Anti-Chinese Violence

Feb 6th, 2007, in IM Posts, by David

View the original article here.

287 Comments on “Anti-Chinese Violence”

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Odinius Says:
July 14th, 2008 at 11:50 pm
As horrible as the riots were, saying it’s “the pribumis” fault is really off the mark. Compared with the Indonesian population, or even Jakarta’s, very few of those you might label “pribumi” took part. Once you make blanket generalizations based on some event, you are implicating people who are innocent as well as those who are guilty. This is exactly the type of thinking that led to the riots themselves, when the angry and easily led mob went after working class and middle class Chinese in Glodok, etc. because they were angry at some tycoons, thinking they were all the same because they were all “Chinese.”

Kadal Hijau said:

The problem here is a corrupt and an ineffective government that abuse its power, justice system that favors only the rich & powerful, and unbalanced economy development. Indonesian chinese can help by being less exclusive, interact more, and not look down at the pribumis. And the Pribumi can help by being more trusting and view the chinese indonesian as an equal citizen of Indonesia. When interacting with each others, don’t look at the race, religion, and the skin color of each others; but think that everyone as a citizen of Indonesia.

I think i mostly agree with this.

New question…there isn’t much anti-Chinese violence anymore. Is this because things have improved? Is it because 1996-1999 was a very unique and unstable period?
Kadal Hijau Says:
July 15th, 2008 at 1:23 am
To DXP and replay:

You are either part of the solution or part of the problem:

You are part of the solution if:
You make an effort to make friends from another race/religion
You have a friend from another race/religion and do something together (eat lunch, do/work on something positive).
Help other people regardless of race/religion.
Interact with your neighbours.

You are part of the problem or exacerbate the problem if:
You don’t have a friend from another race/religion.
You treat your workers and servant as a slave.
You think that other people are lower than you, e.g. lower genetic makeup or intelligence.
Bribe officials to get a favor for yourself, your family, or your business.
Favors people at work or outside of work because of race/religion.
Polute/damage the environment or destory natural resources just to gain a profit or prestige.
Pay your worker with the least amount of paycheck that you can get by with.
Store staple items, e.g. rice, gas, more than the necessary amount.
Collude to increase the price of consumer items.

If you are going to be part of the problem, either pribumi or chinese, by all means, please do leave Indonesia.
replay Says:
July 15th, 2008 at 9:41 am
udah ga usah habisin nafas ngmgin masalah racism di indo…100taun ke dpn jg ga bakal berubah kok…bye2 g cabut selamanya….
Kadal Hijau Says:
July 15th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
Odinius:

New question…there isn’t much anti-Chinese violence anymore. Is this because things have improved? Is it because 1996-1999 was a very unique and unstable period?

A very good point. Are we going to see a repeat with the rising costs of food, goods, and gas? If they go high enough, will there be a general unrest or will there be another ‘scapegoat’ to blame?
Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 11:50 am
@ DXP and Replay

If there is no smoke, there is no fire. The Chinese ain’t behaving well either. With traid-like mentality and stinky Singaporean attitude, anti-Chinese sentiment were easily fanned up by shrewd politicans whenever scapegoats were needed. Probably after decades of ‘persecutions’, the Indon-Chinese were to an extent less street-wise and loud-mouthed as their Hongkee and Singaporean counterparts.

Calling Javanese anti-Chinese or racist, my arse. Where the concentration of Javanese are higher, there were lesser violence; where a Chinese befriended a Javanese elite, he was protected and well rewarded with immense wealth. I have 3 sisters (2 were of Chinese origin) adopted at infant ages. They were doted on, raised by Chinese nannies in Singapore, graduated from the States , and on insistence of my parents were sent for further education in China to remind them of their heritage. I know a few others with adopted Chinese kids. Back to business and politics wise, Chinese need to be reined in by the power at hand, otherwise we would be servant in our own land. Dig it?
Odinius Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 12:22 pm
It’s one thing if you compare me (a foreigner) to an Indonesian, or compare a local (say Dayak) to a migrant (say Chinese or Javanese), but the whole idea of “our land” put in ethnic terms among Indonesians who are born in the same area is illiberal.
Deng Xiao Ping Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 12:58 pm
I am not concerned about si bayang & si kadal’ views because their time is almost over, I am more concerned about Vera’s attitudes and the rest of younger generation who live in fatamorghana …
because to the majority of terrorist attitudes, you make up the whole reasons on why Indonesia goes to drain from time to time like today … and to solve that matter, no one can help the majority to change your very wrong attitude against minorities … and you never expect the minorities to rebuild this country to be like super power like China for example, simply we are outnumbered full stop,.. else those are majority with retarded & lethargic attitudes which is who care ? why would minority fix your attitude problems ?

