Porn Sites

Dec 29th, 2006, in IM Posts, by

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98 Comments on “Porn Sites”

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  1. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 8th, 2007 at 9:29 am

    1ndra,

    It is clear that these verses mean different things to different people, at pengajian yesterday, I asked the assembled people what they though, almost exactly there was a split between the men and the women, with me being the one exception on the male side.
    The women plainly understand that polygamy is allowed, but under very clear restrictions which The Prophet adhered to during his lifetime, that is to protect widows and orphans.
    The men without exception however see it as a way of legalising adultery, better polygamy than zina.

    It seems to me that some people think with their hearts and some with their sex organs!

    We are so overdue for a complete review of Islamic Jurisprudence with panels made of both men and women. The present rules and philosophies have been so biased towards males that it is clear that they discriminate against the women of our communities.

    Ihaknt,

    It is not just population figures it is a complete obsession with sex. The repression of those cultures seems to create people who cannot think of anything else. Whilst working in the Middle East, I was suprised to find about 10 channels of Hard Core Pornography was available to the owners of Satellite receivers!

    You just need to look at the figures from Google Trends, to see which countries are searching for material of a sexual nature:

    Top 8 from this morning at 0900 hrs, search term “sex”

    Pakistan
    Egypt
    India
    Iran
    Morocco
    Turkey
    Viet Nam
    Saudi Arabia

    Far better I think to teach our children that sex is normal, and a good thing and teach then how to approach it from a normal and healthy perspective so that they can grow up to be balanced personalities. Much better than living in a society where it is considered unnacceptable to show love and affection to your wife with a kiss in public but it is acceptable to have public brothel complexes.

    It makes me wonder about the mentality of the people who cannot accept the simple display of love and affection but tolerate the brothel complexes and prostitution!

  2. avatar Ihaknt says:
    January 8th, 2007 at 9:53 am

    I agree, sex is normal. Because of sex we are here today, our kids are here today. It is normal and a beautiful thing. It’s NOT normal if it is forced upon you.
    Yeah i dont get it either when we cant show affection to our partner in public. There’s nothing wrong with a kiss. Unless of course it’s a hot passionate kiss in a school playground, now that’s when you need to get a room.
    About those 10 channels, i read about it somewhere in one of the books about Mid-Easter women studies. again these people are getting the wrong information because their legit sources are supressed. It’s crazy. so munafik. Not to mention the gay sexual relationship cos relations with women are prohibited plus that they are so segregrated, hence interaction between men are normal. For those who don’t believe me, read those books, so many of them. But they may not be available in Indonesia.

  3. avatar Dangduters says:
    January 8th, 2007 at 11:15 am

    To avoid porn in internet, we could set “parental lock” software in our computer.
    The government should ask WARNET managements also to set “parental watch” for those under-age internet users. Don’t block the internet porn please,..because I like them very much

  4. avatar Peter says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 5:15 am

    Good points.

    Yes, I think that the Quran is long overdue for a 2nd edition. But since the Quran is supposedly a miracle in itself, Muslims will probably never change it. There is also no centralized power structure in Islam. There is no “church” or “pope”, so nobody would be able to agree on which scholars would have the authority to reinterpret the Quran. What a shame. I personally believe that if we are going to take the Quran literally, we must ignore any verses that or injunctions that are not completely consistent throughout the whole book. If we are to be honest, we should admit that there are many verses in the Quran that simply contradict one another. In my opinion we should ignore them. Logic is one of the most special gifts Allah has given to us. I don’t imagine that Allah would expect us give up our logic – which separates us from lower animals – whenever we approach matters of faith.

  5. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 1:13 pm

    Tell me where the contradiction is…

  6. avatar Fanglong says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 2:15 pm

    Hello 1ndra, Moh. Khafi, Peter & other friends !

    There are many contradictions in the Coranic text ; less than in the Bible (which is a bigger corpus) ; far more less than in the Buddhist “canon”, which is immense, & the contradictions of which have given rise to many ways of interpreting the Buddha’s words. The “Western” concept of authenticity works in certain areas, but not all. I think in the Coran the tradition says there exist a kind of “abolishing” verses with their counterpart “abolished” verses… The religious speech must be intempora : nothing to do with novel or newspaper language…

    But I wish you all the best !

    Salam !

