Feminism and Islam

May 22nd, 2007, in Society, by

Feminism is not suitable for Indonesian women.

Eny Dwiningsih, a professor at the Islam State University in Jakarta (UIJ), said in a seminar called "Developing Intellectual Interest in Womens' Issues" at the North Sumatra University in Medan on 18th May that Islam rejected feminism.

Feminism was dangerous to Islam because it was infused with the spirit of secularism, opposed to sharia law, and based on false assumptions, she said.

The secularised capitalist nations of the world had for a long time been attempting to force feminism on Muslims, in the name of womens' freedom, and they suggested that personal freedom generally was the answer to many problems, and that Islam was the source of the Islamic world's backwardness.

Faithful Muslim women were confused today and had lost their self-confidence and belief in their special roles in the family and society, and this showed that the secular capitalists had partly succeeded in their mission: republika

This is the target of the movement, that is, to cause Muslims to lose faith in the ability of Islam to answer the problems that women face.


163 Comments on “Feminism and Islam”

  1. avatar Nenek Sihir says:

    Achmad Sudarsono is clearly a troll. Why do you all persist in feeding it-ignore it and it will eventually go away and die under it’s bridge like all good trolls do, otherwise, a very interesting website!

  2. avatar Aluang Anak Bayang says:

    Achmad, when you opened a brothel, do IMer get any special discount? Or maybe a reward card for frequent visitor?

  3. avatar Ihaknt says:

    Guys, I can tolerate this Ono bin Moron on any topic, and I have on this one too to a certain point. But I can’t just turn a blind eye when the subject is about women and Mr. Bin Moron spits out demeaning comments. I stand up for my rights so I will argue with anyone if they demean women with their comments.

    You said Islam is about controlling ego? PAH! WUEK! It that was really the case, obviously the men are doing otherwise! Honor killing, raping children, women slavery, the list can go on. You contradict yourself. And please read again my previous comment and hi-light where I suggested to call P not a good Muslim woman? Hence I called you for slandering me. Because your comment was getting personal. You can’t can you? You’re the one who went off topic. And to ask your help on points of Islam? Puuuhlease, I’d rather watch DKI reruns. At least it’s entertaining!

  4. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    All My Friend,

    Let’s take this conversation forward. I’ve just had the guts to say in print, what we all, deep down in our hearts know to be true. We don’t want Indonesian women to grow beards, start wearing khaki dungarees, talking postmodernist nonsense all the time, stop shaving their ‘pits, and reading Virginia Woolfe. The Indonesian Woman treasures her femininity, even the swarthy, maid-faced ones from the village. (Sometimes, I think Ihaknt has just come from the village – or pretends to!:-))

    Friends, IM is a great forum for you to appreciate my writing and thoughts, and it’s fine for some to bandy around trendy but silly notions like feminism, but, seriously, please, it’s getting to the level of Dono, Kas- Indro. (A famous Indonesian comedy trio from the 1970s & 80s).

    Once Again, Friends, Achmad Tells It Like It Is ! (also on achmadtellsit.wordpres.com).

  5. avatar Janma says:

    Achmad. (I may start calling you Mad for short, it seems to fit.)

    You are talking out of your proverbial sir! Your ignorance on the subject of feminisim is clearly portrayed in your comment –

    “After all, this hairy-armpitted bra-burning has only been around since the 1960s. Islam’s been here since the 7th century. But most of all, this discussion, is focused on why feminism’s not suitable to Indonesian women.”

    Try looking up suffragette. Women have been fighting for their rights since the late 1800’s, not just since 1960. And if you want to claim superiority for Islam just because it’s been around since the 7th century, think again. Slavery and Prostitution have been around for thousands of years, does that mean they have more credibility than Islam too? What about Christianity? Longer by 500 years. You might want to check your logic.
    I believe in womens equal rights. I shave my body hair and go to the salon and never wear dungarees, so there goes your school boy generalizations. I also love to cook, I also run my own business and my husband respects my opinion as I respect his.
    You my friend are just a troll, not even amusing or entertaining. If you had a higher IQ you just might raise a smile out of me while you rubbish half of humanity and publicize your penchant for creating slaves out of your mother, wives and daughters, but until then, to me you are just ignorant and an example of all that is wrong with Islam and men with small penis.

    Janma

  6. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Janma Yth.

    Temper, temper, dear. Good thing there are no plates to throw 🙂 !! I suggest you keep your emotions under control and use the tool of rationality, not just getting all flustered. All I said were a few cast-away comments about beards, bra-burning, hairy armpits, incompetent post-modernist prose, other hairy appendages, muddy boots and overalls. How is that a stereotype?