got it ? bottom line, it is waste of time indeed
Deng Xiao Ping Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
one more thing, what make Indonesia majority different to the rest of developed countries?
Developed & progressing countries have
1. never blame on the minorities because minorities is out numbered in quantity therefore it is easier to control. In case of majority feel or perceives can not control the outnumbered minorities then something must be wrong as ‘ada kerja sama’ aka ‘TsT aka ‘ABS = asal bapak senang’ aka ‘ali-baba’ aka etc … banyak deh
2. do not see the needs to have a minority scape goats for every failures the majority had made, because they are successful and too busy to hu ha for busy body
Person Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 6:07 pm
one more thing, what make Indonesia majority different to the rest of developed countries?
Developed & progressing countries have
1. never blame on the minorities because minorities is out numbered in quantity therefore it is easier to control. In case of majority feel or perceives can not control the outnumbered minorities then something must be wrong as ‘ada kerja sama’ aka ‘TsT aka ‘ABS = asal bapak senang’ aka ‘ali-baba’ aka etc … banyak deh

First of all, how could compare Indonesia to a developed country? we are not even close to their standard. Of course we will be worse off in comparison to USA, New Zealand, Australia etc, they have better standard of living. If everyone in Indonesia have the same standard of living and a decent level of education, who would bother committing crime, they simply have no reason for it. If they have jobs that provide them with a standard of living, they’ll think twice before destroying it.

now comparing them to developing countries on the other hand, i can give you a few examples of backlash from the ‘ethnic majority’ of the country to the market-dominant minorities.

Latin America.
In Bolivia the minority ‘whites’ dominate the economy while the rest 65% of the population (ethnic Aymara and Quechua) are impoverished. The visible ‘gap’ finally reached in 2001, to quote Felipe Quispe (known as the great condor of Aymaran) Bolivia land “Belongs to the Aymara and Quechua Indians and not the whites”. Looking at the rest of the countries in Latin America, most if not all, of the market dominant entrepreneurs are the ‘whites’. This fact has lead to a lot of sentiment towards the market-dominant minorities in Latin America.

Europe.
Look at Russia (arguably progressing country if not developed), their oligarch are of Jewish decent (again minority in Russia), and there are sentiments againts them, the so call ‘skin heads’ are on the rise in Russia.
Croatians in the former Yugoslavia also is a market-dominant minorities, and just ask any Croats that survived the Serbian concentration camp of the early 1990′s, their horrible exprience that they have to endure just because their “ethnic” brothers hold more in the economy.

Africa
Hutus killed 800,000 thousand Tutsis in the span of three months, again the result of backlash againts the so called market-dominant minority.
Zimbabwe drove the white farmers out of the country, by forcing them to give their land and ultimately driving the economy straight into a state of collapse. The reason they are the market-dominant minority.
South Africa, Market-dominant whites VS the majority blacks, the result of which I’m quite confident all people know.

Asia
Malaysia, the race based killings of the 1960, should i say more.
Indonesia Jakarta 1998
Burma, if you have the time travel there and ask the native Burmans what they think about the so called ‘the chinese invasion’ there.
Sri Lanka, hatred between the majority Sinhalese and the minority Ceylon Tamils.
India market dominant minority might not exist in the national level, but to give an example at the state level; Northern state of Assam, between the 1979 and 1983 enraged Assamese majority reportedly are involved in vicious ethnic riots.

there are others of such example, if you want to find out more read the book by Amy Chua. The title is World on fire, its the National best seller in America.

Developed country never blamed in on minorities? How bout German prosecution of the Jews, in fact why don’t we go even further and and examine it as far as the medieval time, even before the birth of Christ. History book will tell you the atrocities of the majority towards the market-dominant minority (which in most cases are Jews). The reason why developed country has been good so far is because they have a good standard of living. Would you go and kill people when you can just sit at home and play games, watch TV eat some snack etc. they are well off, of course the chances of them running amok-targeted at minorities are small. Imagine if in Australia the Whites are living on $2 a day and the Aborigines living it up with $1000 a day? dont you think there will be some tension? Just look at South Africa.

The reason why Wrote those examples is to point out its not quite (although race also play a role) a racial base hatred, its a market dominant minority based hatred. It’s not only happen in Indonesia, its everywhere. The reason for such hatred is simple, a large gap economically coupled with ethic divide. One of the way to avoid this can be by simply; don’t show off the ‘economic gap’ in other words hide your wealth and simply show it in a more respectful manner.

One last question to DXP.
Why would you bother to post in a site called Indonesia Matter if your point of view so far seems to promote the opposite, that Indonesia doesn’t matter?
Kadal Hijau Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 8:26 pm
There are always extremists on every sides. DXP is a clear example of one from the Chinese side. It’s good to know that the majority of the Chinese people that I know, either Indonesian or mainland ones, are not like him/her.
Irman Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 8:53 pm
I dont understand why some people like saying that chinese always use money to bribe the government n cause corruption. But let me ask u something, if they dont use money to bribe the government will the government help them ? Iam very clear about that because im currently working in a company owned by chinese(indonesians). the government tends to make things difficult when they are dealing with chinese n asking “extra cost” to them
Odinius Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 11:14 pm
Irman said:

I dont understand why some people like saying that chinese always use money to bribe the government n cause corruption. But let me ask u something, if they dont use money to bribe the government will the government help them ? Iam very clear about that because im currently working in a company owned by chinese(indonesians). the government tends to make things difficult when they are dealing with chinese n asking “extra cost” to them

You just hit the nail on the head.

