong kong or singapore.

And yet, many malays do not understand just how economy works. Some are asking for more share in a shringking pie (more than 30%).

For indonesia, best to minimise regulation and anyone (local or foreigner) who wants to invest, will have their interest protected by the government. forget about affirmative action. It encourages mediocrity. A higher standard should be set for the bumis to achieve in education. instead of spending money in building universities (too many worldwide), indonesia should instead initiate schooling at a younger age, say 4 years old, and by sixteen, the graduate of this education system should be a person full of confidence with multiple language ability and can be marketable worldwide. spending money on higher education is worthless in more than 95% of jobs. Best concentrate in improving the majority’s ability then the remaining 5%. former CEO of HKSB started work as a clerk and learned through experience. during his term, HKSB expanded worlwide, probably by using common sense and and not “new managemtn terminologies’ that is rife in todays modern board meetings filled with graduates world over. (due to these new terminologies, risky mortgages in USA are called by some fancy names which caught investors by their billions and third world countries are rephrased as “emerging markets”)

nothing can beat good fundamentals and common sense. indonesia should follow this path.
iamisaid Says:
November 13th, 2007 at 11:35 pm
Clap! clap! clap!

Well said Sputjam.
Pakmantri Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 1:27 am
Sputjam said:

………………. instead of spending money in building universities (too many worldwide), Indonesia should instead initiate schooling at a younger age, say 4 years old, and by sixteen, the graduate of this education system should be a person full of confidence with multiple language ability and can be marketable worldwide. spending money on higher education is worthless in more than 95% of jobs. Best concentrate in improving the majority’s ability then the remaining 5% ………………..

Agreed, we should build more trade schools, polytechnics and apprenticeship programs for our youths. Shorter program but when they graduated they are ready to work and be productive. If they wanted a degree, they can get it after they work in continuing education classes at the universities, part-time, full-time or online.
It’s been proven work well; look at Germany, how fast they recover and become a powerhouse after world war 2.
Dragonwall Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 4:36 am
What you have said seems quite reasonable but

lowering the level of education for the malays in order for them to obtain higher education

Is like to make a question simpler so that they understand and pass the exam will attain higher education level?

Not that dragging Genting into the picture but, a comparison in corruption matter. Do they exist?
1. Malaysia is an Islamic State, in majority votes, that had leashed the Sharia Law.
2. So does that make gambling, though legally, it’s haram right!
3. TAR had in one way or another proposed and someone who might have brought the
subject up and they agreed to that. It’s good, the country prosper. On condition
right! Building a resort, hotels, roads, amenities, environmental facilities etc..
4. Who are the people involves beside share holders?

So the topic discussed was all about Corruption, Nepotism, Cronysm and how bad that was comparing to Indonesia.
Arema Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 8:39 am
*standing ovation*

marvelously written post, Sputjam!

For indonesia, best to minimise regulation and anyone (local or foreigner) who wants to invest, will have their interest protected by the government. forget about affirmative action. It encourages mediocrity. A higher standard should be set for the bumis to achieve in education. instead of spending money in building universities (too many worldwide), indonesia should instead initiate schooling at a younger age, say 4 years old, and by sixteen, the graduate of this education system should be a person full of confidence with multiple language ability and can be marketable worldwide. spending money on higher education is worthless in more than 95% of jobs. Best concentrate in improving the majority’s ability then the remaining 5%. former CEO of HKSB started work as a clerk and learned through experience. during his term, HKSB expanded worlwide, probably by using common sense and and not “new managemtn terminologies’ that is rife in todays modern board meetings filled with graduates world over. (due to these new terminologies, risky mortgages in USA are called by some fancy names which caught investors by their billions and third world countries are rephrased as “emerging markets”)

nothing can beat good fundamentals and common sense. indonesia should follow this path.

I agree on this.

1) Mastery of multiple languages is one of those highly sought after skills today, and I believe it will remain to be like that for generations to come.
2) Strengthening the fundamentals is much more important than higher education, I find this especially true on myself. I’m solving most engineering issues in my company with just high school knowledge and common sense. Without a strong fundamentals, it is difficult to learn higher level knowledge effectively anyway, and in the end students are just memorizing for exams, and the knowledge last for 3 days.
3) I am feeling the same way with you about the “new terminologies”. I asked my friend who work in a bank, and the simple term “curve gradient” can have several different terms, depends on the usage. I find it absurd, and get the impression that they are just making their own life difficult.
Cukurungan Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Sputjam said:

For indonesia, best to minimise regulation and anyone (local or foreigner) who wants to invest, will have their interest protected by the government.

Cukurungan:

No single country in this world’s could transform their self to become a modern and Industrial Country by relying on the foreign investment

Korea, Taiwan and Japan and even US have been able to transform to become a fully developed country because of their Government heavy protection at that time upon theirs babies industry against the free Market competition by adopting High Tariff import and some affirmative regulations to boost their Indigenous Enterprenour

And now those advanced country is hiding behind “free trade agreement ” or ODA were asking to the under developed countries to open our market so they can dump product of their industry while retain heavily subsidized farming to protect their farmers with some ridiculous reason.

Sputjam said:

A higher standard should be set for the bumis to achieve in education. instead of spending money in building universities (too many worldwide), indonesia should instead initiate schooling at a younger age, say 4 years old, and by sixteen, the graduate of this education system should be a person full of confidence with multiple language ability and can be marketable .

Cukurungan :

Philipine has done so but why nothing a big phenomenon development or progress going in there.
iamisaid Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Regarding the Sputjam - Cungkurang discourse above, here is my 2 cent or for whatever it is worth. LOL !