    As for my penis size, thank you for the interest, but I decline to comment — it’s too big a topic to cover here. 🙂 The Washington Post said it was limiting its writers to under 11 inches in the paper. Of course, that means I could never write for them!

  7. avatar anonymous says:

    Patung,
    slowly but surely your forum is transforming from once an informative forum into a playground of Achmad and his allies.
    You should probably change the name of this forum to “There’s something wrong with Achmad”.

  8. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Dear Anonymous,

    Fair enough, after this I’ll shut up for a while. Kartini’s ghost told me to last night.

    Btw I’d be interested to hear what that Eni professor thinks about the Minangkabau and even Acehnese women. The traditional Minang women would seem to fit the definition of feminism laid out by the good Ms. Janma & Parvita.

    Some feminists, it would seem, are still critical, claiming that power often rests with brothers of women rather than fathers and husbands. The Minang women I’ve met seem to be pretty tough, spunky, and sharp. The Acehnese, of course, have a long tradition of women warriors. There’s even a concrete bas relief of Acehnese women bayonetting Dutch soldiers on the governor’s office in Banda Aceh.

    But there’s a startling fact that emerges from the balance sheet of Bank Rakyat Indonesia, which, is one of the world’s biggest lenders to villagers. More than 90% of their loans are to women who have a much higher repayment rate and are much less likely to default than the men.

  9. avatar David says:

    Achmad, your’e back to making sense.

    Once Again, Friends, Achmad Tells It Like It Is ! (also on achmadtellsit.wordpres.com).

    I’ve wondered before why you make no effort here to promote your own site, I now realise it’s because you don’t know its address. Just to remind you – achmadsudarsono.wordpress.com. You haven’t written a post in a while.

  10. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Yes, indeed it is, many thanks, Patung. Now people can learn all about the CIA, pink dresses from the Australian rugby league team, and poligamy. I was struggling earlier on with hurt feelings after being called so many nasty names.

  11. avatar Odinius says:

    @achmad…that website is class!

  12. avatar Aluang Anak Bayang says:

    @ Achmad

    You are not just a great poet, but an accomplished comedian as well. I like your website. Good for tension relieving. 🙂

  13. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Dear Friend, humble thank. As the Bible says ‘the Truth shall set you free.’

  14. avatar M.Mad says:

    Absolute crypto fascist nationalist religious bollocks.

  15. avatar Aluang Anak Bayang says:

    Absolute crypto fascist nationalist religious bollocks.

    These bollocks don’t bonk little boy scouts or altar boys at jamboree or convents.

  16. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    M. Mad,

    Care to elaborate on your very eloquent critique ? Maybe you can’t. Maybe you are afraid of the Truth . More likely you don’t like to hear opinions coming from a Brown man. It’s ok if they’re serving you, using bad English, (“meesterr, meesterr”), but in the face of forcefully marshalled arguments you buckle; like the Americans in Vietnam, like the British Empire in the face of the great Mahatma Gandi, and the Nekolim confronted by Sukarno at the United Nations.

    I suggest you join the Australian Rugby League’s special training program in making little daisy chain, dressing up in pink lace dresses and playing ring-a-ring-a-rosie.

    I thank you, Friend.

  17. avatar Parvita says:

    Has any of you had the chance to watch ‘Miss Kadaluwarsa’ which was played at Gedung Kesenian Jakarta? It was a refreshing play and probably can give an insight of what career women in Indonesia, or in the east faces. Visit my blog at http://parvita.wordpress.com/, I made some summary and some thoughts about it. Feel free to comment.

  18. avatar dewaratugedeanom says:

    Achmad,
    I love your irony and sarcasm. You really can pull ones leg in style. Nevertheless you are also throwing pearls to swines: they will never understand, let alone appreciate. But I’m sure you already know that.
    Anyway, Achmad for president to
    Sava da Flava

  19. avatar Tomaculum says:

    Now we are all praising A. Sudarsono and “know” his intentions. So his comments will lose its effect. What a bummer!
    Achmad Sudarsono is maybe a great poet full with ironism and sarcasm, but I read in his words also hate against white men (and women) he names “bule”. Unless, he is himself a white man. Then it makes a sense. ( 🙂 ).

  20. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Once again, All My Dear Friend, Tomaculum, Dewaratugedeanom, thanks for the support, but let us not speculate about one humble writer. This Blog is about something much bigger than all of us: the fight for The Truth. Merdeka!