Then, like in May 1998, some of those forces that have been taking the “extra cost” foment violence against minorities like the Chinese in Indonesia, or Jews in Russia before 1917, or Indians/Pakistanis in Uganda during the 1960s, etc. to either keep or take power, while covering up they they are the ones asking for and taking the bribes, before AND after the violence occurs.
Aluang Anak Bayang Says:
July 16th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
Mas Deng Xiao Ping,

Take a closer look at Malaysia and Brunei, our 2 nusantara neighbours. Do you think their Chinese population enjoy as much freedom as Indon Chinese? You are simply whinging too much.
Deng Xiao Ping Says:
July 17th, 2008 at 11:34 am
AAB, am fully aware of the situation in msia and brunei. That’s why I am posting my view based on my experiences living in Indon msia brunei are the same ‘setali 3 wang’. I am sent by the DXP to enlighten my indonesian chinese brothers who is living in ‘fatamorghana’, especially those who never live outside Indon. Others may think I am an extrimist chinese, in other hand I am only asking what I deserve as ‘basic human right’ being of citizen in Indonesia full stop. An extrimist is a bunch of moron who want to force their ideology above than his basic human right to live together peacefully with other races. Example : hisbut tahrir want to set up an islamic state of CHINA, and offcourse DXP can not stand it
Purba Negoro Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 12:45 am
DXP= Sukarno wannabe.

But like all Chinese products, derivative and poorer quality

Chinese are architects of their own demise.
Don’t like Indonesia? Leave. Simple.
Sylvester Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 5:06 am
Can Indonesia make missiles, jet fighters, tanks, submarines with quality approaching NATO standard?
Can Indonesia send people to space?
Can Indonesia become the biggest manufacturer?
Can Indonesia rank 1 in Olympic Games?
Who was the greatest nation during for thousand years before Western domination and today is getting back to that era?
Dear PN, many thing Indo have to learn from China.
Purba Negoro Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
Sylvester- you and DXP like many Chinese are the real racist with your “one white covers a hundred blemish” mentality.

You see anyone darker than you as inferior.
Because you’re skin is almost the same tone as a white because Chinese are incredibly superficial- you think that you’re the same.

Don’t bulllsh*t- I’ve been to China, Singapore,Hong Kong, Tawian many, many times.
That’s how I know that stupid idiom after being apologised to by embarrassed Chinese hosts etc

Typical Chinese reductionism- highlighting cultural perhaps disposition to solely linear thought processes + arbitrary self-aggrandizement of superioriry complex sufferer.
Superiority complex created by deep inner feeling of inadequacy.

Admittedly China is many years ahead of Indonesia now. Why? Stability, better planning and money.

Why is Singapore advanced? No democracy, excellent economic advisor Dutchman Artemius (now dead) and huge US-UK soft loans- again money and planning.

Not genetics, not race, not skin colour, not religion- MONEY.
Money for education/technical expertise, R&D and high technology plant machinery for superior end products.

Many- including Japan- do not make high-capital weapon because it’s more economical to buy off-the-shelf.

China makes weapons- all reverse engineered or built with external specialist advise because other nations will impose embargo if they feel threatened- like Iran produces high-tech missiles and soon all of Arabia as oil runs out.

But, in your Chinese racist mind you cannot resolve the Chinese-racist paradox of a tanned Muslim + technical ability.

Indonesians have no problem with Indian, Japanese,
Caucasian or Arab minority. Africans are problematic because they are frequently drug-runners.

Why Chinese only? Their actions and treatment- not their appearance.
In our language- we have “hitam manis”- black sugar/sweety (implying wilder in bed)

In Chinese: “one white covers a hundred blemishes” , Gwai lo? = deep rooted cultural racism.

Go lead a book lah, no watch Channor News Asia meh? That one all fart not sh*t.
And no more talking cock.
Sylvester Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 3:37 pm
He he, speaking about racism I am nothing compare to you PN. And comments from others did confirm it. Maybe DXP is a bit too far sometime and I do not always agree with him. However, what Indonesia really need is not such a people like PN who only can spread hatred. PN is really sick and want to contaminate everyone. Indonesian pribumi in general are good, Chinese are good also. Sometimes problem happened because of the political pressure, cultural clash, or economic competition which can happen anywhere. Indonesia did have problem with Chinese simply because of some political reason. Today, Indonesia hate American govn more than Chinese also because of political reason. The China-Indonesia relationship now is improving a lot. Recently TNI AL purchased Chinese C-802 anti-ship missile system for its fregat. So, never let a bastard like PN to poison our mind.