  7. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 4:04 pm

    My personal belief is that there are no contradictions in the Quranic text, the contradictions come from the interpretations. It is the interpretations which need to be revisited and revised, these are after all not revelations from God.

  8. avatar Dimp says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 4:31 pm

    Hi MK,

    I agree with you, there are too many parties involved in interpreting the Quranic verses, and some of them I think is way off target, these “way off target” interpretations I think need to be revisited and cleared so it doesn’t make any confusions for everyone.

  9. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 9th, 2007 at 6:56 pm

    True. Good discussion and plenty of sources are needed.
    But the Quran itself isnt contradiction, only if you thought like ‘If you do sins then Allah will punish you but if you regret and do taubat, Allah is Mercyful.’ is contradiction.

  10. avatar Hassan says:
    January 11th, 2007 at 10:14 pm

    Wow, even when we talked about porn, the subject of polygamy is touched. Whew, is there a more controversial topic than polygamy in Indoneisia matter (or indeed in Indonesia itself)?

    Mohammed Khafi: As I said, even if you don’t take the hadith as your source, historians will tell us that in Prophet Muhammad’s lifetime, and those of the sahabats, and the four rightly guided caliphs, polygamy is a common practice. It was never banned by any of them. Now, are you going to say you don’t believe in history as well?

  11. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 11th, 2007 at 11:19 pm

    No of course not Hassan, It doesn’t suprise me that there were polygamous marriages after the revelation of Allah’s book, we are already 1400 years with His Teachings and still the practice continues, I guess some mens lust is stronger than their faith.

  12. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 11th, 2007 at 11:21 pm

    If poligamy is banned, then there’s verses said ‘Poligamy is sin and prohibited’.
    But instead, ‘Limited by four’.

  13. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 11th, 2007 at 11:42 pm

    With conditions that no normal ordinary man can comply with!

  14. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 11:10 am

    Yes, but Allah has forgive for that. See the verses?

    ‘Dan kamu sekali-kali tidak akan dapat berlaku adil di antara isteri-ister(mu), walaupun kamu sangat ingin berbuat demikian, karena itu janganlah kamu terlalu cenderung (kepada yang kamu cintai), sehingga kamu biarkan yang lain terkatung-katung. Dan jika kamu mengadakan perbaikan dan memelihara diri (dari kecurangan), maka sesungguhnya Allah Maha Pengampun lagi Maha Penyayang.

  15. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 11:26 am

    1ndra,

    It seems strange that you are supporting something which requires Allah’s forgiveness and mercy, rather than promoting the good and righteous.

    There is only one thing which Allah will not forgive and that is holding others up besides him, which following your logic means that we can do whatever we please because Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

  16. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 5:29 pm

    I just dont want a right verses judged wrong.
    Islam didnt prohibited poligamy, you wont find any verses in Quran that prohibited poligamy.

  17. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 6:47 pm

    1ndra,

    I have never said that Al Quran prohibited polygamy, I have just been pointing out to you that the verses impose conditions that nobody today can meet;

    Time of War, as Hassan is always saying you have to read the verse and relate it to the time of its revelation to put it in context.
    Being unable to be fair to the orphans of that war.
    As the Orphans and Women are linked in one sentence the women have to be the mothers of the orphans and are therefore widows.
    Being unafraid of being unfair and unjust to your additional wives (which Allah says is impossible).

  18. avatar Hassan says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 8:05 pm

    Mohammed Khafi: As I said, even if you don’t take the hadith as your source, historians will tell us that in Prophet Muhammad’s lifetime, and those of the sahabats, and the four rightly guided caliphs, polygamy is a common practice. It was never banned by any of them.

    If it is haram and prohibited, the Prophet (pbuh), the sahabats, or the four rightly guided caliphs would’ve banned polygamy a long time ago. But none of them ever did!

    How can you rationalize that phenomenon, Khafi? Why did those pious people let the practice continue without ever trying to stop it, if the conditions are indeed impossible for the ordinary man to comply with. Maybe because it is allowed?? That is the more logical answer and the easier conclusion.

  19. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 8:38 pm

    Hassan,

    As I said, even if you don’t take the hadith as your source, historians will tell us that in Prophet Muhammad’s lifetime, and those of the sahabats, and the four rightly guided caliphs, polygamy is a common practice. It was never banned by any of them.