  21. avatar Cukurungan says:

    This Blog is about something much bigger than all of us: the fight for The Truth. Merdeka!

    The Truth is:

    1) Power of women is within in her beauty and beautiful women always powerful.
    2) Women self surrender make man powerless and women aggression make man violent.
    3) We don’t need another Ibu Kartini but we need women who willing to give pregnancy for the birth of another “great man” like Gajahmada, Sukarno and Sudarsono.

  22. avatar Parvita says:

    Just cannot not comment. 🙂

    1) Power of women is within in her beauty and beautiful women always powerful.

    Would be more powerful if she has a brain (and use it) and heart, know what God gave her so in turn will give the ‘rizki’ to the goodness of the environment. Amen!

    2) Women self surrender make man powerless and women aggression make man violent.

    Unfortunately, women that surrender most of the time is being taken for advantage, therefore they have to voice themselves. In Indonesia, women still need to be educated so that they know their rights and not be object of violence. It’s sad seeing domestic violence and abuses, and those TKW being beaten up.

    3) We don’t need another Ibu Kartini but we need women who willing to give pregnancy for the birth of another “great man” like Gajahmada, Sukarno and Sudarsono.

    Fortunately, us women have the last call who can invest a child in our body, i.e. choose the best sperm to fertilize our eggs! Of course the best women will choose the best men so together they will create quality people with moral to make Indonesia better!

  23. avatar Tomaculum says:

    1. Achmad: it wasn’t a support. Just a normal comment with a little prize of irony.
    2. Parvita: maybe Cukurungan just wants to be a second A. Sudarsono? 🙂 (and he is actually for feminism?)

  24. avatar Janma says:

    Well, I’m finding it hard to stay interested in this discussion. You’d think it should be about increasing understanding between the sexes… battling preconceptions and injustices that have stunted the development of women for thousands of years… but no! It appears it’s more about patting the troll on the back for second class infantile humor.
    I’m sorry guys, but i visited the great Achmads site and found not a single piece of poetry on it… so the great poet part I don’t get. some things are funny, like the rugby costume thing, but puleeeeze! You guys must really be lacking in cutting edge humor to get a laugh from that website. Much posturing about a small appendage…. but males must find that endlessly funny… like laughing at farts… something you should stop doing when you’re about ten years old.

  25. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    Janma,

    My poetry is Zen-influenced. It’s the space of no-space and poetry of no-poetry. Consider it very minimalist. (I don’t expect any Caucasians to appreciate the subtletly of Asian art). Still, some snippets of my poetry have been published in this blog. Here’s a simple Haiku:

    Hey there, Aussie, you win the Olympic, but what about the Aborigin ?

    Otherwise, I call upon you to avoid the petty-attention-seeking insults of Western feminism, such as the following:

    about patting the troll on the back for second class infantile humor.

    Once again, thanks for the interest in my appendage, but it’s no joke, let me assure you. BTW — what if we started referring to female genitalia every posting ?

  26. avatar Ihaknt says:

    You’re right Janma. This site is now getting very boring and mind-numbing. It’s now about bigots like you know who’s.

  27. avatar Oigal says:

    Hey Poetry.. cool

    “Hey there, Aussie, you win the Olympic, but what about the Aborigin ”

    Cathy Freeman and Nova Peris to name just two, achieved more in this life than any number like you

  28. avatar Parvita says:

    Come visit my blog as a change then! But I don’t have anything heavy and I don’t write that often 😀

  29. avatar Achmad Sudarsono says:

    All My Feminist Friend,

    This is what Mr. Oigal wrote on his Blog:

    “Greenant” has been on the job and has reported our resident Troll, who likes to impersonate a Indonesian Man is actually a woman (actually a big hairy woman) from Oz. You know the type, sarong wearing dyke westerner, strutting around the local village, the male hater, sucking the public teat for sustenance, Stay tuned for more details..Thanks Greenant, certainly explains the penis envy.

    Friend, Ibus Janma and Parvita have educated me not to spread nasty stereotype. Mr. Oigal, this is very disempowering language. All you do is reinforce the subtextual discourse of power, underlying the relations between the governed and those who govern, filtered through a gendered narrative.

    Now try translating that into Bahasa Indonesia. Maybe Ibu Eni was right after all. Oops, that’s right. Oigal can’t speak Bahasa Indonesia.

  30. avatar Cukurungan says:

    I am so happy that finally a great woman couldn’t resist to comments on the bigot man post.

    regard,
    provokator no.1

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