P.S: I have to admit, Cuk and Aluang are still better than PN.
DXP Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 3:44 pm
PN, cooling down .. if Indon don’t rely on china brothers then who else you can depend on ?
- to the USA snake ? you don’t like their liberal democracy ideology
- to the Indian snake ? you don’t like their roti prata either
- to the Arab snake ? you can’t stand for their extreem ideology, beside they are ignoring you because your oil resources is just a rounding error to them
- to your dearly Malaysia snake ? you never trust them too , your nearest ‘one race’ neighbour because you are competing with them in many aspects
- so tell me who is your friend my dear Indonesia patriotic brother ? while you can’t stand on your own feets, I saw your country balance sheet is in trouble, poverty at the highest rate, unemployment at the peak level too ? … so sad situation … at least the big brother China still a better choice

If I were you, better live in Suriname while you can speak Javanese & drink much alcohol freely there
tomaculum Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 5:29 pm
DXP,
Purba would rather rely on his own “snake”.
That is maybe his dearest friend besides his AKM and Makarov.
Purba Negoro Says:
August 18th, 2008 at 8:47 pm
I think she is a frustrated Singapore housewife who longs for some satisfaction again and again and again and again, and again and again and again. Then a nap and repeat again.

She is a tease- perhaps a tante girang or auntie…?

DXP your oversimplistic reductionist argument is dreadful.
Mlaaysia and Indonesia have problem because of boudary and Malaysia just onw two islands considerd Indoensian.
Interpersonally- this relationship is friendly

Suakrno envisaged MaPhilIndo- an alliance of MAlay states- which emerged as ASEAN.

I do not know of Indian issue- roti porata is a MAlaysian word maybe you confuse the two:
your racist mind think all brownies look alike?
Arab- the problem is with wahabbi funding of pesantren in vacuum of stte funding. BUt you are to simple to work that one out.

A story- when I was in Shanghai this January- my friends were making jokes about how Indians eat with hands- so do not try and trick me- I know how Chinese people are.
Chinese are AS chauvinist as the rest of us so stop trying to make yourself look like saint. You are as much as sinner as others.

Speaking of Human Rights-
Chinese here have far more rights than even Singapore- they can say whatever, chew gum, grow hair, can make public protest, can live wherever and not serve the military. Can they in Singapore? No.

I think you read too much Glodok-Pluit-Slipi comic book.
You argue from a point of ignorance with no knowledge aside from a very tiny biased peephole.

Honestly- I tire of trying to turn a black wall white.

DXP- pls come to Jakarta- I invite you. See with your own eyes, speak with real people.
You will see the brown skin man is not as evil or hateful- and the Chinese far from the saints they paint themselves as.
DXP Says:
August 19th, 2008 at 5:22 pm
Mlaaysia and Indonesia have problem because of boudary and Malaysia just onw two islands considerd Indoensian.
Interpersonally- this relationship is friendly

Suakrno envisaged MaPhilIndo- an alliance of MAlay states- which emerged as ASEAN.

PN surely never live in Msia. Do u know why they called u as ‘the INDON’ ? Malaysianese always look down on Indonesian, that is very true. Indon are typical attributes to desperate Indonesian migrant workers who desperately seeking a better quality of life in Malaysia because of poverty, jobless, gov’t don’t really care about them – because of the desperado – most of them live without proper Visa and becoming a burden for Malaysia demography. Last month there were massive hunt of those Indon fugitives, starting in Serawak & Miri razzia, aha Indon also famous of ‘escort teenage girls’ exporter, the datuk(s) import them from Sulawesi, Kalimantan & East Java, especially becoming their comfort ladies or better still as 2nd or 3rd misstress. In Msia, syairah Islam allow u to hv > 1 wives so long you can settle RM 1,200 in custom court without 1st wive approval to marry your misstress

This unique officially approved polygamy law are under my study now, it looks very robust, well planned & it is very very advance & sistematically well crafted only in the muslim dominated country like Malaysia. DXP concluded this is the only matter CHINA lack off and we must learn from you guys on how to lawfully endorsed to marry more than 1 wife ????
Protus Tanuhandaru Says:
September 21st, 2008 at 8:21 am
If you want to know more about why Chinese Indonesian is facing difficulty integrating into Indonesia, check this http://www.csis.or.id/events_upcoming_view.asp?id=373&tab=0

The book is about SBKRI (Indonesian Citizenship Certificate). Having physical characteristics similar to other Asians (slanted eyes and yellow skin color), most Chinese Indonesians have been treated the same as those recently migrating to Indonesia. The cost of SBKRI document can range from Rp1 million (about US$100) to Rp7 million (about US$760). Tong Shin Fu, a renowned Chinese Indonesian badminton player had to pay Rp 50 million (about US$ 5400) and had to wait for ten years for the document.

Of course SBKRI is not the only thing that makes Chinese Indonesian having difficulty. There are things like pluralism rejected by the Indonesian Ulema Council, unresolved May 1998 riot, the apartheid system established by the Indonesian government and by the Dutch, the Chinese Indonesian genocide committed by the Dutch in 1740, the notorious PP10 (regulation forbidding Chinese Indonesian to do trading in the rural area), etc.
Purba Negoro Says:
September 22nd, 2008 at 3:02 pm
Nonsense.
You dare try and peddle your ridiculous pamphlet of a vested interest over-privileged non-assimilating alien?

It is Chinese actions, NOT race that cause the problems.