    The four Rightly-Guided Caliphs, the immediate ruler-successors of Muhammad who functioned as caliphs, political and military leaders of the Muslim community, were responsible for the geographic expansion of the Islamic Empire and the spread of Islam through their conquest of the Byzantine and Sasanid (Persian) empires.

    This was a time of War, which would have resulted in Orphans and Widows, I am surprised I need to point this out to you Hassan. At least they had the excuse that they could meet two of the conditions.

  20. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 9:23 pm

    Quran made for all the life time till the end of time.
    So its non sense that verses only valid that time.

  21. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 12th, 2007 at 9:50 pm

    1ndra,

    You are very seriously wrong on that point, many verses can only be interpreted or understood if in the correct context of time and place.

    Injunctions of Fighting before the Battle of Badr

    Verses 190-194, Surah Al-Baqarah (Chapter 2)

    Try the link above for an example. You should be remember that many revelations in Al Quran came down to provide guidance to Prophet Muhammad on what was confronting him at that time. Therefore, it is important to understand and know the historic context of the revelations for a proper understanding of the verses, these after all are what exegesis are based on.

  22. avatar Peter says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 5:20 am

    Saya senang karena kita mampu berbicara tentang ini, dan tidak bertangan.

    (Bahasa saya tidak bagus sekali, jadi maafkan saya.)

  23. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 4:18 pm

    Let the history as the history, but the poligamy arent.
    Time of war…well, let see in the future will be there 3r WW. :)
    Now count yourself, Iraqi wars, Palestine wars,…

  24. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 4:57 pm

    Yes of course 1ndra, and all the widows and orphans from Iraq, Palestine etc are here in Indonesia just looking for husbands and guardians aren’t they? Your’e not married yet are you? ;-)

    Islam needs to be a dynamic religion as it was in the time of The Prophet 1ndra.

    Take for instance the verses related to slavery. Using your logic, as there is no injunction against slavery in Al Quran I assume that you therefore consider slavery justifiable. There can be, and are, differences on what is just and what is not, or what constitutes equality and in what sense. And what it means to be compassionate. For example is it enough to treat a slave in a just manner or is it necessary to emancipate a slave for meeting the requirement of justice?

  25. avatar Fanglong says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 5:11 pm

    Little lengthy subject… Must really be troubling for some… Bertentangan dengan jaman ? Might also be a problem ! Transcendantal sources of morals can be shared only by believers. The rest is imposed. Enjoy freedom, my friends, & help others enjoy it !

  26. avatar 1ndra says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 6:40 pm

    Thanks MK, I’ve got your point :)

  27. avatar Mohammed Khafi says:
    January 13th, 2007 at 7:29 pm

    Hi 1ndra,

    If you are really interested, and I am sure you are, this link to The University of Southern California Compendium of Muslim Texts is a very good reference. The link is to Chapter Introductions to Al Quran, just follow the other links for more fantastic information and also translations of Al Quran.

  28. avatar Anna says:
    January 23rd, 2007 at 10:13 am

    INDRA.

    I agree with all your article, and I think we need to take that really seriously, because this day some marriage start falling a part, because one the partner having an affair. They don’t have enough communications, and that’s is very important in marriage. Just like in Utah, US they allow the man to have more than one wife, I think that’s nice, I mean they can make each other happy.

  29. avatar John Thomas says:
    March 24th, 2007 at 9:32 pm

    Saudi has strict laws yes even draconian laws of censorship, and outside the USA and Japan, the easiest access to porn internally.

    The purity police, the most detested and ignorant fundamentalists you will ever have the misfortune to meet (who drove a class of school girls back into a burning school at gunpoint to die because they could not reach their headscarves and veils) say porn perverts women and arouses their desires – but leaves honourable Saudi men untouched, which is why big strong hulking Saudi men are raped repeatedly by frail and fragile Indonesian Muslim virgins who attack them in the Indonesian maid’s bedroom while the Saudi wife sleeps.

  30. avatar iamisaid says:
    October 1st, 2007 at 10:06 pm

    Actually, to ban or not to ban internet access to porn sites in Indonesia does not assure that Indonesian minors will grow to become God-fearing and good citizens.

    Even without the mention of this article’s title, there are numerous other avenues for sexual preoccupation and the search for gratification in Indonesia. It is the same with any other nation in this globe.

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