Whilst the Internet and in particular blogsites has its boon for users, let us agree that it is not possible to expound with the same ease and clarity as when compared to sitting around a discussion table.

Of course, opinions can be met with equally opposite promptings.

The ability to transcend personal thinking and be able to reason the logic that is presented within is more gainful rather than splitting hairs.
Sputjam Says:
November 15th, 2007 at 11:17 pm
for a country to develop, two things matter :-

a) sound government policy
b) human capital capability

Saudi is a rich country, but it cannot be considered as a developed one.
North Korea is poor, but its government policy sucks. Its human resource is something else. If it has sound government, it will only be a matter of time before it catches up with the rest of the world.

there are many rich developed nations with little or no resources. this includes japan, south korea, taiwan, and many europeans states such as france, spain, denmark, netherlands and italy.

germany and britain were blessed with abundant coal which fueled the industrial revolution. without ita human capiyal capability, it would have become like saudi arabia. but due to the inventiveness and creativity and hardworking population, they were able to become industrial mights.

similarly, there are numerous coal fields in indoneisa (kalimantan), but this are mainly for export to countries with huge human resource assets. The countries that buy coal from indonesia uses it to fuel their power plants, which then powers their industrial machinery.

For countries like singapore, Foreign direct investments are used as a short cut to propel it to developed status. If there is a computer chip making plant owned by a multinaltional in a country, there are numerous avenues for “trickling down effect’ to local businesses to prosper from sub-contract work. On the malaysian KLSE alone, there are sveral companies listed based solely on jobs obtained from FDi’s such as intel and AMD. similarly in singapore.

china cannot be considered as poor countries because of the potential of their human resources. And coupled with the present sound policies of the govenrment, they are on the verge of becoming the largest economy in the world.

initially, britain, US , japan and south korea had a protected economy. Their major manufacturers were protected by tariff barriers which hinders trade. But they learnt that opening of barriers increases economic activity, and increasing economic activity increases wealth.

so these developed countries are always trying to increase buisnesses, because it pays. britain does not care if they have no local car manufacturer anymore, but due to their sound policies, multinationals such as toyota, nissan, BMW and ford have taken over these places.
nor does britain care if a foreigner were to take over their industrial companies or even their football clubs. some football clubs are played entirely by foreigners. The important thing is that these clubs remain succesful, and succesful cubs bring in the money and enhances economic activity down the line. economic activity creates oppotunities for the population to become rich. Rich countries does not depend on industrial might alone, they encouraged tourism (No.1 industry in france with 60 million visitors per year and probably britain), sports (EPL every saturday night in south east asia while our local players are paid peanuts due to lousy policies of sports administrators), leisure like golf clubs and yachting, movies, hobbies and anything eslse that will encourage the money to spread from one hand to the other. economy cannot grow if population does not spend. The more movement of money in a country, the more chances and opportunities for the masses to make money.

taking indonesia as an example, there are 200 million people languishing unproductively in the country. there are probably numerous with talents such as in sports, or mathemetics or dance/arts/music, but these talents will not be found due to unsound administration. I think when it come to industriousness and enthusiasm for work, indonesia and indeed the malay community everywhere has to acknowledge that this ability is lacking. Otherwise, indonesia would have been at par with the people of japan. Maybe it is due to the climate, or genetics. But if our human resource capability is hopeless, dont blame the government if the natural resources runs out. Like the song by Michael jackson, “the man in the mirror”, look yourself in the mirror and take the first step to improve our work ethics, by maybe doing and extra approval for licenses per day, or making an extra products per day, or maybe by walking a littel bit faster. Try making others happy while imrpoving our productivity. sometimes these things help.
Cukurungan Says:
November 29th, 2007 at 8:16 pm
dragonwall said:

And also I suppose the Islamic Religion that says that if you stole, whether from who it or where it is, it does not matter, You had committed a sin and that is haram?
Munafik.

me :

However my Chinese dude told to me that there’s no haram money because money is always money….in after life the money is still required to bribe the hell officers to ease the hell torture
wongcilik Says:
November 30th, 2007 at 7:12 pm
wong cilik prihatin, so long as we as the pribumi keep on dwarfting other races’ capabilities & value while Indonesia were looked down by other countries in reality, it proves Indonesia will never prosper, lets get rid of our stupid ideology which prove unproductive 5 times sholat (is too much in my opinion) and incompatible with current world set up, I really mean it, how can we work properly if must pray every 4 hours ?
Dragonwall Says:
December 13th, 2007 at 4:02 am
However my Chinese dude told to me that there’s no haram money because money is always money”¦.in after life the money is still required to bribe the hell officers to ease the hell torture.

Perhaps your Chinese friends convert to Islam, no wonder. Money is however important in present and after life with a difference. This also demonstrate that your thinking were such that if someone tells you that it is right to rob Soeharto, or SBY you also agree to that. Does that make sense to you?

Each one must have their own interlect. I do suppose most of those in DPR, MPR, Ministers and Pejabats conceive the same perception. Sooner or later Indonesia will become hopeless, I guess.
Dylan Says:
May 4th, 2008 at 10:58 pm
The people now lacks the vision of Pancasila, especially after the reformation. We are a nation of “Bhineka tunggal Ika”, unity and diversity. Be it Chinese, native Indonesians, Indians, Arabs, Westerns, Japanese, and etc, what we need is generally “entrepreneurs”. We are modern enough not to differentiate people by their skin but by their morale, identity, and faith. I am a 17 year old boy and this is the view of my friends and I, so you “grown ups” go look in the mirror and start re-evaluating.