They chose to impose their illegal, non-assimilating and often hostile and uninvited presence upon the Bumiputera/Pribumi people.
They chose to enrich themselves at the expense of the native in a prejudicial colonial system.
They chose to be keen often brutal colonial collaborators.
They chose to continue their clannism, monopolism, cronyism and corruption of law and due process for insatiable greed.
They must now bear the consequences of their choices

Chinese in Malaysia and Indonesia are the root cause of corruption, deforestation, exotic animal-parts trade and all manner of vice- including total monopolies on illegal gambling, child pornography, sex slavery, tiger bones and skins, drugs manufacture and trafficking and human organs.

Chinese are an uninvited non-assimilating clannish colonial import. The Dutch and British imported the Chinese to destroy local indigenous authority, confiscate indigenous lands for cash-crop plantations- to be run, administered and brutally enslave the indigenous as forced labour.

The laws exist for a reason. If Cheinse are too immature to bear responsibility accept the consequences of their actions, they are very welcome to leave never t return.

More evidence ( have thousands of texts, not to worry):
“The Chinese proud of being members of the Kik Bing Tong (revolutionary society) and treated the natives HAUGHTILY. The Javanese broke away and formed their own party of thousands
Kong Diji Hing and Kong Gi Hing were major anti-SI (Serikat Indonesia) Movements- in other words- 100% Chinese funded and membership to oppose Native Independence
(Chirot, 1997: 188-193).

The Dutch Cultivations sytem- was run as fllows:
Native farmers were legally obliged to devote part of their land for cash-cropping, including Opium. Chinese obverlooked the administration, management and compliance of this system.
The crops were then sold n for enormous proift benefiting the Dutch Vichy-esque collaborators- including some native Regency admin and the CHinese lackey of the Dutch. Dutch relied on local native admin (antive collaboraots) and Chiense.
Wealthy Javanized Chinese ran the large plantations and concessions
Europeans gathered in Societie- drinking, gambling and gossiping
Banks were created for the Javanese agricultural economy to break the cycle o Chinese money-lenders
In 1899- Dutch recognised Japan as an enqual legally.
(Chirot, 1997:198-203)

The Chines millionaires, having made their money from Indonesian and Malay plantations (forced labour, indentured labour, confiscated lands) created a club:
EE Hoe Hean- for millionaires to fud anti-Nationalist movements in Malaysia and Indonesia- particularly through the veil of anti-Japanese activity- worried they would lose their plantations and economic monopolies.

Nice try at Historical Revisionism, but the facts disprove you

“A History of Modern Indonesia” by Rickleffs.
“Essential Outsiders: Chinese and Jews in the Modern Transformation of Southeast Asia and Central Europe”
By Daniel Chirot, Anthony Reid

These laws exist for a reason- due to Chinaman’s notorious and well-documented
hoarding
price gouging
exploitation
usuary
economic predation on the rural pribumi-

thus lost the privilege of trading there- and due to popular support was banned.
The reality is these laws exist as a means of levelling the playing field for the slaves of Chinaman (wealthy from his collaboration with the Dutch): the pribumi.

Why would I believe any rubbish printed courtesy of US Vanderbilt money poured into that cesspit of US collaborationism and political agitation the Centre for Strategic and International Studies?

Is the next Vanderbilt book: “How the US won the Vietnam War”?
Neocon rubbish at its’ worst.

You must think us stupid indeed to naively believe anything printed as Gospel

From their website:
“CSIS is funded in part through an establishment endowment fund. It also seeks support for its research programs and regional network activities from foundations, multilateral organisations and donor institutions. It welcomes donations from groups and individuals.”

Oh, I see.

In other words “Pay for Print, wan. King Nummer wan.”.

This pulp fiction of recycled toilet paper matters nothing.
The Rakyat are less stupid than you assume they are- they can see their enemy- and won’t forget his collaboration.

If Chinese don’t like Indonesia, they are more than welcome to leacve, thus doing everybody concerned a favour
Protus Tanuhandaru Says:
September 23rd, 2008 at 12:08 am
PN

“First of all, not all Chinese are the same. They are not homogeneous society. Chinese Indonesian in Java is not the same as the one in Bangka Belitong or Pontianak. And they are also differ in terms of religion: Christian, Catholic, Buddhist, COnfucian, and Islam. Yes there are some Muslim Chinese. I have met them and heard the rueful experience of being both Chinese and a Muslim. They’re paying the price for having physical characteristics of a Chinese.”

Nonsense.
You dare try and peddle your ridiculous pamphlet of a vested interest over-privileged non-assimilating alien?

“Yes I dare because I’m an Indonesian with slanted eyes and yellow skin. And despite my father has served in the military (TNI colonel), I still had to produce this document, just because someone like me can easily be associated with the Chinese coming from China. And the aim of this book is to deter corruption related to SBKRI. It’s really that simple. “

It is Chinese actions, NOT race that cause the problems.

“Actions stemmed from racial/ethnic segregation”

They chose to impose their illegal, non-assimilating and often hostile and uninvited presence upon the Bumiputera/Pribumi people.
They chose to enrich themselves at the expense of the native in a prejudicial colonial system.
They chose to be keen often brutal colonial collaborators.
They chose to continue their clannism, monopolism, cronyism and corruption of law and due process for insatiable greed.
They must now bear the consequences of their choices

“Yes I agree with you… anyone committing all these crimes and those incriminated by them should be brought to justice, irrespective of their ethnicity, religion or race.”

Chinese in Malaysia and Indonesia are the root cause of corruption, deforestation, exotic animal-parts trade and all manner of vice- including total monopolies on illegal gambling, child pornography, sex slavery, tiger bones and skins, drugs manufacture and trafficking and human organs.

Chinese are an uninvited non-assimilating clannish colonial import. The Dutch and British imported the Chinese to destroy local indigenous authority, confiscate indigenous lands for cash-crop plantations- to be run, administered and brutally enslave the indigenous as forced labour.

The laws exist for a reason. If Cheinse are too immature to bear responsibility accept the consequences of their actions, they are very welcome to leave never t return.

“Then what? You want to generalize all the Chinese Indonesians and Malaysian as bad as the ones you have just described? It is as if you’re trying to condition the good Chinese to do bad things… Or you can commit genocide the scale of Darfur to wipe all the Chinese”

More evidence ( have thousands of texts, not to worry):
“The Chinese proud of being members of the Kik Bing Tong (revolutionary society) and treated the natives HAUGHTILY. The Javanese broke away and formed their own party of thousands
Kong Diji Hing and Kong Gi Hing were major anti-SI (Serikat Indonesia) Movements- in other words- 100% Chinese funded and membership to oppose Native Independence
(Chirot, 1997: 188-193).

“Be careful when you associate Chinese identity with elite society. Elites–whoever they are–maintain their status quo, by keeping security intact, that is, supporting the Dutch or the Japanese.”

The Dutch Cultivations sytem- was run as fllows:
Native farmers were legally obliged to devote part of their land for cash-cropping, including Opium. Chinese obverlooked the administration, management and compliance of this system.
The crops were then sold n for enormous proift benefiting the Dutch Vichy-esque collaborators- including some native Regency admin and the CHinese lackey of the Dutch. Dutch relied on local native admin (antive collaboraots) and Chiense.
Wealthy Javanized Chinese ran the large plantations and concessions
Europeans gathered in Societie- drinking, gambling and gossiping
Banks were created for the Javanese agricultural economy to break the cycle o Chinese money-lenders
In 1899- Dutch recognised Japan as an enqual legally.
(Chirot, 1997:198-203)

“Yes. This is true, but you also have to ask yourself a question: what could the Chinese have done if they could only live in the city and do nothing for a living? This is the result of Passenstelsel policy enacted by the Dutch. This is similar to the Jews living in Europe in ancient time, during which they could do nothing but to work as money lenders. Now I’m not surprised if most Jews are savvy in financial transactions. History shaped their evolution.”

The Chines millionaires, having made their money from Indonesian and Malay plantations (forced labour, indentured labour, confiscated lands) created a club:
EE Hoe Hean- for millionaires to fud anti-Nationalist movements in Malaysia and Indonesia- particularly through the veil of anti-Japanese activity- worried they would lose their plantations and economic monopolies.

“As did the Sarekat Dagang Islam, an organization made to outdo the Chinese in economy.”

Nice try at Historical Revisionism, but the facts disprove you

“A History of Modern Indonesia” by Rickleffs.
“Essential Outsiders: Chinese and Jews in the Modern Transformation of Southeast Asia and Central Europe”
By Daniel Chirot, Anthony Reid

“I would like to read them if you tell me where these books are”

These laws exist for a reason- due to Chinaman’s notorious and well-documented
hoarding
price gouging
exploitation
usuary
economic predation on the rural pribumi-

thus lost the privilege of trading there- and due to popular support was banned.
The reality is these laws exist as a means of levelling the playing field for the slaves of Chinaman (wealthy from his collaboration with the Dutch): the pribumi.

Why would I believe any rubbish printed courtesy of US Vanderbilt money poured into that cesspit of US collaborationism and political agitation the Centre for Strategic and International Studies?

“I dont believe them either. And CSIS has nothing to do with the book. We’re just borrowing the place. That’s all. And for your information… the founders of CSIS were supportive of assimilation policy. You don’t have to believe the book. All you have to do is to read it, provided that you’re interested in it.”

Is the next Vanderbilt book: “How the US won the Vietnam War”?
Neocon rubbish at its’ worst.

You must think us stupid indeed to naively believe anything printed as Gospel

“No we don’t, as anyone can debunk what we have written as a myth. But what we want to have is a nice discourse on CHinese overseas issues and how to deal with them. And for your information: I don’t believe in Gospel, as I’m agnostic.”

From their website:
“CSIS is funded in part through an establishment endowment fund. It also seeks support for its research programs and regional network activities from foundations, multilateral organisations and donor institutions. It welcomes donations from groups and individuals.”

Oh, I see.

In other words “Pay for Print, wan. King Nummer wan.”.

This pulp fiction of recycled toilet paper matters nothing.
The Rakyat are less stupid than you assume they are- they can see their enemy- and won’t forget his collaboration.

“Kill me then, as I’m not happy living in phobia. I’m not happy either for being born as a Chinese in Indonesia, not happy for having my father died for Indonesia. I don’t like Chinese who do corruption etc. but it is dreadful to be treated the same as these are.”

If Chinese don’t like Indonesia, they are more than welcome to leacve, thus doing everybody concerned a favour

“It’s not us who don’t like living in Indonesia. It is whether the ethnic majority in Indonesia will be willing to work things out to deal with administration population issues. Now that Indonesia has other ethnics such as Korean Indonesian, Japanese Indonesian etc. Indonesia faces a much more complicated pluralism problems ranging from trafficking to misallocation of state fund (APBD). What do you want to do? Keep the sort of attitude you have just demonstrated to me or we both can work together to manage pluralism issues?”
sputjam Says:
September 23rd, 2008 at 2:36 pm
slowly and surely, it is best to try and not associate oneself in any religious or racial groups.
I have no problems with either the malays, indian or chinese, provided they are righteous.
didn’t God say that He did not create mankind of many creed, so that we may learn from one another(or something like that)….
Purba Negoro Says:
September 24th, 2008 at 12:26 pm
You are a LIAR- more on you specifically later
But more relevantly your pathetic penny-dreadful is Pay-For-Print Outright Chinese LIES:

You attempt to paint the Chinese as sinless, oppressed victims- but the REALITY clearly PROVES CHINESE are their OWN architects of their destruction.
Yet they complain for the consequences of their own CRIMINALITY.

Chinese problems regrading SKBRI are entirely their own fault.
Chinese problems arise because they have INVALID, ILLEGAL or FORGED documents- caused by infamous “Chinese Way wan” of bribing their way through life to smooth the path rather than follow the inconvenience of Law or procedure.

Chinese are infamous for heeding their own ignorant Glodok-type rumour, hearsay and gossip for legal advice and hence pay the consequence of their OWN POOR CHOICES and IGNORANCE if not CONTEMPT for LAW.

Now- the situation of most Chines is that none of their documents are at all VALID under LAW due to THEIR OWN FAULT- be it IGNORANCE or BRIBERY for ILLEGAL DOCUMENTATION
IF Chinese CHOSE to OBEY THE LAW- they would never have any problem.
Bribery exists only when there is a CAUSE- it must have this Reason in order to Coerce the “Bribee”.

The one being Bribed CHOOSES to pay the bribe to avoid the resultant Punishment owing due to THEIR ACTIONS

Example:
In the case of Bule in Bali- usually he is caught with small amount of cannabis.
Cause- illegal possession of class drug- police can now use this as leverage
Result- Bule CHOOSES the path of bribing to avoid jail

According to the Departemen Imigrasi:
General Eligibility for Citizenships are

1. Applicant must LEGALLY married to an Indonesian citizen;
2. At the time of forwarding the application, the applicant has resided in Indonesian territory for at least 5 (five) consecutive years or at least 10 (ten) years non-continuously. This is prerequisite to the citizenship application;
3. The Indonesian citizenship will NOT caused double citizenship.

It can be easily seen Chinese regularly do not fit all 3 criteria- especially with regard to 1 and 3.

Information regarding Documents and Procedure for Citizenship are widely available.

These include:
VALID Passport
VALID KITAS (Temporary Stay Permit) card
VALID Birth Certificate: both VALID Surat Keterangan (Tanda) Lahir [SKL] and Akte Lahir
VALID Kartu Tanda Penduduk [KTP]
VALID Marriage certificate (and any divorce and/or death certificate): [KAP]
Kutipan Akte Perkawinan certificate (or buku nikah – for Muslim marriage booklet).
VALID Kartu Keluarga (KK family registration card) [KK]
Now- the situation of most Chines is that none of their documents are at all VALID under LAW due to THEIR OWN FAULT- be it IGNORANCE or BRIBERY for ILLEGAL DOCUMENTATION

a KTP alone requires:
a VALID STK
and REGISTRATION within 14 days at the Immigration Office (neglected by most Chinese- how then is the State supposed to then cater for these unwilling to obey the Procedure and Law)

BUT
STK- requires valid KTP of both Parents
and valid KAP
and valid KK
valid KITAS in the case of foreigner’s valid Exit and Re-entry Visa for child (often neglected by Chinese due to IGNORANCE, STINGINESS (do not want to pay published fixed fees) or CONTEMPT for PROCEDURE)

If you’re a debtor, a bankruptor or other criminal- its’ impossibel to remove the black mark against the KTP reigstrant. So what Chinese commonly do is instead of lgeally clearing their name- they buy a new illegal KTP- consciously and willingly circumventing and subverting the law.

The areas with the worst KTP fraud are the Chinese dominated areas of Medan, Palembang, Lampung, Tangerang, Bekasi, Batam etc.
The Law states that providing false or misleading documnetion for a KTP is a crime- yet Chinese willingly routinely indulge in this well-known and published criminal activity.

Furthermore- if the KTP is INVAKLID if the nation of the Parent is NOT recognised by the State- for example Taiwan.
In this case there is Procuedure to rectify the problem- but as usual Chinaman does not want to obey the law and follow direct procedure.

here again the Chinese runs into problems caused entirely by his own making as he has not bothered to or bought illegally

the STK of the parents’ parents is often VOID, OUT OF DATE or ILLEGAL
they probably lack a KAP
and their KK is of poor quality- assuming it is LEGAL:
listing them as ENEMY of STATE, ILLEGAL ALIEN, BANKRUPTOR or even COMMUNIST

Furthermore- to be considered for Immigration- the Nation of Origin must not fit the Blacklisted nations [Africa, Eastern Europe, China, all the nations where money talks] as procedure will take much longer [exactly like anywhere else in the world] to ascertain documents provided are not forgeries, fakes or the person is a WANTED CRIMINAL on the run.
It is not the Department of Immigrations’ job to adjudicate or referee the validity, morality or even justification of the status of the Criminal – it merely follows set and universal procedure

So in summary- all delays and expenses are ENTIRELY CHINESE OWN FAULT.
If you Obey the Law- no problems- Americans, Australians Britons, Dutch, Russians, Koreans and Japanese seem to have no trouble- but always these idiotic, hostile non-assimilating Chinese.
Why?
Simple:
CHINESE CONTEMPT FOR THE INDONESIAN STATE AND ITS’ LAWS
and/or CHINESE CRIMINALITY INCLUDING CURRENT CHARGES OF FRAUD AND BANKRUPTCY

Your pathetic attempt at justification of Chinese subversion via your flawed anology:
Sarekat Dangang Islam and Rekso Rekmekso had nowhere near the funds of the Chinese Kong Diji Hing, Kong Gi Hing and Ee Hoe Hean
and you know it or if even intellectually honest would admit it

“CSIS is funded in part through an establishment endowment fund… It welcomes donations from groups and individuals”

Pay for Print lah? Can cetak many book for murah, Sir?
Sir? Uncle? Uncle? Top price one, full guarantee!
Tabloid can! Pretty book can! Bible can! Textbook can!
Any book, low low price! Sir? Uncle?
Murah! Murah! Top price nummer one!
orgindo Says:
September 24th, 2008 at 3:08 pm
And now.. Chinese Indonesian got two choices:
1. Continue to stay in Indonesia and do business as usual, hoping to reap profit from this rich nation, so we can retire safely out of Indonesia. After all, this is a country that do not welcome us.
2. Start to change, be more idealist, and try to mediate between Chinese and Pribumi. Start to realize that the cause of Chinese’s demise is our own action, and start serving the country.

Unfortunately, when a Chinese took the second choice, he is humiliated. No matter what we do, Chinese will still be a scape goat. So, in the end, no matter how many Chinese that has a mindset that want to serve the country, these people will dwindle down, because the system and situation in Indonesia does not support the Chinese that choose the second choice.

IF Chinese CHOSE to OBEY THE LAW- they would never have any problem.

Well, tell me which law will ensure your safety and your livelihood when you obey it? Are we that stupid that we let ourselves vulnerable to your ‘native’ attack? If you live in Java, go outside the island and see how things are done. There are hardly any way to obey the law completely. All policy is being established in Jakarta, that give the people on the government advantage. If you really think that we should obey the law, why it is always YOUR law. If you really think that you can impose a law, then make sure it is usable and instead of attacking the minority, will protect them from harm if we obey it.

One point that i want to iterate, is that in a nation that hates you, sometimes you have no choice. We, Chinese Indonesian, can give up and just go out, or reap the profit and send the money out, but there are also group of people that realize that we are born in this country, and this is our motherland. We love this country, and we want to see this country to be built, to be better.

I personally graduate from school in US, but still, I want to go back to build the nation. How many so-called native Indonesian that go abroad to study (sometimes paid by government) and do not want to go back to serve the country? Take a look at the talent abroad and you will see many Indonesian can help, but no, they choose to live outside.

So, please, hating we, Chinese Indonesian, will not help much. The more you suppress us, the higher our survival skill will be, and everyday, we will be better. If you think that we are exclusive because we speak our own language to each other, then it is very pathetic of you because you feel so, since you only speak Indonesian. I live in Medan, where many Batak people speak their own language to each other in the presence of other race, but let me ask you, why people always protest that we, Chinese Indonesian, have no sense of nationalism? But never protest that the Batak speak their own language?

One thing I know that is true, if you continue your racism prejudice further, you will not advance, this country will not move forward. You cannot expect to obliterate all the bad Chinese, what you and me and everyone can do is to do their part. Racism and prejudice will not vanish in this world, it won’t. But every single small thing that you do, it will make a difference, even though you do not realize it. I challenge you to start thinking about this.
sputjam Says:
September 24th, 2008 at 3:25 pm
Wow, this debate can go on forever!
browns blames the yellows and vice versa.
Me, I enjoy the company of both.
DXP Says:
September 24th, 2008 at 9:57 pm
hatred & hatred & hatred …
Indonesia is a peace people ?